GDT: Oilers at Hurricanes | March 16, 3 PM | Fox Sports

[Clark Gillies]

IMO, I think the Canes need to ****can the "win now because Staal and Ward are in their prime" mentality and start building for the long haul. I'm tired of trading high picks and prospects (Jack Johnson, Andrew Ladd, #8+Sutter+Dumoulin, etc..) for immediate help. It's not working.

JJ was traded because he was never ever ever going to play a game for the Carolina Hurricanes, he would have waited another year and reentered the draft.

Andrew Ladd (2004 #4) was traded for Tuomo Ruutu (2001 #9) -- at the time it was 2 high draft picks swapped for each other, the difference in age was only 3 years and both guys were not living up to expectations. It is easy to say in hindsight, but there was nothing really wrong with the trade - nobody could have predicted how brittle Ruu would be and how quickly hs decline would be. Up until the last 2 years the trade was fairly even at the slight difference in points can be attributed to less games as Ladd as been iron man since traded

Just Sayin'

I do totally agree with you on #3 though -- I like Jordan, but would much rather have Brandon, Dumoulin and the pick. If we didn't make that trade we could have been shopping E Staal the deadline, now we are stuck with Staals.

 

[rocky7]

really, really lol at anyone thinking that they would ever consider moving the Staals, ever. the only way I can see that happening is if Eric asks to be traded, and why the hell would he? this talk about Eric being a problem on the ice and in the room is a total waste of time. it is what it is and it's not going to change.
besides, Eric says he's very frustrated how things have gone and understands fan frustration. so there you have it. the end.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

JJ was traded because he was never ever ever going to play a game for the Carolina Hurricanes, he would have waited another year and reentered the draft.

I won't go into all the rehash of Johnson, but there was definitely a 2 way street on that deal as Rutherford was trying to get him to leave Michigan early as well. Also, are you sure he could have gone back into the draft after 1 more year?

Even so, JR could have traded for another young, highly touted player but wanted 2 things. 1) Help now (so he took the more seasoned, lower potential Gleason) and 2) to get Tverdosky off the books. There was definitely a "help now" aspect to that deal. In the end, JJ ended up being not all he was cracked up to be, but the deal Rutherford made still wasn't a good trade IMO.

Andrew Ladd (2004 #4) was traded for Tuomo Ruutu (2001 #9) -- at the time it was 2 high draft picks swapped for each other, the difference in age was only 3 years and both guys were not living up to expectations.

True, but that's my point. He traded a younger power forward who had not yet fully developed for Ruutu because (a) Ruutu was further along the development curve and (b) they needed a guy who could play center as well (that was part of the reasoning given back then). That's what I'm talking about, trading for help now. It wasn't just a change of scenery deal.

Yes, I admit it is hindsight, but now that's the beauty of hindsight, you can learn from it rather than repeat the same mistakes. In the end, it wasn't a good trade.

Anyhow, all that aside, I'm still of the same position. I don't want to see picks/prospects given up for more "help now". It's gotten the team nowhere so I'd rather build for the long term instead of trying for quick fixes.

 

[the halleJOKEL]

ladd was playing his best hockey as a hcane right before he got traded

 

[Blueline Bomber]

Truth

 

[Elsker]

Here's a good read for a note of reality:

[CHI/CAR] Andrew Ladd for Tuomo Ruutu from the 2/26/08 HF trade board.

 

[TheOllieC]

We got Loktionov for Ladd.

Asset management FTW.

 

[bleedgreen]

Jj was never gonna play for us is laughable without actual proof. I don't want it brought up anymore than anyone else, but back it up or leave it alone. With a source.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/news/story?id=2607458

Rutherford said he wasn't sure whether the trade would prompt Johnson to turn professional, saying, "We can't be concerned about that. We got two players we feel made our team a lot stronger."

The fact that that's included in the article makes it seem like there was definitely some smoke there. Enough to be worth a mention in the article about the trade.

According to Johnson himself, however, this is how the situation played out:

When I got drafted, it was by the Hurricanes. I was just out of the U.S. development program and I knew no matter what that I wanted to go to the University of Michigan. That was a dream of mine and something I really wanted to experience. And after my first year the opportunity had come up that they’d like me to leave school and everything and I just decided that I wasn’t ready as a hockey player or as a person to leave college yet.

I remember having dinner with Jimmy Rutherford, Carolina’s GM, in Detroit. I said, ‘Look, I’m not ready as a hockey player or as a person, and I need one more year after this year.’ Everyone seemed very cool with it and a couple weeks later I was sitting there in class and I got a text message from one of my former teammates, Jack Skilli, now with the Chicago Blackhawks, saying I just got traded to the Kings.

I stepped out of class and my phone was blowing up with all kinds of phone calls and that’s pretty much how I found out. I got on the phone with Ron Hextall when I got to the rink and that was pretty much it. Since I was a college kid, I didn’t have to pack up and move or move a family or anything like that. It was just like, ‘Well, OK, this sounds good.’

http://kings.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=549182

 

[Vagrant]

Jj was never gonna play for us is laughable without actual proof. I don't want it brought up anymore than anyone else, but back it up or leave it alone. With a source.

Can we also say that Eric Belanger and Ian White didn't want to be here or do we need sources for that too?

Certain truths about organizational history emerge quietly from the smoldering ruins of the grapevine and I am confident, as I have always been, that JJ was never going to play here. Perhaps not even of his own volition, but that of his father.

Maybe one day it will be something that we'll have confirmed in the media, maybe it won't be. I wouldn't touch it at this point in time. The decision to not sign with Carolina cost him. I am of the opinion that the hockey gods have punished him accordingly in terms of not being here for our victory, the Kings spitting in his face after signing an extension, the same Kings winning the cup, and then Team USA turning their back on him for Faulk. I think everything has come full circle and feel at peace with it, but it doesn't change what happened.

 

[RodTheBawd]

I find it ironic that many of the posters complaining about lack of physicality and toughness were also some of the biggest drum beaters for trading Gleason and Ruutu.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

I find it ironic that many of the posters complaining about lack of physicality and toughness were also some of the biggest drum beaters for trading Gleason and Ruutu.

True, but they aren't mutually exclusive. Whether it was their fault, the coaches fault, injuries, or whatever, a tough player also needs to be effective on the ice as well and those guys really weren't for the past couple of years. That said, it's obvious that at least for this season, those trades have not improved the Canes where it counts, in wins.

It remains to be seen going forward what Rutherford will do with the extra salary (saves $1M over 2 years on the Gleason deal, $3.8M/year on the Ruutu deal) and cap space (about $4M savings between the two deals).

 

[RodTheBawd]

True, but they aren't mutually exclusive. Whether it was their fault, the coaches fault, injuries, or whatever, a tough player also needs to be effective on the ice as well and those guys really weren't for the past couple of years. That said, it's obvious that at least for this season, those trades have not improved the Canes where it counts, in wins.

It remains to be seen going forward what Rutherford will do with the extra salary (saves $1M over 2 years on the Gleason deal, $3.8M/year on the Ruutu deal) and cap space (about $4M savings between the two deals).

I was going to put a disclaimer in my post that I wasn't trying to debate the merits of the actual trades, just pointing out something that made me chuckle