Value of: Ottawa and San Jose (Not Karlsson)

[Vinny1983]

Haven't watched Duclair in some time but if the Sens are going to have to add something significant to this, I'd go for more of a bottom-6 oriented player as opposed to Duclair. Sens have enough guys who are offensively oriented and not enough shut-down 3rd liner types which I feel like we are desperately missing.

Tkachuk-Stutzle-Tarasenko
Giroux-Norris-Batherson
Kubalik-Pinto-xxx

If we can flip Joseph for an affordable defensive-oriented, hard forechecking 3rd line RW with control i would be very inclined to flip Joseph + one of our 1sts. Duclair doesn't fit the bill for me though.

How about
Joseph 3x2.9mil + 1st
For
Jake Evans 2x1.7 mil (maybe some retention?)+ 3rd (becomes a 4th if the Sens make the playoffs)

 

[Shocker]

Crypto Kiddo getting bodied in this thread, holy.

 

[PettersonHughes]

Really not sure there's a fit, San Jose should be adding assets so they aren't stuck in the basement, and Ottawa's pretty loaded on the wings already (Tkachuk - Giroux - Greig on LW, Tarasenko - Batherson - Kubalik on RW) so not sure they'd need to or would want to add another scoring winger.

 

[Riptide]

I dont see any difference with the Sharks and Sens. Two teams who won't sniff the playoffs next season.

Ottawa likely won't make the POs next season. That said, unlike San Jose, at least they had a chance at making them for most of last season, and only finished 6-7 point out (6 depending on how the ROW/tie breaker went). And they'll likely be in the same position this season.

I don't think anyone expects SJ to do anything but compete for the lottery again. So yes very big differences between the two teams - which is fine, given that Ottawa is at a very different place with their rebuild then SJ is. One has to do some serious mental gymnastics's to not see that.

 

[bert]

Again San Jose just acquired him…why trade him for a cap dump?

You couldn't have been more wrong on how San Jose got him and still didn't acknowledge that the sens would be adding. You're blowing this thread.

Ottawa likely won't make the POs next season. That said, unlike San Jose, at least they had a chance at making them for most of last season, and only finished 6-7 point out (6 depending on how the ROW/tie breaker went). And they'll likely be in the same position this season.

I don't think anyone expects SJ to do anything but compete for the lottery again. So yes very big differences between the two teams - which is fine, given that Ottawa is at a very different place with their rebuild then SJ is. One has to do some serious mental gymnastics's to not see that.

Ottawa got alot better and barely missed you don't know if they'll make it or not.

How about
Joseph 3x2.9mil + 1st
For
Jake Evans 2x1.7 mil (maybe some retention?)+ 3rd (becomes a 4th if the Sens make the playoffs)

No shot. Don't want Evans.

 

[bert]

So you are just a hater and have no interest in actually contributing to the conversation. Good to know.

Par for the course his content is horrible. Adds nothing.

 

[bert]

To unload Joseph snd his 3 years will cost 2 2nds For future considerations.



it’s not in the proposal but buried in fine print. I’m not reading the fine print.

You're not much of a reader as we have seen throughout this thread. Also saying things with such conviction like anointing what's it's going to take to trade Joseph without a single comparable then stating it as fact is very on brand. Arrogant and inaccurate.

 

[Djp]

You're not much of a reader as we have seen throughout this thread. Also saying things with such conviction like anointing what's it's going to take to trade Joseph without a single comparable then stating it as fact is very on brand. Arrogant and inaccurate.

Josh Bailey was traded to the blackhawks and added a 2nd. $5M cap. $3.5M actual salary owed. 1 year left.

Joseph has just under $9M cap over next 3 yrs with $9.3M in owed money.

he’s owed well over double in real money over 3 years

 

[2CHAINZ]

Crypto Kiddo getting bodied in this thread, holy.

He took his ball and went home.

 

[bert]

Josh Bailey was traded to the blackhawks and added a 2nd. $5M cap. $3.5M actual salary owed. 1 year left.

Joseph has just under $9M cap over next 3 yrs with $9.3M in owed money.

he’s owed well over double in real money over 3 years

Different players different situations smaller cap hit. One player is past their prime the other had an injury riddled season.

The sens really dont need to dump Joseph yet either. Even if they sign pinto they are less than 10% over the cap and we dont know what injuries they have. I have heard one player likely wont even be able to start the season. The entire premise of this thread isnt necessary to begin with at this point. But to see other teams fans salivating over it its interesting. People used to not care about the sens in general, guessing the perception has changed.

 

[jbeck5]

Ok, trade for, they ACCQUIRED him, it's the same thing. Do you think before you reply?

It's not the same thing.

Players get traded quickly consecutively fairly often.

My team alone has received players and gotten rid of them not too long after. Times 32 teams. It happens often.

You almost never see a UFA signing traded soon after.

Very very very different situations.

You realize most 3 way deals are actually 2 consecutive deals?

Like Ottawa acquired acquired a package with Nick shore from LA February 13th with no long term plans and then used him for 6 games then traded him to Calgary February 26th.

This is way more common than you realize. Especially for players that aren't top 6 F or top 4 D.

 

[TkachukNorris79]

I get wanting Duclair back, he was one of my favourite sens, but A) he brings offence and that's the last thing OTT needs right now and B) I can't see Dorion spending good assets on a player that he let leave for free just 3 years ago.

 

[Forgetful]

I get wanting Duclair back, he was one of my favourite sens, but A) he brings offence and that's the last thing OTT needs right now and B) I can't see Dorion spending good assets on a player that he let leave for free just 3 years ago.

Agree with A but on B, really? you can't see Dorion doing something like that? not even a little bit?

 

[2CHAINZ]

Agree with A but on B, really? you can't see Dorion doing something like that? not even a little bit?

Dorion only spends assets on useless players we can have for free.

 

[Riptide]

Ottawa got alot better and barely missed

Yes they did barely miss. However, how much better they got remains to be seen (even after acquiring JC they played 500 hockey). Unless a couple of key guys really step up (blueline/goaltending), I don't think they're quite there yet. Their top 9 looks really good. I'm just not sure that's enough. However if their goaltending can be decent to good, then who knows. All I know is that making the POs in today's game isn't easy. And it won't be easy for a young Ottawa team. But their time will come and it's going to be soon - there's too much promise there for it not to. What an exciting time for their fans - they deserve that.

 

[Qward]

I get wanting Duclair back, he was one of my favourite sens, but A) he brings offence and that's the last thing OTT needs right now and B) I can't see Dorion spending good assets on a player that he let leave for free just 3 years ago.

It's also about planning for the future. Losing Joseph frees up 3 mil next season and the season after. That is more room to sign Sanderson and Pinto and to acquire another piece that we end up needing.

 

[bert]

Yes they did barely miss. However, how much better they got remains to be seen (even after acquiring JC they played 500 hockey). Unless a couple of key guys really step up (blueline/goaltending), I don't think they're quite there yet. Their top 9 looks really good. I'm just not sure that's enough. However if their goaltending can be decent to good, then who knows. All I know is that making the POs in today's game isn't easy. And it won't be easy for a young Ottawa team. But their time will come and it's going to be soon - there's too much promise there for it not to. What an exciting time for their fans - they deserve that.

If they don't get destroyed by injuries to the same extent as last season the team is substantially better. Talbot was absolutely putrid or injured. D core.was ravaged they had Norris for 8 games and chychrun for 12. They get to start with the team from the get go. There's also a natural progression of the youth. All the top guys are starting to enter their prime or are reaching it. They were inconsistent which had alot to do with being a young team and not having much depth/reliable goaltending. All three of those weaknesses will improve barring catastrophic injuries. When they were good they were excellent. I am not saying there a lock or anything but they have shown flashes of being a team that can be reckoned with. Pinto, Stutzle, Tkachuk and Sanderson all have another level they can get to and they're already good players.

 

[GCK]

Yes they did barely miss. However, how much better they got remains to be seen (even after acquiring JC they played 500 hockey). Unless a couple of key guys really step up (blueline/goaltending), I don't think they're quite there yet. Their top 9 looks really good. I'm just not sure that's enough. However if their goaltending can be decent to good, then who knows. All I know is that making the POs in today's game isn't easy. And it won't be easy for a young Ottawa team. But their time will come and it's going to be soon - there's too much promise there for it not to. What an exciting time for their fans - they deserve that.

You nailed it. At some Point experience and talent will combine to make the Sens a contender. I’m not positive they make the playoffs this year but they are very close to being a very dangerous team. I truly believe in 2024/25 the Sens and Buffalo will be the class of the Atlantic.

 

[SweSensFan]

I get swaping Joseph for a cheaper bottom 6 player but not Duclair ffs. We need a player who actually can play defense!

Also I would not panic getting rid of Joseph until we know if players like Batherson, Norris, Chychrun will play at the start of the season..

 

[Gecklund]

I get swaping Joseph for a cheaper bottom 6 player but not Duclair ffs. We need a player who actually can play defense!

Also I would not panic getting rid of Joseph until we know if players like Batherson, Norris, Chychrun will play at the start of the season..

Duclair isn’t a bottom 6 player.

 

[SweSensFan]

We don't need another offense only guy on our top 6 anyway...

Duclair isn’t a bottom 6 player.

 

[Qward]

We don't need another offense only guy on our top 6 anyway...

We do if a certain player is not eligible to play...

 

[SweSensFan]

We do if a certain player is not eligible to play...

Would make more sense then yes but I still would prefer a player with a two-way game...

 

[TBF1972]

He took his ball and went home.

very slowly with the shorts stripped down to the ankles

 

[KevinRedkey]

You gotta think Dorion knows the truth about Batherson/Formenton and the Team Canada allegations. IF Batherson is guilty (I'm not suggesting anything), Dorion may just be waiting for a suspension to clear up money for Pinto. It's one of many possibilities, but it's an interesting angle IMO.

If that's the case, Kubalik probably slots in on the 2nd line with Norris and G.
I would hope the Sens sign Pinto to a longer bridge, and trade for a 3rd liner to help him out.