Player Discussion: Patrik Laine IVever: a new hope? (Laine out of PAP, trade request still stands)

[Xoggz22]

Well.... with the Necas signing (2 years @ $6.5AAV) that means one of two things:

1) Any chance moving Laine to Carolina just died, or...
2) We have the framework of a Necas for Laine swap (plus/minus stuff to make it a level deal)

Personally, based on the way it appears the roster is moving (as in... doesn't appear there will be space without moving existing contracts), I think Laine goes somewhere for either D help or futures. I think this one is dead.

 

[Marioesque]

Well.... with the Necas signing (2 years @ $6.5AAV) that means one of two things:

1) Any chance moving Laine to Carolina just died, or...
2) We have the framework of a Necas for Laine swap (plus/minus stuff to make it a level deal)

Personally, based on the way it appears the roster is moving (as in... doesn't appear there will be space without moving existing contracts), I think Laine goes somewhere for either D help or futures. I think this one is dead.

I would not be shocked if 2

 

[NotWendell]

Well.... with the Necas signing (2 years @ $6.5AAV) that means one of two things:

1) Any chance moving Laine to Carolina just died, or...
2) We have the framework of a Necas for Laine swap (plus/minus stuff to make it a level deal)

Personally, based on the way it appears the roster is moving (as in... doesn't appear there will be space without moving existing contracts), I think Laine goes somewhere for either D help or futures. I think this one is dead.

Sign and trade? CBJ cover the difference in salary.

 

[VT]

Well.... with the Necas signing (2 years @ $6.5AAV) that means one of two things:

1) Any chance moving Laine to Carolina just died, or...
2) We have the framework of a Necas for Laine swap (plus/minus stuff to make it a level deal)

Personally, based on the way it appears the roster is moving (as in... doesn't appear there will be space without moving existing contracts), I think Laine goes somewhere for either D help or futures. I think this one is dead.

It seems to me that Necas has changed his mind. Although I can't imagine him in the second line. He is not so good without quality teammates because one is not a leader, only complementary player. The problem is that Nadeau is too young, he needs to get used to men's hockey, Drury, Kotkaniemi and Roslovic are third line players now (talk about contender). But he has good value, can be used to get a defenseman that Carolina is missing. Somehow I can't see the Stanley Cup contender with Burns and Orlov on defense.

 

[tunnelvision]

Edit: What do you guys think a deal would look like around one of those guys?

This is usually where any interesting and fruitful conversation about potential Laine trade ends. Whatever proposal I could create would be responded with comments from other fans who are certain Laine's value is much lower or higher than what I'm suggesting, and that the trade wouldn't make sense for Jackets and/or Ducks. It makes you wonder if anyone around here (or on HFDucks and trade board) can give an educated guess on how GMs value Laine.

Ok I'm trying to think about this from a different angle. What kind of commitment and production would you want to see from Laine for the last two years of his contract to justify a one-for-one type deal for Lacombe or Hinds?

 

[GoJackets1]

Lord have mercy on my soul and get a Laine trade done. I can’t take this topic anymore. Even if it’s 1 for 1 for Jeff Carter, I don’t care. Just please get it done.

 

[jonu]

Lord have mercy on my soul and get a Laine trade done. I can’t take this topic anymore. Even if it’s 1 for 1 for Jeff Carter, I don’t care. Just please get it done.

Instead of wishing harm for the team with the corpse of Jeff Carter, just do this

 

[koteka]

It seems to me that Necas has changed his mind.

It sort of reminds me of Debrusk. They have kicked it down the road a few seasons. He is on a good team with Cup hopes. He’ll get his shot in a couple of years as a UFA where he controls his future and still have some prime years ahead of him.

 

[Gliff]

This is usually where any interesting and fruitful conversation about potential Laine trade ends. Whatever proposal I could create would be responded with comments from other fans who are certain Laine's value is much lower or higher than what I'm suggesting, and that the trade wouldn't make sense for Jackets and/or Ducks. It makes you wonder if anyone around here (or on HFDucks and trade board) can give an educated guess on how GMs value Laine.

Ok I'm trying to think about this from a different angle. What kind of commitment and production would you want to see from Laine for the last two years of his contract to justify a one-for-one type deal for Lacombe or Hinds?

I totally get it lol. I feel the same way and wouldnt want to offend, especially coming to your board.

Well thanks for answering my questions. Good luck!

 

[CBJWerenski8]

Waddell has since made some calls of his own, but he isn’t confident that Laine's ability to speak with opposing GMs will spark a trade quickly.

“At this time of the year, people are less responsive,” Waddell said. “So, I don’t really know. I think it’s going to play out for a while. That’s partly because it may take some time for Laine and his agent, Andy Scott, to meet with a team wishing to speak with them about the forward’s situation. It’s also related to opposing teams wanting the Blue Jackets to pick up too large of a percentage in Laine’s remaining salary, which costs $8.7 million against the NHL salary cap for two more seasons.That’s why he’s prepared for an unknown waiting period that could stretch into August or September, when training camp opens. There’s also a chance Laine starts next season with the Blue Jackets while attempting to prove he’s still an impact player. Should his trade value get a boost that way, a more agreeable deal for the Blue Jackets could be easier to complete.“We might end up eating some money,” Waddell said. “If I wanted to eat half, I could’ve traded him by now, but that’s not my first choice.”

https://x.com/i/web/status/1818689900041867519

Now going forward until told otherwise I am factoring Laine into my lines. I think he starts here

 

[CBJx614]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1818689900041867519

Now going forward until told otherwise I am factoring Laine into my lines. I think he starts here

Same.

 

[EspenK]

So...if Laine stays with the Jackets how do you think it impacts him and the team?

Will his presence impact the development of the young wingers?

The longer he stays the better or the quicker he goes the best?

Lots of questions still to be resolved.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

So...if Laine stays with the Jackets how do you think it impacts him and the team?

Will his presence impact the development of the young wingers?

The longer he stays the better or the quicker he goes the best?

Lots of questions still to be resolved.

Laine wanted out in Winnipeg and still showed up to work and did his job. His media stuff was a bit of a circus with his comments, but that’s just him. I don’t see it playing out any differently here .

 

[Marioesque]

Laine wanted out in Winnipeg and still showed up to work and did his job. His media stuff was a bit of a circus with his comments, but that’s just him. I don’t see it playing out any differently here .

He's a professional, he'll show up and play his best. He dominated his last game with Jets

 

[VT]

So...if Laine stays with the Jackets how do you think it impacts him and the team?

Will his presence impact the development of the young wingers?

The longer he stays the better or the quicker he goes the best?

Lots of questions still to be resolved.

Everything would be fine. There would be three equal lines, which would keep the team at high pace. Fantilli getting used to playing center in nominally the third (actually 1C, since there would be 1A, 1B, and 1C), Johnson would get progressively more time. Oh, and we'd have a better chance to play in the PO. Just solve the goalie issue, either through a radical improvement Elvis' play/Tarasov's or Graves' play/trade.

 

[ThirdPeriodTurtle]

“We might end up eating some money,” Waddell said. “If I wanted to eat half, I could’ve traded him by now, but that’s not my first choice.”

I was scratching my head a little bit (ignoring the "ownership is cheap" line of thinking) and then started thinking that maybe we don't want to retain because we already have two retention slots taken (Wennberg and Boqvist, both running for exactly two more seasons). So we only have one more slot left right now.

Could it simply be that Waddell wants a non-retained trade so that he can keep a retention slot open for a possible Merzlikins buyout after this year? Would make a lot of sense at least. Laine has some value (from future considerations to something++) so Waddell probably feels he can make something happen easier than e.g. Elvis if Elvis's play doesn't improve this season.

That would apply to all retention though, doesn't matter if it's 1% of 50%...

 

[CoachWithNoTeam]

I was scratching my head a little bit (ignoring the "ownership is cheap" line of thinking) and then started thinking that maybe we don't want to retain because we already have two retention slots taken (Wennberg and Boqvist, both running for exactly two more seasons). So we only have one more slot left right now.

Could it simply be that Waddell wants a non-retained trade so that he can keep a retention slot open for a possible Merzlikins buyout after this year? Would make a lot of sense at least. Laine has some value (from future considerations to something++) so Waddell probably feels he can make something happen easier than e.g. Elvis if Elvis's play doesn't improve this season.

That would apply to all retention though, doesn't matter if it's 1% of 50%...

We still can retain 3. Wennberg and Boqvist are just dead money, not retained salary transactions.

 

[ThirdPeriodTurtle]

We still can retain 3. Wennberg and Boqvist are just dead money, not retained salary transactions.

Aah that appears right, thanks for correcting. Looks like you can buyout two players after each season and it's not counted in the retention slots.

I got confused by PuckPedia listing it as "2 Buyouts/Retained" for CBJ and thought they were counted towards the same slots.

So much for that theory then.

 

[majormajor]

So...if Laine stays with the Jackets how do you think it impacts him and the team?

Will his presence impact the development of the young wingers?

The longer he stays the better or the quicker he goes the best?

Lots of questions still to be resolved.

Laine will be a good pro and do his best.

Flip a coin, he'll either be our best player or one of our worst. Or injured. He's been injured in the first game of the year two or three times before.

Waddell and Evason will be more interested in getting to the next stage and giving those minutes to Fantilli, Chinakhov, etc... In general, the quicker we move on the better, but it's also very possible that Laine starts out hot.

 

[DoingItCoolKiwi]

Laine will be a good pro and do his best.

Yeah, it was the same in wpg. Didn't get the trade he asked for during the offseason. Came back looking great in camp, played one real good game and got traded

 

[koteka]

Or injured. He's been injured in the first game of the year two or three times before.

I was wondering if they will just hold him out because of this. Someone major will get injured in the first month of the season and then the team will have the cap space for a retained Laine. Injured again Laine will have negative trade value. Is it worth the risk of playing him?

 

[Monk]

Is it worth the risk of playing him?

Easy yes for me, so he has a chance to elevate his value from what I have to assume is an all-time low.

 

[NotCommitted]

I was wondering if they will just hold him out because of this. Someone major will get injured in the first month of the season and then the team will have the cap space for a retained Laine. Injured again Laine will have negative trade value. Is it worth the risk of playing him?

Of course it is, it's not even a question. I mean imagine the difference in trade value comparing end of 22-23 to now - back then he had two very good seasons in a row. Sure, he was injured a lot, but at least he was good and mostly consistent in the games he played. Now he's coming off a season with 18 games riddled with injuries and then missed the rest of the year in PAP. What kind of message would it send if they sit him out, what does THAT do to his trade value?

 

[koteka]

What kind of message would it send if they sit him out, what does THAT do to his trade value?

Here are the possible scenarios:

1) He plays really well. Trade value goes up.
2) He plays just ok. Trade value stays about the same.
3) We hold him out saying we are trading him. Trade value stays about the same.
4) He gets injured. Trade value drops.
5) He plays badly. Trade value drops.

 

[ThirdPeriodTurtle]

Here are the possible scenarios:

1) He plays really well. Trade value goes up.
2) He plays just ok. Trade value stays about the same.
3) We hold him out saying we are trading him. Trade value stays about the same.
4) He gets injured. Trade value drops.
5) He plays badly. Trade value drops.

This is really the same question of "how much value does Laine have"; if he has a very low value in somebody's eyes (future considerations+), then options 1 & 2 are much better than 3-5. If his value at the moment is high (1st or whatever these higher suggestions have been on the boards lately), then options 1 & 2 are not really going to improve it much.

Personally I think Laine is not worth a whole lot of extra things without retention at the moment. So options 1 & 2 would have a better chance at improving the return, even if we account for the risk of 4 & 5. I believe he could and would play well/better than his current value, or at least make any of these intangible concerns ("quitting"/PAP) would go away. And if 4 or 5 happens, his value would not drop significantly from the current value (I don't think he would become a negative asset, or only very slightly). So I think the upside is bigger here.

If he's healthy and available, let's play him.