Post-Game Talk: Oilers lose late to Vegas

[K1984]

One of the surreal looks again last night which I can't wash out of my eyes is seeing Arvid yet again with his stick back floating around expecting a pass while Drai and Pods are mucking on boards for pucks. Its as if Arvid thinks he's Ovechkin. Yeah, sorry ARvid, you're here to be digging for pucks. Its hilarious this guy has one goal considering how much he's setting up and letting others do the work. He also taps his stick for a pass more than anybody I've seen. Pass, pass, pass, I'll score before Christmas.

Typically when your two line mates are working for pucks, you want to find open space for a shot if/when they win the battle. Except when it's a player on your hit list I guess.

Did you forget the surreal look of him being one of the sole players on the team driving to the net with any consistency last night?

 

[Drivesaitl]

Typically when your two line mates are working for pucks, you want to find open space for a shot if/when they win the battle. Except when it's a player on your hit list I guess.

Did you forget the surreal look of him being one of the sole players on the team driving to the net with any consistency last night?

Did you forget the player has one goal? Or your inane comment that he could score 6 games in a row and I wouldn't be happy? I'd be surprised with 6 goals by Christmas.

Arvid is butchering scoring chances. Countless scoring chances and taking almost the most shots on the team with a tidy 3% shooting %. Worse shooting % than Connor Brown. mic drop.

His only goal came on a wide open look at an empty net from 4ft away. he almost flubbed that one.

If Arvid finishes frigging anything including open net looks last night we probably win.

 

[CanadasTeam99]

It's not just those three guys, it's like everyone for like 15 years here.

RNH-Eberle was a reliable scoring combo even in dark years here, and then McDavid gets here and they suddenly can't produce together.

Like how?

Even in the one year they all played together, Hall + McDavid play like shit together, McDavid quickly gets hurt, then Hall + Draisaitl take off, so you're thinking "cool! So when McDavid is back we'll have two good offensive lines!". Nope. When McDavid comes back, Hall's scoring goes cold as ice and Chiarelli having shit for brains decides signing Lucic and trading Hall is the smart way to go.

Ryan Strome couldn't buy a goal here, goes elsewhere and carves out a decent niche. Athansiou looked terribad here. Evander Kane signs a contract here and then almost gets his arm chopped off in a game.

Like at this point I just think whoever we would have as "this is Leon's wingers!" just wouldn't work. No one has worked the entire McDavid era in that role aside from one stretch with RNH + Yamamoto, and they some how had zero chemistry ever again after one great stretch.

The only player we've added or even drafted into the top 6 who has just come in there and produced no problem and actually been a part of the team for any reasonable length of time is basically Zack Hyman and no one else. Maroon was essentially a 1 year boom, Lucic had nothing after 1 season, Evander Kane was great for a half season + playoffs and then a drop off to the point where he's often not in the top 6 at all. Everyone else ... just shit largely.

We somehow get so many players who are not strong enough, cannot protect pucks along the boards. JUst simple hockey things that help you keep the puck an extra second.

We have guys constantly stopping up at half walls and cycling the puck back to nobody or it goes to an Oiler who bumbles it or just gets knocked off of the puck

Their play 90% of the time is to just whip it back along the boards to the dmen. They might muffin it to the corner or hit the other team. 10% get it through like last night.

Not enough guys who just play simple hard hockey. Too much fairy perimeter sh**

Dont' even get me started on the massive simple defensive lapses

 

[K1984]

Did you forget the player has one goal? Or your inane comment that he could score 6 games in a row and I wouldn't be happy? I'd be surprised with 6 goals by Christmas.

Arvid is butchering scoring chances. Countless scoring chances and taking almost the most shots on the team with a tidy 3% shooting %.

His only goal came on a wide open look at an empty net from 4ft away. he almost flubbed that one.

If Arvid finishes frigging anything including open net looks last night we probably win.

Ditto for the rest of the roster than you aren't obsessing over.

 

[guymez]

Hes done some good things and we arguably SHOULD have guys who can do that in the top 6 already but so many guys are underperforming that he has been there out of necessity.

A guy like Podkolzin IS good for the top 6 he just doesn't have the scoring ability or high end level you'd want in a top 6 guy.

It's why this team honestly should have kept Holloway, he is Podkolzin with more skill and potentail.

Podkolzin isnt eye candy like Holloway but he just gets shit done.
He is a smarter defensive player than Holloway...much better positionally. He is also a better passer than Holloway.
The only thing he lacks (that Holloway has) is foot speed.
Fair to say that Holloway has better hands as well but thats really not saying much. Holloway had 9 goals in 89 regular season games with the Oilers.

Otherwise (based on a small sample size) I think Podkolzin brings different elements than Holloway. An argument could be made that he delivers more overall than Holloway...he is just more workman like in his approach.
Not as flashy.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Ditto for the rest of the roster than you aren't obsessing over.

You were the one that replied. Even though you don't have a reply in defending this production. Not everybody on this roster was specifically brought in and paid considerably to produce. The Oilers braintrust specifically went out and got this player to add to production.

feel free to staple a hater sign on my back even though Arvid finish deserves criticism. Again the 3-1 goal was on his or Pods sticks multiple times. Could be its even a bad thing for the best passer to have two guys that can't score into a barn at this point.

Worse shooting % than Connor Brown deserves a Charlie Brown award. At least with Podz we expected it to be the case.

 

[Brazen331]

As a VGK fan some of these responses read as being overly dramatic. It seems obvious to me that Hill stole this game: he plays well against Edmonton.

On a side subject, I dropped RNH from my fantasy team for Brett Howden and am wondering if that was a dumb decision?

Is he always going to middle that 3rd line? If so, it seems like you can only expect PP production from him.

 

[K1984]

You were the one that replied. Even though you don't have a reply in defending this production. Not everybody on this roster was specifically brought in and paid to produce.

feel free to staple a hater sign on my back even though Arvid finish deserves criticism. Again the 3-1 goal was on his or Pods sticks multiple times. Could be its even a bad thing for the best passer to have two guys that can't score into a barn at this point.

Worse shooting % than Connor Brown deserves a Charlie Brown award.

RNH, McDavid, Hyman, Bouchard, Henrique, Skinner aren't paid to produce?

All of the above have been dog shit this season. Arvidsson is the problem though. For sure.

 

[CupofOil]

I can accept that. I just think it's also not doing us any favors but yeah; ultimately, it's up to these bums on the ice.

It is and you're not wrong that the team needs to be more assertive, not necessarily hitting although that would be nice but more aggressive in the corners and getting to the hard areas of the ice.

I also think luck plays a part. The Oilers are just not getting bounces right now, that's something that will correct itself as well over time. It's inevitable that the offensive floodgates open up, this is hugely unsustainable the way they're scoring now.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Hes done some good things and we arguably SHOULD have guys who can do that in the top 6 already but so many guys are underperforming that he has been there out of necessity.

A guy like Podkolzin IS good for the top 6 he just doesn't have the scoring ability or high end level you'd want in a top 6 guy.

It's why this team honestly should have kept Holloway, he is Podkolzin with more skill and potentail.

Arvidsson is annoying because you can see why he WAS skilled and used to be an offensive threat. He is still doing the same things but 2 things have changed. He doesn't seem to be working in the areas he used to and is kind of looking for openings...which would be fine but his scoring ability seems gone. It's strange.
Skinner also seems worse than I expected too. He has flashes but its easy to see why his offensive dropped heavily last year.

Neither team were the least big concerned about losing these players. People didn't want to hear that and apparently still don't. It was another garbage offseason by the org.

Yeah, the players we lost all had more potential. They all are scoring more too.

RNH, McDavid, Hyman, Bouchard, Henrique, Skinner aren't paid to produce?

All of the above have been dog shit this season. Arvidsson is the problem though. For sure.

Never said he was the only problem. Thats you as per usual trying to insinuate what others are saying. Welcome to ignore.

btw lol at somebody blaming Hyman for lack of production. Guy is scoring every game. "You wouldn't be happy if he scored 6 games in a row" to quote your nature of posting.

 

[K1984]

It is and you're not wrong that the team needs to be more assertive, not necessarily hitting although that would be nice but more aggressive in the corners and getting to the hard areas of the ice.

Assertive play can be summed up by our opening shift in Nashville and Calgary.

Everyone on the ice has their head up, feet moving, and are making simple plays and overwhelming teams down low with high battle level. Doesn't necessarily have to be physical, but everyone is on their toes, doing the right thing, and are ready to work.

The early season versions of the Oilers only ever seem to be able to do this on the road though. At home we mope around the ice and hope goals will just go in with magic.

Neither team were the least big concerned about losing these players. People didn't want to hear that and apparently still don't. It was another garbage offseason by the org.

Yeah, the players we lost all had more potential. They all are scoring more too.


Never said he was the only problem. Thats you as per usual trying to insinuate what others are saying. Welcome to ignore.

Oh no!

 

[Behind Enemy Lines]

Though Knoblauch sticks to his line pairs with this extended, deep scoring malaise, I'd look to shake up the lines.

Specifically I'd switch the top six net front guys to see if they spark with new centres and drop RNH with Draisaitl as a distributor option to help this team's best shooter get more quality shot options. Move energy Pod to third line to fish pucks for shot/scoring options Henrique and Perry. Move Janmark and Brown to line 4 where they will be post-trade deadline and playoffs anyways.

Skinner - McDavid - Arvy
RNH - Draisaitl - Hyman
Podkolzen - Henrique - Perry
Janmark - Ryan - Brown

Problem area is still a defense that can't transition quickly and efficiently outside of Bouchard and Ekholm top pair. Oil look slow in part because their puck movement out of their zone is slow and uneven.

 

[K1984]

Though Knoblauch sticks to his line pairs with this extended, deep scoring malaise, I'd look to shake up the lines.

Specifically I'd switch the top six net front guys to see if they spark with new centres and drop RNH with Draisaitl as a distributor option to help this team's best shooter get more quality shot options. Move energy Pod to third line to fish pucks for shot/scoring options Henrique and Perry. Move Janmark and Brown to line 4 where they will be post-trade deadline and playoffs anyways.

Skinner - McDavid - Arvy
RNH - Draisaitl - Hyman
Podkolzen - Henrique - Perry
Janmark - Ryan - Brown

Problem area is still a defense that can't transition quickly and efficiently outside of Bouchard and Ekholm top pair. Oil look slow in part because their puck movement out of their zone is slow and uneven.

I don't know if I'd even give the top pair much credit on puck movement either, despite being the best of the group at it.

Every year we seem to revert to the bizarre habit of over complicating the breakout. We get the puck, then everyone spreads out and we try and pass our way through traps and defensive blue line stacks. The long term solution is to find a way for this group to break out as a connected unit, but in the interim they need to start punting pucks up in the air and chasing them down in the neutral zone. We were doing this early in the Calgary game then slowly got away from it. Also what got us back into the SCF last year when we took this approach in Game 4. It's ugly, but we're going to be on the right side of the puck more often that way and it will back defenders off that have been pinching the wingers in the D zone waiting for soft passes to make their way up the boards from the D.

Our passing as a team in all zones has been abysmal. We need to find ways to limit puck touches when moving through the middle of the ice until we get some confidence back.

 

[guymez]

Though Knoblauch sticks to his line pairs with this extended, deep scoring malaise, I'd look to shake up the lines.

Specifically I'd switch the top six net front guys to see if they spark with new centres and drop RNH with Draisaitl as a distributor option to help this team's best shooter get more quality shot options. Move energy Pod to third line to fish pucks for shot/scoring options Henrique and Perry. Move Janmark and Brown to line 4 where they will be post-trade deadline and playoffs anyways.

Skinner - McDavid - Arvy
RNH - Draisaitl - Hyman
Podkolzen - Henrique - Perry
Janmark - Ryan - Brown

Problem area is still a defense that can't transition quickly and efficiently outside of Bouchard and Ekholm top pair. Oil look slow in part because their puck movement out of their zone is slow and uneven.

I dont mind those line combos but I would put Philp in for Ryan.
That 4th line (as you have it) is prone to getting pushed around especially down low. Philp gives them some added size wihtout much of a dropoff in the other elements.

 

[K1984]

I dont mind those line combos but I would put Philp in for Ryan.
That 4th line (as you have it) is prone to getting pushed around especially down low. Philp gives them some added size wihtout much of a dropoff in the other elements.

This brings up another good point - another management group, another adherence to the "but he's a nice guy with a family!" routine here. Ryan should not play a moment ahead of Philp until there is good reason for it.

 

[CupofOil]

Assertive play can be summed up by our opening shift in Nashville and Calgary.

Everyone on the ice has their head up, feet moving, and are making simple plays and overwhelming teams down low with high battle level. Doesn't necessarily have to be physical, but everyone is on their toes, doing the right thing, and are ready to work.

The early season versions of the Oilers only ever seem to be able to do this on the road though. At home we mope around the ice and hope goals will just go in with magic.

Yeah pretty much with the difference this season being that the PP hasn't been bailing them out when the work ethic at even strength isn't there.

Regardless, these are all very correctable issues. Like I said before, there's absolutely no way that their scoring doesn't normalize at some point and that PK has nowhere to go but up. They'll be fine, they'll make the playoffs as a 2nd or 3rd divisional seed and play L.A. again and around and around we go lol.

 

[guymez]

This brings up another good point - another management group, another adherence to the "but he's a nice guy with a family!" routine here. Ryan should not play a moment ahead of Philp until there is good reason for it.

I agree.
I have liked Ryan as a player but at this point in his career I dont really see anything that makes him a better option than Philp.
The size difference matters as well.
Philp is 6'3" and 200 lbs comapred to Ryan at 5'10" / 185lbs. I like bigger centers assuming the rest of their game is comparable and in this case I think it is.

 

[Behind Enemy Lines]

I don't know if I'd even give the top pair much credit on puck movement either, despite being the best of the group at it.

Every year we seem to revert to the bizarre habit of over complicating the breakout. We get the puck, then everyone spreads out and we try and pass our way through traps and defensive blue line stacks. The long term solution is to find a way for this group to break out as a connected unit, but in the interim they need to start punting pucks up in the air and chasing them down in the neutral zone. We were doing this early in the Calgary game then slowly got away from it. Also what got us back into the SCF last year when we took this approach in Game 4. It's ugly, but we're going to be on the right side of the puck more often that way and it will back defenders off that have been pinching the wingers in the D zone waiting for soft passes to make their way up the boards from the D.

I'm being a little bit generous based on their history. But top pair will get it together. The blueline issue is a personnel one more than systems imo. Too much of a muddle mess with their off-season post August 12 reactive contingency plan. I don't mind the Nurse Kulak middle pair at least in the interim. But they badly need a quality puck mover/distributor d-man.

I dont mind those line combos but I would put Philp in for Ryan.
That 4th line (as you have it) is prone to getting pushed around especially down low. Philp gives them some added size wihtout much of a dropoff in the other elements.

I don't see Philp being on the big team until later in the season. Or he would be there.

 

[guymez]

I don't see Philp being on the big team until later in the season. Or he would be there.

I think thats a mistake.
Especially with 2 very responsible veteran wingers like Janmark and Brown.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

It is and you're not wrong that the team needs to be more assertive, not necessarily hitting although that would be nice but more aggressive in the corners and getting to the hard areas of the ice.

I also think luck plays a part. The Oilers are just not getting bounces right now, that's something that will correct itself as well over time. It's inevitable that the offensive floodgates open up, this is hugely unsustainable the way they're scoring now.

Did... you see the goals they scored yesterday? Luck was written all over them.

Good teams make their own luck. I think back to that Penguins game where some no-name goalie was stoning them repeatedly and they just kept at it until they broke through.

 

[McDNicks17]

This brings up another good point - another management group, another adherence to the "but he's a nice guy with a family!" routine here. Ryan should not play a moment ahead of Philp until there is good reason for it.

I think the main reason you keep him around is he could still be a decent depth option if the team figures out what's going on. The last thing you want is to lose him on waivers, have an injury and now need to trade for a guy just like him. And I do think he's the type of good veteran a bottom feeder would snag off waivers.

It's not like it's just him struggling. There's about a dozen guys on the team playing as bad or worse than him, but unfortunately for him, he doesn't have the age excuse. Like if you didn't know RNH's age, you'd think he was older than Ryan and his career was over based on his play this year.

 

[Behind Enemy Lines]

I think thats a mistake.

Think this team has concern about waiver wire risk of a cheap veteran right handed centre on an expiring contract. They love the player's processor and fit on this team. Meanwhile a safe waiver wire Philp can get in games and expanded ice-time to increase his value whenever the call up and transition happens later in-season. The position and player is not the difference in this team's record or potential to extricate itself out of the muck.

The issue is roster wise underperformance notably heavily weighted, expensive top six that isn't pissing a drop whether at EV or PP.

 

[guymez]

Think this team has concern about waiver wire risk of a cheap veteran right handed centre on an expiring contract. They love the player's processor and fit on this team. Meanwhile a safe waiver wire Philp can get in games and expanded ice-time to increase his value whenever the call up and transition happens later in-season. The position and player is not the difference in this team's record or potential to extricate itself out of the muck.

The issue is roster wise underperformance notably heavily weighted, expensive top six that isn't pissing a drop whether at EV or PP.

You're correct...Philp ultimately isnt the difference in this teams record however he does IMO move the needle a little bit in the right direction.
Enough little adjustments can make a difference so I see him as part of the solution sooner rather than later.
Especially when we are talking about a smallish player approaching 38 years old in Derek Ryan who is consistently getting pushed off the puck down low.

 

[CupofOil]

Did... you see the goals they scored yesterday? Luck was written all over them.

Good teams make their own luck. I think back to that Penguins game where some no-name goalie was stoning them repeatedly and they just kept at it until they broke through.

I'm talking about the entirety of the season and the Kulak goal wasn't luck at all.

All this panic now but it's only a matter of time until the Oilers offense breaks out. I'm really not concerned about that area of their game long term.

 

[Stoneman89]

This brings up another good point - another management group, another adherence to the "but he's a nice guy with a family!" routine here. Ryan should not play a moment ahead of Philp until there is good reason for it.

I have been in Ryans corner for a long long while and had lots of time for him. But speaking of time, I really believe it's finally caught up to him for good, and they should move on from him.

Now watch him get a couple goals next game.