OT: OT-“Look, maybe I didn’t say every single little tiny syllable, no. But basically I said them, yeah.”

[TheMistyStranger]

I think one of the things that I hate the most about working in IT is when your boss doesn't understand at all what you do and gets bad information from other people, and then provides their own set of bad information in return. Having to correct upper management all the time is so draining

 

[Chainshot]

I think one of the things that I hate the most about working in IT is when your boss doesn't understand at all what you do and gets bad information from other people, and then provides their own set of bad information in return. Having to correct upper management all the time is so draining

I did that for a while.

At one point in the '00's, I was making a list of everything I wanted to get done in a day - the old "not urgent but important" that they always wanted everyone to work on (and we rarely could). And my manager, who was new to managing people, asked me what I did that day and I candidly said "not anything I wanted to". I got written up for that and a list of things where people had gone to her with complaints about me sticking to policy. Instead of backing me up, she backed over me. I therefore would bury her with information on what I was working on and for who, which she also didn't like, and told some of the remote site admins in our more affluent/profitable places that I was on the way out. THAT she didn't like because then management from the business side came at her wondering why their remote support person who was their support lifeline was being treated badly.

I'll say this for that manager, she had a talent. And it was cutting staff. People hated working for her and she actively made the workplace toxic to force people out. This in turn helped her bonus because there was a line-item in all the management annual goals to cut payroll. So... someone leaves, she piles more work on an already strained staff who manage to do the work while not filling the position and then cuts someone else because they had quota style reviews where SOMEONE had to be the lowest. It was insidious. I'm still not a fan of HR departments, they don't exist for the employees, they are there to cover the ass of the business and that's all.

 

[Chainshot]

A couple of weeks ago, my wife and I were talking with an older lady after church. We found out that she has the same birthday as myself (July 9th) and that she wouldn't make a cake for herself.

My youngest likes to bake and he's quite good at it. So, I bought him ingredients and he made a dozen cupcakes and we brought a couple to church and gave them to her last Sunday. She returned the container they were in and included a Thank You card and said that small things can make people feel so good.

I also had an interaction with a young gentleman that works at the Wegmans pharmacy where my kids get their prescriptions filled. There was a mess up with my youngest's ADD meds and he expected me to freak out on him about it. I didn't and he said he was shocked that I was taking it so well.

Both of these interactions recently remind me how easy it is to forget that being kind and decent to everyone is both easy and important.

Being decent or patient with someone seems minor and yet also seems to be frequently missing. Customer facing folks seem to be taking the brunt of it for sure.

 

[TheMistyStranger]

I did that for a while.

At one point in the '00's, I was making a list of everything I wanted to get done in a day - the old "not urgent but important" that they always wanted everyone to work on (and we rarely could). And my manager, who was new to managing people, asked me what I did that day and I candidly said "not anything I wanted to". I got written up for that and a list of things where people had gone to her with complaints about me sticking to policy. Instead of backing me up, she backed over me. I therefore would bury her with information on what I was working on and for who, which she also didn't like, and told some of the remote site admins in our more affluent/profitable places that I was on the way out. THAT she didn't like because then management from the business side came at her wondering why their remote support person who was their support lifeline was being treated badly.

I'll say this for that manager, she had a talent. And it was cutting staff. People hated working for her and she actively made the workplace toxic to force people out. This in turn helped her bonus because there was a line-item in all the management annual goals to cut payroll. So... someone leaves, she piles more work on an already strained staff who manage to do the work while not filling the position and then cuts someone else because they had quota style reviews where SOMEONE had to be the lowest. It was insidious. I'm still not a fan of HR departments, they don't exist for the employees, they are there to cover the ass of the business and that's all.

This started with me feeling empathetic and angry on your behalf, and ended with me wanting to vomit. Business bonuses for management/CEOs are always of the most repugnant variety, it seems.

 

[Chainshot]

This started with me feeling empathetic and angry on your behalf, and ended with me wanting to vomit. Business bonuses for management/CEOs are always of the most repugnant variety, it seems.

She tried to fire me multiple times. My dismissal may have actual been in part because of her. I discovered late in my employment that I also bear a resemblance to her husband and always thought I was a proxy for her anger at him. *shrug* She was a chemist who became a programmer and was terrible at leading people.

 

[TheMistyStranger]

She tried to fire me multiple times. My dismissal may have actual been in part because of her. I discovered late in my employment that I also bear a resemblance to her husband and always thought I was a proxy for her anger at him. *shrug* She was a chemist who became a programmer and was terrible at leading people.

I'm sorry you had that experience. Sounds like a recipe for disaster

 

[Chainshot]

I'm sorry you had that experience. Sounds like a recipe for disaster

There were others who posted here once upon a time who also had to deal with her. She oversaw one of them being downsized/RIF'd/fired/laid off too.

There are people out there who suck, sadly. Hope your situation takes a turn for the better.

 

[TheMistyStranger]

There were others who posted here once upon a time who also had to deal with her. She oversaw one of them being downsized/RIF'd/fired/laid off too.

There are people out there who suck, sadly. Hope your situation takes a turn for the better.

I try really hard to be an easygoing boss. When I took the job, my internal goal was to be an umbrella so that the network guys didn't have the shit from the top dump on them. I just didn't realize quite how much shit there would be.

 

[MarkusKetterer]

So I picked up three apartment renovations in my building (two apartments never got renovated before someone moved in and the other needs to be done before someone moves in just because there’s that much more to do [hasn’t been touched in 23 years]), but I’ve ran into problems. It’s really hard to do anything when I don’t have the materials to do anything. Of course every evening I’m getting asked what I’ve done, and getting in shit because I haven’t started yet. Maybe give your actual building superintendent shit, because he’s supposed to get me the things I need. Or fire him and make me it.

On the other hand, I’ve met a lady and we’re talking. We had our first date last night and things went well. So we’ll see how that works (also her apartment is one I have to renovate).

 

[Chainshot]

I try really hard to be an easygoing boss. When I took the job, my internal goal was to be an umbrella so that the network guys didn't have the shit from the top dump on them. I just didn't realize quite how much shit there would be.

I managed people in the '90's and early 2000's. I haven't since first by choice and now by opportunity. More power to you.

 

[sabremike]

Found my dream job:

 

[Mike McDermott]

Well my instincts were bang on and they ended my contract today. Gawd I hate interviewing.

Sorry to hear that.

I hear you on the hate for interviewing. Sadly I think I will be having to soon. My job put another check in the “reasons to look for a new job” column today and the “reasons to stay” column won’t be enough to keep me where I’m at much longer. At least I’ll be doing it on my terms, I feel for you having to do it in your circumstance.

 

[brian_griffin]

I think one of the things that I hate the most about working in IT is when your boss doesn't understand at all what you do and gets bad information from other people, and then provides their own set of bad information in return. Having to correct upper management all the time is so draining

It's not just an "opportunity" for those in IT.

I did that for a while.

At one point in the '00's, I was making a list of everything I wanted to get done in a day - the old "not urgent but important" that they always wanted everyone to work on (and we rarely could). And my manager, who was new to managing people, asked me what I did that day and I candidly said "not anything I wanted to". I got written up for that and a list of things where people had gone to her with complaints about me sticking to policy. Instead of backing me up, she backed over me. I therefore would bury her with information on what I was working on and for who, which she also didn't like, and told some of the remote site admins in our more affluent/profitable places that I was on the way out. THAT she didn't like because then management from the business side came at her wondering why their remote support person who was their support lifeline was being treated badly.

I'll say this for that manager, she had a talent. And it was cutting staff. People hated working for her and she actively made the workplace toxic to force people out. This in turn helped her bonus because there was a line-item in all the management annual goals to cut payroll. So... someone leaves, she piles more work on an already strained staff who manage to do the work while not filling the position and then cuts someone else because they had quota style reviews where SOMEONE had to be the lowest. It was insidious. I'm still not a fan of HR departments, they don't exist for the employees, they are there to cover the ass of the business and that's all.

HR depts don't exist for the employees or their supervisors. The only thing they exist for is compliance - external legal compliance and internal corporate systems compliance.

 

[Der Jaeger]

Leadership is a responsibility to your purpose and people. You have to be able to accomplish the first while taking care of the second. Neither comes first and must be done in unison.

You also have to develop leaders. I’ve never met a natural born leader. Show me one and I’ll show you what you’re mistaking for actual leadership. Leaders must be selected for raw skills required to be a leader, and then trained and evaluated.

It’s why a lot of the cottage industry which sprung up for corporate leadership uses military lessons. We don’t have executive fishing trips. You want to be the leader in the military? You better be ready to do more work than your people, give them all the credit, and take the bad for them.

I’m super demanding of my people. We do great work but I do not bend the standard. But I also let them go early when we aren’t doing anything, habitually put them up for monthly awards, and they end up with big bonuses.

 

[Dubi Doo]

At what point do you become the one to pull the band-aid off and get a separation? It honestly feels inevitable, but she's having trouble pulling the trigger. She's crying multiple times a week. She has resentment for how things have been handled in the past, though the sadness and guilt are the more prevalent feelings. Nothing I say or do really helps the situation anymore. If I try to be more loving and romantic- it's not genuine. If I try to tell her, we can work on things- she doesn't reassure me.

It's a mess, and I don't want to be the reason she's not happy. It's not fair to either of us. We've talked about our issues over and over again. We're both fearful of the next steps, but neither of us deserve to be in a relationship that's draining us.

There are things I do have to work on if I want longevity in a relationship. If we do separate- I'll have a ton of time to work on those things. I'd rather work on them within my current relationship, though, but it seems like that ship has sailed.

Oyee....Anybody have any advice about going through a separation? The good news is, it's not toxic. We're just overwhelmed with sadness.

 

[Jim Bob]

At what point do you become the one to pull the band-aid off and get a separation? It honestly feels inevitable, but she's having trouble pulling the trigger. She's crying multiple times a week. She has resentment for how things have been handled in the past, though the sadness and guilt are the more prevalent feelings. Nothing I say or do really helps the situation anymore. If I try to be more loving and romantic- it's not genuine. If I try to tell her, we can work on things- she doesn't reassure me.

It's a mess, and I don't want to be the reason she's not happy. It's not fair to either of us. We've talked about our issues over and over again. We're both fearful of the next steps, but neither of us deserve to be in a relationship that's draining us.

There are things I do have to work on if I want longevity in a relationship. If we do separate- I'll have a ton of time to work on those things. I'd rather work on them within my current relationship, though, but it seems like that ship has sailed.

Oyee....Anybody have any advice about going through a separation? The good news is, it's not toxic. We're just overwhelmed with sadness.

Sorry that things are tough.

My separation was not by my choice, so I cannot speak from experience other than to say that while some people can separate to work on things and then come back together, that does seem to be the rare case.

Ultimately, any relationship takes two people that are committed to doing the work to make the relationship healthy. If either person is unwilling or unable to put in that work, then a separation probably is for the best.

I would talk through it and plan things out though. Not handling the separation well can turn a non-toxic situation toxic quickly.

 

[brian_griffin]

At what point do you become the one to pull the band-aid off and get a separation? It honestly feels inevitable, but she's having trouble pulling the trigger. She's crying multiple times a week. She has resentment for how things have been handled in the past, though the sadness and guilt are the more prevalent feelings. Nothing I say or do really helps the situation anymore. If I try to be more loving and romantic- it's not genuine. If I try to tell her, we can work on things- she doesn't reassure me.

It's a mess, and I don't want to be the reason she's not happy. It's not fair to either of us. We've talked about our issues over and over again. We're both fearful of the next steps, but neither of us deserve to be in a relationship that's draining us.

There are things I do have to work on if I want longevity in a relationship. If we do separate- I'll have a ton of time to work on those things. I'd rather work on them within my current relationship, though, but it seems like that ship has sailed.

Oyee....Anybody have any advice about going through a separation? The good news is, it's not toxic. We're just overwhelmed with sadness.

You've posted concerns before, with greater detail, but I forget if you've answered / disclosed any of this (not asking you to publicly do so), you can think about it / research it / talk with a counselor with her or separately if you wish.

1. Have there been any medical / hormonal / stress changes for either or both of you, and/or family histories of depression?
2. Also, have you (she) had first child birth in past few years?
3. Money issues with concurrent onset of any of the above?
4. Family member with critical illness / death - even if they are "surviving".
(You can double-count answers - i.e., first or recent child birth resulting in an emergency hysterectomy therefore hormone changes and your wife now staying at home (either more, or for first time) and working less or not at all, and the household income drops by XX%, and you have a parent with a terminal diagnosis - you better believe that's tough to work through even if you two are united. Your body responds in ways your mind and emotions can't fully control.

And I'm not talking about sexual intimacy at all - rather how your total body system - physical, mental, emotional - is impacted by life stressors and/or hormonal changes.

The other thing is what do you want / need from your partner? Have you articulated those needs and what you each believe constitutes fulfilling those needs? - and hopefully you both truly want / need a partner. If you're ambivalent on that, in particular if you agree that you once had a great partnership but the need/want for that has changed, because you have changed then you need to work with a counselor on that, if you're both willing.

 

[Dubi Doo]

You've posted concerns before, with greater detail, but I forget if you've answered / disclosed any of this (not asking you to publicly do so), you can think about it / research it / talk with a counselor with her or separately if you wish.

1. Have there been any medical / hormonal / stress changes for either or both of you, and/or family histories of depression?
2. Also, have you (she) had first child birth in past few years?
3. Money issues with concurrent onset of any of the above?
4. Family member with critical illness / death - even if they are "surviving".
(You can double-count answers - i.e., first or recent child birth resulting in an emergency hysterectomy therefore hormone changes and your wife now staying at home (either more, or for first time) and working less or not at all, and the household income drops by XX%, and you have a parent with a terminal diagnosis - you better believe that's tough to work through even if you two are united. Your body responds in ways your mind and emotions can't fully control.

And I'm not talking about sexual intimacy at all - rather how your total body system - physical, mental, emotional - is impacted by life stressors and/or hormonal changes.

The other thing is what do you want / need from your partner? Have you articulated those needs and what you each believe constitutes fulfilling those needs? - and hopefully you both truly want / need a partner. If you're ambivalent on that, in particular if you agree that you once had a great partnership but the need/want for that has changed, because you have changed then you need to work with a counselor on that, if you're both willing.

1) She recently started taking meds for depression. A slight dose, but needed. Also, she was diagnosed with ADHD a year or so ago. Ive always dealt with mental stuff on my own, but it definitely played a role in where we're at today. Therapy may be good for me, but I also am afraid it'll screw me up even more.

She's also in nursing school, which has impacted the amount of time we have to hangout.

2) We have a son who is almost 5. We both acknowledge that has played a role in our current issues.

3) Money is fine.

4) Nothing too recent, but we've both lost all our remaining grandparents over the past 2 years.

Sexual intimacy is still there, but I think it's due to us feeling like we may lose the other at any moment, so that can draw some intense feelings of need in the moment.

The issue is with the bolded. She believes we love differently. I'm more independent, and rather than the helpless romantic type- I enjoy fun and adventures with my partner. The little things aren't all that important to me, either. She wants more romance and for me to listen to her concerns better. She also believes she may have ignored her true feelings for a while. Things were good for the first 6 or 7 years, but may not have been up to her standards of what she wants in a relationship.

We've been talking and talking and talking. Explaining to each other our needs. Her list is longer than mine, and she's come to the point that she believes we just love differently.

I want longevity in a relationship. I really have hardly any desire of being single, and I really enjoy being with her. I want to change, but given that Ive said I'll change in the past (become more romantic, do more of the little things for her, etc...) and havent- my words have become hollow.

As my man Willie Nelson once sang:
'Little things I should have said and done,
I just never took the time,
But you were always on my mind'

 

[Dubi Doo]

Sorry that things are tough.

My separation was not by my choice, so I cannot speak from experience other than to say that while some people can separate to work on things and then come back together, that does seem to be the rare case.

Ultimately, any relationship takes two people that are committed to doing the work to make the relationship healthy. If either person is unwilling or unable to put in that work, then a separation probably is for the best.

I would talk through it and plan things out though. Not handling the separation well can turn a non-toxic situation toxic quickly.

Yeah. We've talked about separation. 50/50 with the kid. Finances, lawyers, etc... It's civil for now. We don't want to get lawyers involved only for what they're needed for. Things can change, though, but Im heavily committed to making things go as smoothly as possible. She's the mother of my son, afterall. It's best for him if we can remain friends. I'll bite the bullet. Take a loss fincancially or in a dispute to be sure things smooth over. I may struggle as a husband, but there's nothing in this world more important to me than being a good father.

 

[TehDoak]

Lawd I really hate job searching.

I had a recruiter email me multiple times about a job. I go to book something on their calendar.

Finally calls me, asked if i could be local to NYC. I say no. Hangs up on me.

Just the absolute worst.

On the good news side, an old boss might have something for me, even would be local when I wanted it to be. Already interviewed with the boss and talking with two developers on Tuesday.

 

[Chainshot]

Leadership is a responsibility to your purpose and people. You have to be able to accomplish the first while taking care of the second. Neither comes first and must be done in unison.

You also have to develop leaders. I’ve never met a natural born leader. Show me one and I’ll show you what you’re mistaking for actual leadership. Leaders must be selected for raw skills required to be a leader, and then trained and evaluated.

It’s why a lot of the cottage industry which sprung up for corporate leadership uses military lessons. We don’t have executive fishing trips. You want to be the leader in the military? You better be ready to do more work than your people, give them all the credit, and take the bad for them.

I’m super demanding of my people. We do great work but I do not bend the standard. But I also let them go early when we aren’t doing anything, habitually put them up for monthly awards, and they end up with big bonuses.

When I was in charge of people, I always operated on the premise that there was no job I was unwilling to do.

Yeah. We've talked about separation. 50/50 with the kid. Finances, lawyers, etc... It's civil for now. We don't want to get lawyers involved only for what they're needed for. Things can change, though, but Im heavily committed to making things go as smoothly as possible. She's the mother of my son, afterall. It's best for him if we can remain friends. I'll bite the bullet. Take a loss fincancially or in a dispute to be sure things smooth over. I may struggle as a husband, but there's nothing in this world more important to me than being a good father.

My advice is to focus on the kid(s) and make it work. I am very much NOT my ex's friend, far from it in fact. Don't fall on the proverbial sword though without getting quality arbitration advice. I took an absolute beating in the divorce instead of lawyering up, trying to remain cordial, believing the lies about "remaining family", etc... and it did not work for me/us. My kids are more worried about my well-being now and that's not something I ever wanted as a father.

Also, perhaps look at the parts where you work on yourselves instead of trying to work on the marriage/partnership. It still may wind up in the dissolution of the marriage but trying to work JUST on the marriage is building on an unsound foundation.

 

[Jim Bob]

My advice is to focus on the kid(s) and make it work. I am very much NOT my ex's friend, far from it in fact. Don't fall on the proverbial sword though without getting quality arbitration advice. I took an absolute beating in the divorce instead of lawyering up, trying to remain cordial, believing the lies about "remaining family", etc... and it did not work for me/us. My kids are more worried about my well-being now and that's not something I ever wanted as a father.

Also, perhaps look at the parts where you work on yourselves instead of trying to work on the marriage/partnership. It still may wind up in the dissolution of the marriage but trying to work JUST on the marriage is building on an unsound foundation.

Yeah, I would describe my relationship with my ex-wife as a good business relationship as we co-parent our kids. She still has me blocked on Facebook, so not FB official friends. But, we get along a lot better than most divorced co-parents and we try and just keep the drama to a minimum.

If only our oldest kid and my ex-MIL lived that way.

And then there is my mom who can't not be weird around my dad who she divorced 48 years ago...

 

[Chainshot]

Yeah, I would describe my relationship with my ex-wife as a good business relationship as we co-parent our kids. She still has me blocked on Facebook, so not FB official friends. But, we get along a lot better than most divorced co-parents and we try and just keep the drama to a minimum.

I don't follow my ex on any of her socials - deleted all of them but Facebook and then put that on mute. I can tell when she's travelling, I will get a bunch of old post likes as she goes through my stuff. I say nothing about her there (or on IG for that matter). Here? Redacted.

If only our oldest kid and my ex-MIL lived that way.

Mine are great at being insular about everything. At least toward me and members of my extended family. *shrug*

And then there is my mom who can't not be weird around my dad who she divorced 48 years ago...

I doubt I will ever not want my ex to go f*** herself. I don't forgive that way.

 

[MarkusKetterer]

So I picked up three apartment renovations in my building (two apartments never got renovated before someone moved in and the other needs to be done before someone moves in just because there’s that much more to do [hasn’t been touched in 23 years]), but I’ve ran into problems. It’s really hard to do anything when I don’t have the materials to do anything. Of course every evening I’m getting asked what I’ve done, and getting in shit because I haven’t started yet. Maybe give your actual building superintendent shit, because he’s supposed to get me the things I need. Or fire him and make me it.

On the other hand, I’ve met a lady and we’re talking. We had our first date last night and things went well. So we’ll see how that works (also her apartment is one I have to renovate).

Update to this: I sarcastically said she should bring me home dinner from her job. And she did. Exactly what I jokingly said she should. What is this sorcery?!

 

[sabremike]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1813742291217215849