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Blue Jays Discussion: Off-Season Pt VII: Things keep happening!

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TF97 said:
Biggio
Bichette
Springer
Hernandez
Gurriel
Semien
Guerrero
Tellez
Jansen

This is probably what I would start the season with as of now. I’d be doing so with the hope that Vladdy can work his way up to the cleanup spot at some point.
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Springer was signed to be our lead off hitter, its where he exceled his entire career. No way Guerrero starts the season that low.

Lineup should be:

CF - Springer
SS - Bichette
1B - Guerrero
RF - Hernandez
LF - Gurriel
2B - Semien
DH - Grichuk
C - Jansen
3B- Biggio

Of course that can all change with trades or further FA acquisitions.
 
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BlueForever75 said:
Springer was signed to be our lead off hitter, its where he exceled his entire career. No way Guerrero starts the season that low.

Lineup should be:

CF - Springer
SS - Bichette
1B - Guerrero
RF - Hernandez
LF - Gurriel
2B - Semien
DH - Grichuk
C - Jansen
3B- Biggio

Of course that can all change with trades or further FA acquisitions.
Click to expand...
I'd rather see Tellez in over Grichuk. And Tellez at first with Vladdy at DH.
 
InShannyWeTrust said:
In reading the article he’s just using Roark as an example, him making 12million a season is going to make hard to move. Most teams are shedding salary and not wanting to take on a pitcher who was horrible last year. We will have to eat atleast a portion of our contract to get rid of him. , also the one useful part that Roark does is eat innings so might not be horrible to keep around. We shall see how they continue into the offseason, think we see a lot of piggy back pitching games Ray-Stripling, Matz-Kay something like that and then going after a big fish before the deadline. Going to be fun!
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Yea, but there isn't really anyone else besides Roark that they would want move for salary purposes except maybe Grichuk.
 
BlueForever75 said:
I agree but if Bryant comes it wont be only he. Hendricks is definitely involved and that in itself makes our rotation much more respectable along with 3B
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That’s what you think will happen. But indications are the Cubs believe Bryant has value and is not just a salary dump. So why give up prospect capital for a good SP and a redundant offensive 3B when you can just try for two necessary SPs.
 
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What are people's thoughts on our 8 man bullpen?

Bullpen:
Yates
Romano
Dolis
Chatwood
Borucki
Stripling
Matz
Yamaguchi or Cole

Then in the minors (AAA) guys with options:
Thornton
Merryweather
Hatch
Kay
Zeuch
Murphy
 
Canada4Gold said:
Oh great, we're going to go through this Law/Biggio shit with Groshans all over again. No SWR either.
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Based on the things Law has said about him, I think SWR is the next Biggio (disagrees with others in baseball and then sticks with his "This guy isn't actually any good" thing literally no matter what happens). And then if SWR does end up being good for long enough that his position becomes indefensible, he'll tell us all about this tiny little change they made that converted him from terrible to a star so he can say "The just fixed the problems I saw in him" instead of just admitting he was wrong.
 
Man Bear Pig said:
I'd rather see Tellez in over Grichuk. And Tellez at first with Vladdy at DH.
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Guerrero will not be in lineup as a DH at this point in his career. Understand that he has taken his off season to heart this year. He is dedicated. Maturing. You give him every opportunity to succeed in the field. That is at the very least what the Jays can give this guy.

As for DH, if Grichuk is retained. He will platoon DH with Tellez based on lefty-righty matchup. They both will see time in field as well to spell at 1B and OF.
 
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BlueForever75 said:
Springer was signed to be our lead off hitter, its where he exceled his entire career. No way Guerrero starts the season that low.

Lineup should be:

CF - Springer
SS - Bichette
1B - Guerrero
RF - Hernandez
LF - Gurriel
2B - Semien
DH - Grichuk
C - Jansen
3B- Biggio

Of course that can all change with trades or further FA acquisitions.
Click to expand...
Springer was signed to hit for us. If he hits anywhere other then 2nd or 3rd someone is making a stupid decision. The top 3 should be and I dont really see anyway to explain why it shouldnt be is
Biggio
Springer
Bichette
 
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le_sean said:
That’s what you think will happen. But indications are the Cubs believe Bryant has value and is not just a salary dump. So why give up prospect capital for a good SP and a redundant offensive 3B when you can just try for two necessary SPs.
Click to expand...

I am not saying Bryant doesnt have value. You go and get him because he improves your team. All things equal you take Bryant-Hendricks over 2 FA SP (not named Bauer).
 
I would do Gurriel and Moreno and Roark for Bryant and Hendricks. Move Biggio to LF for the year. Following season he moves back to 2B and hopefully Groshans is ready for 3B and the OF still consists of Springer, Hernandez and Grichuk and 1B/DH belongs to Vladdy and Tellez. To move Roark you need to attach extra value. I’d prefer to move Roark, Grichuk and shit prospects for a recent MVP and a stud pitcher too but that ain’t going to happen. We have catching depth and we have outfield depth. Deal makes sense. Kirk is ready for backup duties and as much as I dislike Jansen, I guess he’s decent for the position so Moreno can be expendable for the right deal. Maybe Grichuk and Moreno and Roark would work and that’s the preferred route but I’m not sure other teams wouldn’t beat that offer.
 
BlueForever75 said:
Springer was signed to be our lead off hitter, its where he exceled his entire career. No way Guerrero starts the season that low.

Lineup should be:

CF - Springer
SS - Bichette
1B - Guerrero
RF - Hernandez
LF - Gurriel
2B - Semien
DH - Grichuk
C - Jansen
3B- Biggio

Of course that can all change with trades or further FA acquisitions.
Click to expand...
Line up should be

2b Biggio
Cf Springer
Ss Bichette
Rf Hernandez
1B Guerrero
LF Gurriel
Dh Tellez
2b Semien
C Jansen

Biggio the best guy at getting on base should not be at the bottom of the order. He’s also great at seeing pitches which is great to have leading off. Worst case swap him and springer.
 
Looks like we are a starting pitcher away from contending.

Ryu
_______
Pearson
Hatch
Roark/Ray/Stripling
 
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dredeye said:
Line up should be

2b Biggio
Cf Springer
Ss Bichette
Rf Hernandez
1B Guerrero
LF Gurriel
Dh Tellez
2b Semien
C Jansen

Biggio the best guy at getting on base should not be at the bottom of the order. He’s also great at seeing pitches which is great to have leading off. Worst case swap him and springer.
Click to expand...

You do understand have a hitter as Biggio in the 9 spot adds a lot of value. The ability to have someone in that spot that can flip the lineup allows for our best hitter (Springer) to get more at bats with runners on base. If we have Jansen at 9 and he has a season like last, it doesnt help putting Springer at the plate with runners on base.

I understand what your saying about Biggio. But Springer has been the best leadoff hitter in baseball. Why would you change that?
 
A1LeafNation said:
Looks like we are a starting pitcher away from contending.

Ryu
_______
Pearson
Hatch
Roark/Ray/Stripling
Click to expand...

Hatch isnt going to be starting this year for us. If he is we are in trouble.

Rotation:

Ryu
_______
Pearson
Ray
Matz/Roark/Stripling unless of course we sign Walker back
 
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Also important to note: the difference in Run Expectancy between that lineup and the worst possible lineup they include (with Gurriel and Jansen at the top and Springer/Vlad/Teoscar at the bottom) is roughly 0.271 runs per game. And that's not just minor tinkering or having a guy a couple spots too high/low or something. The difference between literally the best and worst lineups you can possibly make is about one run every four games.

We vastly overstate how important lineup construction is.
 
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Discoverer said:
Also important to note: the difference in Run Expectancy between that lineup and the worst possible lineup they include (with Gurriel and Jansen at the top and Springer/Vlad/Teoscar at the bottom) is roughly 0.271 runs per game. And that's not just minor tinkering or having a guy a couple spots too high/low or something. The difference between literally the best and worst lineups you can possibly make is about one run every four games.

We vastly overstate how important lineup construction is.
Click to expand...

I mean, we do when theres 9 good hitters on a team. Pretty much just rank your best hitters 1-9 and call it a day and it's fine.

What Montoyo did last year almost on a daily basis was asinine.
 
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Lineups also fluctuate based on how streaky the hitter is, who's pitching, and who is healthy. I don't think any team has a set, pre-determined line up anymore.

Jays also have so few left-handed hitters that the righty-lefty match-up game doesn't really factor in.
 
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Morgs said:
I mean, we do when theres 9 good hitters on a team. Pretty much just rank your best hitters 1-9 and call it a day and it's fine.

What Montoyo did last year almost on a daily basis was asinine.
Click to expand...

Springer at top and Biggio at bottom balances lineup with potential to flip lineup and get most run expectation from top of lineup. Spots 6-8 are all interchangeable. Spot 9 trough 1-5 is where you make your hay.
 
Morgs said:
I mean, we do when theres 9 good hitters on a team. Pretty much just rank your best hitters 1-9 and call it a day and it's fine.

What Montoyo did last year almost on a daily basis was asinine.
Click to expand...

I still doubt the potential run expectancy impact warranted the type of complaining we did about it.
 
Until Biggio learns to be more aggressive there is no way he should be at the top of the order... far too many at bats start 0-1 and the other teams know it, he'll not likely ever be a guy to hit for average but does have a good eye and obp, perfect 9 hitter in this current roster
 
Critical91 said:
I am not too worried about who bats where. What does our starting defence look like right now?
Click to expand...
C Jansen
1B Tellez/Vladdy
2B Semien/Biggio
3B Vladdy/Biggio/Semien
Ss Bo/Semien
LF Guerriel/Hernandez
CF Springer/Grichuk
RF Hernandez/Grichuk/Biggio
DH Grichuk/Tellez/Hernandez
 
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Critical91 said:
I am not too worried about who bats where. What does our starting defence look like right now?
Click to expand...

C - Jansen/McGuire/Kirk
SS-Bichette/Semien/Espinola
2B - Semien/Biggio/Espinola
3B - Biggio/Guerrero/Semien/Espinola
1B - Guerrero/Tellez/Grichuk
RF - Hernanrdez/Grichuk/Davis
CF - Springer/Grichuk/Davis
LF - Guriel/Grichuk/Davis
 
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