You don’t have to hire someone with a long term contract now…you could hire Evason for example to be the interim coach for the remainder of the season and then do a full search over the summer and give him a chance to compete for that job…there’s only so many NHL coaching gigs…many guys who want that job would jump at the chance
Speculation: Penguins off day talk thread: Yes, Sully is still the coach
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DesertedPenguin
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Why would Evason, Woodcroft, etc. accept a job for five months when they could wait until April-May and have the opportunity to interview for full-time jobs complete with secure contracts?
They'd have the chance to interview with multiple teams by waiting.
Sidney the Kidney
One last time
- Jun 29, 2009
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And if another struggling team fires their coach and hires one or more of the guys you mentioned then the excuse for not firing Sullivan will be "well all the good ones are gone, so lets wait until next season to see who becomes available".
This "waiting until the perfect time" is nonsense. Sullivan is failing. He's been failing for 5 years now. Waiting for the perfect candidate or the perfect situation is just another way to keep Sullivan around forever with the same excuses of why NOW isn't the time to fire him, over and over again.
Hey, it’s just like the trade deadline. I keep refreshing for to see who we got. Oh, the staff is still here? I’ll check back in 15.
DesertedPenguin
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Those guys are all under contract. It's pretty rare for teams to allow interviews with coaches under contract during midseason. The Rangers did it with Knoblauch, but that was a rare circumstance.
If Dubas can get permission to talk to one of those guys now, great, do it.
But it's far more likely he won't be able to until the off-season, at which point its just offering a more competitive contract.
DesertedPenguin
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Just to underline this:
Since 2015-16, when the Penguins promoted Sullivan to replace Mike Johnston, there have been 35 other midseason head coach replacements in the NHL.
Of those 35 changes:
- 24 have been internal replacements - an assistant taking over, the team's AHL coach taking over like Sullivan did, or a front office executive taking over.
- 11 of those were previously unemployed - John Hynes taking over in Minnesota, for example, after starting the season unemployed.
- 1 has been hired from an active job with another organization. Kris Knoblauch in Edmonton is an outlier.
The best candidate pools are always in the offseason. Always.
If the Pens fire Sullivan, be prepared for Mike Vellucci as interim head coach or someone unemployed like Boudreau. And the unemployed guys are going to want security, so they're going to want at least a 3-year deal. Which means the Pens are now out of the candidate pool in the offseason.
Since 2015-16, when the Penguins promoted Sullivan to replace Mike Johnston, there have been 35 other midseason head coach replacements in the NHL.
Of those 35 changes:
- 24 have been internal replacements - an assistant taking over, the team's AHL coach taking over like Sullivan did, or a front office executive taking over.
- 11 of those were previously unemployed - John Hynes taking over in Minnesota, for example, after starting the season unemployed.
- 1 has been hired from an active job with another organization. Kris Knoblauch in Edmonton is an outlier.
The best candidate pools are always in the offseason. Always.
If the Pens fire Sullivan, be prepared for Mike Vellucci as interim head coach or someone unemployed like Boudreau. And the unemployed guys are going to want security, so they're going to want at least a 3-year deal. Which means the Pens are now out of the candidate pool in the offseason.
They may not get any jobs and if they help turn around the Pens, it may make them more desirable and could also lead to a multi year contract…as I said, there’s only 32 of these jobs
DesertedPenguin
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The only unemployed coach who has accepted just an interim position since 2015-16 is Willie Desjardins. Every other outside coach has been hired to a multi-year contract.
Randy Butternubs
FDJT
Are you cool with Sullivan staying as coach?
Rave7215
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- Mar 12, 2010
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It's DesertedPenguin, the boards biggest and notorious Sullivan defender. Of course he is, that's why he's been putting so much effort defending against a short term change.
Sounds like me during Hot Stove every winter. I'm such a moron.
I know they're not going to sign anyone until just the scrap heap is left. Yet I just keep hitting refresh.
SomeDude
Registered User
Here is the problem with an interim coach. If you give them the interim tag because you know you do not want to give them the job and are only giving it to them to get the other guy out, what happens when there is a likely bump to the team from having a new coach? Then the new guy is seen as being successful and there is pressure to give him the full time gig. Unless it's someone already in the organization like when CP and Eddie Johnston would come down and coach, it can create an unwanted issue.
DesertedPenguin
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I am willing to give him until the end of the season if he's willing to replace Reirden and make other systemic changes.
If he's unwilling to do that, he's gone and I guess I promote Vellucci as interim.
I DO NOT want Vellucci long term and I don't want any of the retreads available. I could maybe accept Woodcroft, but I'm skeptical of him.
Basically, I really want either Sturm or Halpern as the next head coach, and you likely need to wait until the spring to do that. I am fine with doing that as long as Reirden is fired.
I think it’s a good issue to have if the interim coach is successful…you might shell out more money to keep him than you otherwise might, but FSG has deep pockets
Big Friggin Dummy
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- Feb 22, 2019
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I'm fine with six years of steep and steady decline, but I draw the line at seven years. 
C'mon DP. You could send all these loser coaches packing, ride with an interim (JD Forrest seems to be shit but whatever, it's all shit) and look for the coach of the future this spring/summer.
C'mon DP. You could send all these loser coaches packing, ride with an interim (JD Forrest seems to be shit but whatever, it's all shit) and look for the coach of the future this spring/summer.
SomeDude
Registered User
The problem is it's a guy you didn't want to commit to long term and likely has only looked good because the team got a boost from having their long time coach fired. So if you just give them the job and you were right that they were not the right guy for the job long term, you're screwed doubly.
I don’t get the problem: just because he’s successful if he’s not the guy you wanted to go after long term, then don’t resign him…Deserted Penguin has a more compelling argument, that maybe the guy you want to be interim head coach won’t take the job without a long term deal, but it’s worth a shot to ask a few guys, maybe someone who’s close with Dubas and would take that interim deal hoping for better things down the road
SomeDude
Registered User
I'm saying a lot of bad coaches have been hired after an interim tag because there is pressure to keep them after a team responds to a coaching change.
SomeDude
Registered User
I guess I'm not explaining this how it's in my head.
Most teams will have a positive response to a coach being fired. No matter who they are replaced with. Replace Mike Sullivan with Mike Johnston and you actually would probably see the team playing better for awhile while the adrenaline is kicking from a big change.
So, if you bring in a coach on an interim basis because you want to hire someone better in the summer, then you risk making the stupid decision of keeping the interim coach you didn't really want in the first place because the team temporarily played well, but will still suck in the long term with this coach who was only supposed to be here temporarily while the guy(s) you really wanted go elsewhere.
Instead, just wait until your guy is available and give him the job. That's the only reason I can see why Sullivan is still around. If you want to give Vallucci the interim tag, sure I guess even though the staff should be scorch earthed fired, but don't bring in someone from the outside unless he's your guy.
That's my last effort. If it still doesn't make sense/is stupid. So be it. I'm not dying on this hill.
Big Friggin Dummy
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- Feb 22, 2019
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At least Ovechkin sucks and he's never getting Gretzky's record. Small victories.
Small victories.
SomeDude
Registered User
The NHL will allow players to play on mobility scooters if that's what it takes.At least Ovechkin sucks and he's never getting Gretzky's record.
AuroraBorealis
Back-to-back hater
There's nothing wrong with Boudreau other than playoff record, and that honestly doesn't really concern us. We're not winning a series with any coach. We're unlikely to make it with anyone we employ too, but I'd at least like Dubas to try.
Doesn't have to be Evason if not Bruce. Woodcroft is available. I think he has good potential. Edmonton was solid last year.
I don't see the point of waiting 'til 2024-25 based on a guess that a coach will be better than these 2. The sand in the hourglass is already practically gone. Our core are ancient. At least they're healthy this year. That might not be the case next year.
pistolpete11
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DesertedPenguin
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Guys like Sturm and Halpern would be coaches who I want around during the transition period, too. They're smart and well-regarded.
Hire the best candidate, not just who is within easy reach.
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