Pastrnak/Bergeron/Marchand vs Alfredsson/Spezza/Heatley

[PB37]

Alfredsson is a far better player than Marchand lol come on now. Alfie was a guy you could build a franchise around as your best player, Marchand has never at any point in his career even been the best player on his team.

That being said, Bergeron is better than Spezza.

Far better? Never been the best player on the Bruins? That's pretty ignorant of you to think that. Marchand was 1st or 2nd team All Star four times in a 5 year stretch. Alfredsson finished 2nd team once.

 

[Erik Alfredsson]

Far better? Never been the best player on the Bruins? That's pretty ignorant of you to think that. Marchand was 1st or 2nd team All Star four times in a 5 year stretch. Alfredsson finished 2nd team once.

I mean skill/talent wise no, he wasn't far better, but Alfredsson was a more important player. The team was built around Alfredsson, and he lead by example for his entire career. He simply had a more significant role on his team, but statistically speaking they were pretty similar.

 

[LuckyPierre]

Graphs below show Marchand in orange and Alfredsson in blue.

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I posted these a few years back, and they need updating for Marchand’s recent work over the past two years, but suffice it to say Alfredsson and Marchand are incredible comparables. Both peaked among the top wingers in the world, and got better with age.

I think the incredible comparisons don’t end there, as these two lines while different in makeup would be amazing to see head to head.

I think the one thing people forget was the challenge in containing a 6’3 prime Spezza and a 6’4 prime Heatley.

Boston’s line had the defensive edge, and would absolutely need it against those two if they hoped to contain them.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Alfreddsson 5 year window hes 3rd in pts and 8th in ppg

Marchands 5 year window hes 3rd in pts and 3rd in ppg

Alfredssons 10 year window hes 3rd in pts and 11th in ppg

Marchands the link you provided is redirecting to alfredssons 10 year window instead for some reason so cant view but you said hes 8th in pts and unsure on ppg

The alfredsson fan was pretending that alfreddson was:

1) A player you can build a cup winner around which is just stupidity. Him, Sundin, Modano etc were #2 guys, and not guys who could be the #1 for a cup with modano winning one on much better teams than the leafs and sens were in late 90s to mid 00s

2) That alfredsson fan said that Alfredsson was a far better player than Marchand when the 5 year windows you showed that they are close with edge to Marchand for higher ppg and played higher end talent.

It was plain delusion on the levek of player a guy like Alfredsson was.

There are wingers fron the 90s to 00s that outclass marchand by a lot sure, Alfredsson isnt one of them

No matter how delusional you are, they have similar numbers and impact to their teams. Enough said.

You’re just trolling now, with the double digit posts.

 

[PB37]

I mean skill/talent wise no, he wasn't far better, but Alfredsson was a more important player. The team was built around Alfredsson, and he lead by example for his entire career. He simply had a more significant role on his team, but statistically speaking they were pretty similar.

Yeah, that's still wrong and now you're even starting to walk back on your argument after you've been presented some facts. Both are very close in career totals and importance to the team. You can make a strong case that Alfredsson was a better leader which is something Marchand had to grow into. But in terms of impact on the ice, there's no clear winner. Marchand has the distinction of being in the top 2 for end of the year voting for best winger in the game 4 out of 5 years with 2 years finishing 5th for the Hart; Alf has done that just once. Alfredsson is in the HOF but Marchand is clearly on a trajectory there. Both were elite two way wingers who received Selke votes in their primes. To proclaim one or the other as a far better player ( or which is it now, importance? ) is foolish and lacks perspective.

 

[Erik Alfredsson]

Yeah, that's still wrong and now you're even starting to walk back on your argument after you've been presented some facts. Both are very close in career totals and importance to the team. You can make a strong case that Alfredsson was a better leader which is something Marchand had to grow into. But in terms of impact on the ice, there's no clear winner. Marchand has the distinction of being in the top 2 for end of the year voting for best winger in the game 4 out of 5 years with 2 years finishing 5th for the Hart; Alf has done that just once. Alfredsson is in the HOF but Marchand is clearly on a trajectory there. Both were elite two way wingers who received Selke votes in their primes. To proclaim one or the other as a far better player ( or which is it now, importance? ) is foolish and lacks perspective.

Award votes don't matter at all, Alfredsson was playing in one of the smallest markets in the league that nobody watches, Marchand plays on an O6 team and one of the biggest markets in the league. Nobody was watching Alfie, I'm sure if he was playing on Boston he would've been treated a lot better by the people placing those votes. The only guys who gave him his props were local Ottawa media, Sportsnet and TSN just wanted to bury him since he would always torch the Leafs on HNIC.

 

[Felidae]

Just to lay out their point, goal and award finishes...

Daniel Alfredsson

Points: 4, 7, 9
PPG: 3, 4, 9
Goals: 9, 9, 9
GPG: 7, 10

Hart record: 5, 13, 16, 16, 17
Selke record: 4, 10, 11, 15, 20


Brad Marchand

Points: 3, 5, 5, 6
PPG: 4, 5, 5, 6, 9
Goals: 4, 6, 6
GPG: 5, 6, 6, 9

Hart record: 5, 5, 7, 9, 11
Selke record: 9, 9, 10, 12, 12 16.


There's absolutely no denying the two players are close, and I hate to say it, but there's a strong argument for prime Marchand > Alfredsson. He comes out ahead in points, goals, PPG and award voting.

That being said, for overall career value I do think Alfredsson edges out Marchand. Alfredsson has a higher career PPG (0.93 > 0.90) despite playing in 217 more games. This is largely in part due to Alfredsson being more productive in his earlier years. Marchand was a career 50+ point player prior to 28, while Alfredsson already had, 60, 70 points and PPG seasons under his belt before the age of 28.

Alfredsson so far has also aged better, he was an 80+ point player as a 34 and 35 year old. Marchand has 2 67 points seasons the last 2 years. That doesn't even beat Alfredsson's 36 and 37 year old seasons (70+points) it's gonna be hard for Marchand to age as well, he's certainly not on track.

 

[Xspyrit]

Just to lay out their point, goal and award finishes...

Daniel Alfredsson

Points: 4, 7, 9
PPG: 3, 4, 9
Goals: 9, 9, 9
GPG: 7, 10

Hart record: 5, 13, 16, 16, 17
Selke record: 4, 10, 11, 15, 20


Brad Marchand

Points: 3, 5, 5, 6
PPG: 4, 5, 5, 6, 9
Goals: 4, 6, 6
GPG: 5, 6, 6, 9

Hart record: 5, 5, 7, 9, 11
Selke record: 9, 9, 10, 12, 12 16.


There's absolutely no denying the two players are close, and I hate to say it, but there's a strong argument for prime Marchand > Alfredsson. He comes out ahead in points, goals, PPG and award voting.

That being said, for overall career value I do think Alfredsson edges out Marchand. Alfredsson has a higher career PPG (0.93 > 0.90) despite playing in 217 more games. This is largely in part due to Alfredsson being more productive in his earlier years. Marchand was a career 50+ point player prior to 28, while Alfredsson already had, 60, 70 points and PPG seasons under his belt before the age of 28.

Alfredsson so far has also aged better, he was an 80+ point player as a 34 and 35 year old. Marchand has 2 67 points seasons the last 2 years. That doesn't even beat Alfredsson's 36 and 37 year old seasons (70+points) it's gonna be hard for Marchand to age as well, he's certainly not on track.

One important point that I didn't see (I haven't read the whole debate though) is that Alfredsson played the WHOLE DPE dead puck era (his WHOLE PRIME) so if you adjust points with Marchand's years, it makes a big difference

Alfredsson over Marchand career wise but it's not the question here.

The Sens line in 2005-06 and 2006-07 was better than the Boston line at any point but the poll results don't reflect that at all. However, in "longevity" it's the Bruins line easily

 

[CokenoPepsi]

Boston and not close.

 

[Slats432]

No dog in this fight, but it took me less than .5 seconds to say Bruins. Truly an elite line and although the Sens line is decent, that Bruins line is chef's kiss. And I can't stand Marchand.

 

[KrisLetAngry]

I picked the Sens line.

They had no business to get to the final. Shame that they only had 1 line and not much else.

 

[weaponomega]

Boston’s line is definitely better overall but the Sens line might be a bit better offensively

Not against that the Bruins line head to head. Bergeron would shut them down.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Not against that the Bruins line head to head. Bergeron would shut them down.

That’s hard to predict really, they got the nickname pizza line for a reason. Kept scoring enough goals every home game , everyone with a ticket to the game got a free slice of Pizza, to be used the next day at any Pizza Pizza. After first year they raised the # of goals for promotion, after second year, they canceled promotion, losing too much money.
Teams weren’t stopping that line then,

 

[tilly123123]

When did Pastrnak win a Cup?

Hhaha copium you know exactly what I’m talking about hahahahhhhahahahahhhhhah