Our whole powerplay coaching staff should be fired if Tavares is not playing the first unit

[Coachcorner]

S

The irony of this thread is that the decline in the leafs' PP happened when.....Tavares got here.


I might try to break down some stats on that at some point, actually.

Still sire, even though Mcdavid and Tavares both have slumps on the pp at some rare times, they should never gotten off the first unit in the first place. Keep on pushin with the weight you got. The best ones. You don't take Point off cause tampa can't score during the two week periods. Stats are stats. And best players and scorers is best players and scorers. Simmonds ain't tavares. Simmonds is a hard simmonds. It was not tavares fault the toronto powerplay STATS was not good. It was others fault and will be in the future. Keep the same powerplay line always the same, just like the other great, succesful teams do. br scotty bowman.

 

[zeke]

S

Still sire, even though Mcdavid and Tavares both have slumps on the pp at some rare times, they should never gotten off the first unit in the first place. Keep on pushin with the weight you got. The best ones. You don't take Point off cause tampa can't score during the two week periods. Stats are stats. And best players and scorers is best players and scorers. Simmonds ain't tavares. Simmonds is a hard simmonds. It was not tavares fault the toronto powerplay STATS was not good. It was others fault and will be in the future. Keep the same powerplay line always the same, just like the other great, succesful teams do. br scotty bowman.

in general I agree with you - I'm a guy who wants to stack the top unit and play the crap out of them.

that being said, it's hard to get around the fact that our PP was absolutlely dominant in 16-17 and 17-18, before tavares, and when we always split the PPs evenly.

 

[Aashir]

The irony of this thread is that the decline in the leafs' PP happened when.....Tavares got here.


I might try to break down some stats on that at some point, actually.

I’d actually be interested in seeing how our powerplay was pre and post Tavares. Seems like before we had two units in which Marner ran one and Matthews and nylander ran the other.

I wonder how much of Tavares and his arrival has impacted our pp as we replaced one of the most skilled players in front of the net in JVR and his role with Tavares/nylander/simmonds

 

[Marmoset]

Please correct me if I'm wrong. But ..... doesn't Sheldon Keefe ultimately make the big decisions regarding who is on which PP unit and for how long? I can see whichever assistant coach being responsible for some tactics, practice, even who is out when to some degree, but the longer term, bigger picture stuff is up to the head coach. If the head coach doesn't like what he sees on the PP he has the authority to change things. (And if he doesn't, to me that's a problem).

 

[zeke]

I’d actually be interested in seeing how our powerplay was pre and post Tavares. Seems like before we had two units in which Marner ran one and Matthews and nylander ran the other.

I wonder how much of Tavares and his arrival has impacted our pp as we replaced one of the most skilled players in front of the net in JVR and his role with Tavares/nylander/simmonds

i'll give it a try.

 

[Racer88]

Yes the whole coaching staff should be fired

 

[Mess]

I’d actually be interested in seeing how our powerplay was pre and post Tavares. Seems like before we had two units in which Marner ran one and Matthews and nylander ran the other.

I wonder how much of Tavares and his arrival has impacted our pp as we replaced one of the most skilled players in front of the net in JVR and his role with Tavares/nylander/simmonds

A Mike Babcock coached team, prior to Tavares was ranked #2 overall PP% in 2017-18 operating at 24.9 %, with the #2OA scoring offense.

A Sheldon Keefe coached team, with Tavares was ranked #16th OA in 2020-21 operating at 20%.

PS. The other specialty team has taken even a worse nose dive since then as Leafs PK% ended up #24th in the league last year, going from #10th in 2017-18.

 

[PromisedLand]

i have not followed any leafs news whats the pp unit even look like?

 

[Gabriel426]

I just don’t think the Leafs have enough offensive players to run split PP units like before.
I might be wrong due to memory, but before JT, the forwards we had on PP were AM-Willie, Kadri, Marner, Bozak, JVR, Leivo, Brown/Leo.
Where as now, it would be Willie, AM, Marner, JT, AF, Kase, Ritchie, Bunting and Spezza.

 

[ottomaddox]

in general I agree with you - I'm a guy who wants to stack the top unit and play the crap out of them.

that being said, it's hard to get around the fact that our PP was absolutlely dominant in 16-17 and 17-18, before tavares, and when we always split the PPs evenly.

I think TOR's powerplay misses JVR.

Come at me bro!

 

[IPS]

in general I agree with you - I'm a guy who wants to stack the top unit and play the crap out of them.

that being said, it's hard to get around the fact that our PP was absolutlely dominant in 16-17 and 17-18, before tavares, and when we always split the PPs evenly.

In 17/18 the hot PP was the Marner-Kadri-JVR-Bozak unit. The 2nd unit of Nylander-Matthews produced almost nothing.

 

[Coachcorner]

T

Please correct me if I'm wrong. But ..... doesn't Sheldon Keefe ultimately make the big decisions regarding who is on which PP unit and for how long? I can see whichever assistant coach being responsible for some tactics, practice, even who is out when to some degree, but the longer term, bigger picture stuff is up to the head coach. If the head coach doesn't like what he sees on the PP he has the authority to change things. (And if he doesn't, to me that's a problem).

hat's one of the nuclear reasons for the thread sire, definitely. Some other posters here in this thread (human beings) was wondering did malhotra even play the powerplay during the season? Answers would be nice to hear for surely. I think it was malhotra who had the responsibility and it was weird cause he ain't no pp guy neither. During his own career I mean. Not the best pp guy. Like Adam Oates was for example. But your question is the finest one, why didn't keefe take the big hand and change it all around? He, is the number uno kahuna. The big fish. The decider. You done stroke to the nuclear of things right here.

 

[Oscar Peterson]

The powerplay shouldn't be so hard to fix, run Matthews Marner Tavares Nylander Rielly/Sandin, cut out the mandatory double drop pass (seriously nothing is more infuriating to see as a viewer) and then have the guys skate more on the powerplay, less of these static passing plays. Marner is such a skilled player but when he's got the puck at the point everyone and their mother knows that he's trying to feed Matthews and he's not great at technically executing the really difficult passes like saucers, his playmaking is way better when the play is in motion and he's skating. If Marner can't make that change to his approach and then if we're going to split the units, I'd let Marner run his own unit away from Matthews, when he knows that he's the top dog on the ice he attacks the net more himself then dishes to any player who's open instead of the telegraphed pass to Matthews. But my first preference is just to stack the first unit and change the approach.

 

[IPS]

The root of the issue will always be Marner. The main issue with the coaching was not taking him off of the PP. They tried changing everything else (swapping out Rielly, stacking, balancing, etc.) but it all comes down to Marner not being able to shoot, or handle the puck, or make passes... And the problem only compiled on itself because the system was designed for him to have the puck all of the time and occupy a prime spot on the PP.

The good news for this year is that, as long as we can get Liljegren in the mix for the PP, there should be a ton of different looks we can use.

Marner has actually ran the most effective PP unit in the big 3 era (the unit I referenced in my post above).

His did excellent finding Kadri at the bumper spot for those tip-pass plays and was also excellent at directing the puck to JVR in front for deflections (who might have honestly been the best in the league at it).

It's actually Matthews that has yet to be on a super-dominant PP unit.

It also appears that Matthews and Marner seem to do better on the right boards on the PP. Mitch got moved to the left side to accommodate Matthews shooting threat and it worked for a bit to start last season but the PP went cold and never came back.

 

[Coachcorner]

A Mike Babcock coached team, prior to Tavares was ranked #2 overall in 2017-18 operating at 24.9 %, with the #2OA scoring offense.

A Sheldon Keefe coached team, with Tavares was ranked #16th OA in 2020-21 operating at 20%.

PS. The other specialty team has taken even a worse nose dive since then as Leafs PK% ended up #24th in the league last year, going from #10th in 2017-18.

Tavares to me, is the truest answer really. He is the answer like mcdavid, bergeron, point and others like crosby are in theirs. Answers should be played real hard and from the start.

 

[sparxx87]

in general I agree with you - I'm a guy who wants to stack the top unit and play the crap out of them.

that being said, it's hard to get around the fact that our PP was absolutlely dominant in 16-17 and 17-18, before tavares, and when we always split the PPs evenly.

How many PP goals did Kadri score in those two best years? Man, what a luxury he was scoring 30+ goals as the 2-3 centre playing net front on that top PP unit you rightfully called dominant.

Almost like trading away good players who add important value to the team without adequate replacement hurts the overall product.

 

[Marmoset]

The powerplay shouldn't be so hard to fix, run Matthews Marner Tavares Nylander Rielly/Sandin, cut out the mandatory double drop pass (seriously nothing is more infuriating to see as a viewer) and then have the guys skate more on the powerplay, less of these static passing plays. Marner is such a skilled player but when he's got the puck at the point everyone and their mother knows that he's trying to feed Matthews and he's not great at technically executing the really difficult passes like saucers, his playmaking is way better when the play is in motion and he's skating. If Marner can't make that change to his approach and then if we're going to split the units, I'd let Marner run his own unit away from Matthews, when he knows that he's the top dog on the ice he attacks the net more himself then dishes to any player who's open instead of the telegraphed pass to Matthews. But my first preference is just to stack the first unit and change the approach.

If nothing else, this one thing must change. It slows the PP to a crawl and gives the defence all day to get set up. Not to mention the 'infuriating' part for the viewer.

 

[Gary Nylund]

I don't care who is on the first PP, and who is on the second. I don't care if the first is stacked, or they are balanced. All I care about, is results, and after the hot start, we were atrocious last year. It actually takes a special coaching skill, to take such talented players, and completely neuter the power play. I agree, that is one area that absolutely needs fixing.

Savage! Hard to argue though, our PP was a disgrace.

I'm not so sure that the answer is simply "Marner". He's also been part of the PP when it's been very successful, yet predictable.

Noting, Marner was 7th in the league, in PPP/60 in 2019/20.

The idea that somehow he sucks, when he was fine before, seems, well wrong.

They might be utilizing him wrong, but Marner can't handle the puck or make passes? Really, is that serious?

I think Marner is an excellent puck handler and passer myself. That's why I've been saying for a long time now - why not try letting Marner QB the PP from behind the net, Gretzky style? I believe this setup plays to Marner's strengths (passing, puck handling, creativity) beautifully, it's not a setup teams are used to seeing and I think it could work very well for us. And also note that he'd never have to shoot himself unless a wrap around opportunity presented itself.

Please correct me if I'm wrong. But ..... doesn't Sheldon Keefe ultimately make the big decisions regarding who is on which PP unit and for how long? I can see whichever assistant coach being responsible for some tactics, practice, even who is out when to some degree, but the longer term, bigger picture stuff is up to the head coach. If the head coach doesn't like what he sees on the PP he has the authority to change things. (And if he doesn't, to me that's a problem).

100% true. Keefe is ultimately responsible for all coaching decisions. And Dubas is ultimately responsible for how the coach performs. And if the PP doesn't show massive improvement next season, at least one of the two should be replaced BEFORE the playoffs start.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

Da PP was a complete joke around league .. everyone I talked to thought it was decided by an imbecile .. whoever that was .. having both Mitch and Rielly in shooting spots is massively dumb as it allows teams to stop Matty easily as only shooting option .. both other guys shoot da puck like peewees .. going forward -- Willy on 1 side and Matty on other side .. keep Rielly up top because he is very fast and can stop breakways in event of blocked shots .. slide Mitch into corner/behind net and let him move around side to side and get creative .. JT as net front presence for tips and screens (he has best hands on team) assuming he agrees to take da beatings required .. keeps your top 5 on ice and gives team best chance to succeed .. for all our coaches this plan should have been figured out in 2 minutes .. then give them most of PP it not all when we need 1 bad .. KISS

 

[justashadowof]

Indeed. He's paid dearly to make an impact.

I know it's modern hockey but once you're investing $33M + into 3 forwards, those forwards have to do some serious heavy lifting. Especially in key situations and key games. They took the elite money, elite workload comes with elite money. They should be controlling the puck and not exhausting themselves into short PP shifts. I don't know what Ovechkin is up to these days but I definitely remember him be able to play most of a 2 minute power play, same with Jagr.

 

[Papi 4 Hart]

Put Matthews in the high slot/bumper. Marner behind the net (where he can't shoot). Tavares and Nylander on opposite sides as shooting threats and Sandin on the point.

Keep Marner off the half wall unless its a switch. That is where they always neutralize us by leaving him open to not shoot.

 

[Lightsol]

Yep. Marner has the 8th highest PP P/60 in the league since he entered the NHL in 2016-2017, and he has excelled with multiple different units. The idea that he's a problem on the PP and needs to be taken off of it is hilariously wrong.

But it fits perfectly if your agenda is "EVERYTHING WRONG WITH THE LEAFS IS MARNER'S FAULT!"...

 

[IPS]

Da PP was a complete joke around league .. everyone I talked to thought it was decided by an imbecile .. whoever that was .. having both Mitch and Rielly in shooting spots is massively dumb as it allows teams to stop Matty easily as only shooting option .. both other guys shoot da puck like peewees .. going forward -- Willy on 1 side and Matty on other side .. keep Rielly up top because he is very fast and can stop breakways in event of blocked shots .. slide Mitch into corner/behind net and let him move around side to side and get creative .. JT as net front presence for tips and screens (he has best hands on team) assuming he agrees to take da beatings required .. keeps your top 5 on ice and gives team best chance to succeed .. for all our coaches this plan should have been figured out in 2 minutes .. then give them most of PP it not all when we need 1 bad .. KISS

They tried several configurations last year but not once did they take Marner off the wall. They took Matthews off the wall for awhile when it was clear he couldn't shoot because of his wrist. It seemed like they were absolutely adamant on having Marner in a spot where he could be a shooting threat too but it turned out hilarious because he finished the year with 0 PP goals.

 

[Curt]

How is it not obvious that marner running the power play with his muffin shot and trying to be the hero the whole power play not being the main problem? Get this selfish clown off the power play. Teams have figured him out

 

[Curt]

But it fits perfectly if your agenda is "EVERYTHING WRONG WITH THE LEAFS IS MARNER'S FAULT!"...

Lol at having to cherry pick the stats that far back. Now show his last 1.5 season. It’s been garbage. He’s figured out