Obscure hockey facts/stats (Part 2)

[The Panther]

That's mind numbing. I will say this, 1992 was Gretzky's worst season up until that point. Funny how a guy gets 121 points and we recoil and say "Whaaaaattt?" Plus he was -12 that season, just bad for his standards. The Suter cross check and perhaps his dad's health at that point was a major issue that year. Coupled with the miles of his 4th Canada Cup that fall. Gretzky was starting to - at some moments - look human.

Yeah, Gretzky's 1991-92 season (immediate post-Suter hit) is certainly his first "mortal" season, especially when viewed in terms of his lack of even strength dominance for the first time ever, and to a lesser extent by his inconsistency. In retrospect, maybe Wayne should have taken some time off at the start of the year to rest his back.

The L.A. talk going into that season (which followed a very successful 1990-91 season for them) was that the Sandstrom - Gretzky - Kurri line was going to be dynamite. It started well in game one at Winnipeg, when Kurri got a hat-trick and Sandstrom and Gretzky two points each.

But Gretzky then had three bad games, picking up a measly 1 assist in the three (zero points at ES). The last of these, at Calgary, was a disaster, with L.A. losing 7-1 and Gretzky going minus 5. The next game was a tie against Winnipeg, with Wayne picking up a couple of third period assists.

Then, on October 13th, Walter Gretzky had his aneurysm. Wayne was already off to a poor start (perhaps because of his back?), with 5 points in 5 games (and a minus 2), but then he missed over two weeks of Kings' games to be with his Dad. And when he came back, he put up "only" 12 points in his next 11 games. To this point in this season, he had 17 points in 16 games and was minus 8.

(As an aside---and speaking as the local Gretzky historian here---I don't think it can be over-emphasized how important Walter Gretzky's attention on Wayne was to Wayne's career. After Walter's aneurysm, the elder Gretzky could not remember much of Wayne's career as a pro, and even after he got his hockey sense back, he no longer followed Wayne's games anymore, often going to bed early to rest instead of staying up to watch Kings' games late into the night. Of course, we rightly point to the Gary Suter hit as a turning point in Wayne's career, but equally important is that his Dad stopped scrutinizing his play and offering him support and advice about hockey. Once that stopped, Wayne's prime immediately ended.)

Anyway, Gretzky recovered his season somewhat after this poor start. From November 19th 1991 to March 7th 1992, Wayne scored 89 points in 47 games to comfortably lead the League over that 47-game stretch (and he was only marginally behind Mario's pace when the latter was playing). But then only 15 points in the final 11 games (and a minus 7), to crawl across the finish line.

In addition to his back problem and father's aneurysm, that Sandstrom - Gretzky - Kurri line did not really work. On Dec. 5th 1991, Sandstrom got injured at Chicago Stadium and missed three weeks. Then, he came back for two games and got injured again, this time missing a further two months of action. Meanwhile, Kurri had seemingly gotten soft after a year in Italy and just did not have his old sharpness in 1991-92. At one point, he went 13 games without a goal, scored twice in three games, and then went another 9 games without scoring. To close the season, Kurri scored 4 times in his last 29 games.

 

[McGarnagle]

Edit: nevermind, read a chart wrong

 

[Big Phil]

(As an aside---and speaking as the local Gretzky historian here---I don't think it can be over-emphasized how important Walter Gretzky's attention on Wayne was to Wayne's career. After Walter's aneurysm, the elder Gretzky could not remember much of Wayne's career as a pro, and even after he got his hockey sense back, he no longer followed Wayne's games anymore, often going to bed early to rest instead of staying up to watch Kings' games late into the night. Of course, we rightly point to the Gary Suter hit as a turning point in Wayne's career, but equally important is that his Dad stopped scrutinizing his play and offering him support and advice about hockey. Once that stopped, Wayne's prime immediately ended.)

That is very interesting, and of all the things about Gretzky over the years I have to say I never thought about that. I knew his dad had the issue in the 1991-'92 season but I never thought that maybe this affecting him in a way more than just "Oh man, my dad almost died" type of thing. But yeah, no doubt Walter pushed him to be better. Heck, to be that good you definitely needed a dad being more than just Ward Cleaver and patting you on the back, I don't doubt there was some pressure Walter put on him at times, good pressure. So who knows, that with the combination of the back and the mobility not quite being the same could factor in.

 

[Big Phil]

(As an aside---and speaking as the local Gretzky historian here---I don't think it can be over-emphasized how important Walter Gretzky's attention on Wayne was to Wayne's career. After Walter's aneurysm, the elder Gretzky could not remember much of Wayne's career as a pro, and even after he got his hockey sense back, he no longer followed Wayne's games anymore, often going to bed early to rest instead of staying up to watch Kings' games late into the night. Of course, we rightly point to the Gary Suter hit as a turning point in Wayne's career, but equally important is that his Dad stopped scrutinizing his play and offering him support and advice about hockey. Once that stopped, Wayne's prime immediately ended.)

That is very interesting, and of all the things about Gretzky over the years I have to say I never thought about that. I knew his dad had the issue in the 1991-'92 season but I never thought that maybe this affecting him in a way more than just "Oh man, my dad almost died" type of thing. But yeah, no doubt Walter pushed him to be better. Heck, to be that good you definitely needed a dad being more than just Ward Cleaver and patting you on the back, I don't doubt there was some pressure Walter put on him at times, good pressure. So who knows, that with the combination of the back and the mobility not quite being the same could factor in.

 

[Big Phil]

Odd fact I just learned. Of the 15 goals credited to goalies in NHL history, 14 of them came on the road. The only goalie to score on his own home ice was Mike Smith in 2013 (and his goal beat the clock by literally 0.1 seconds)

Hextall in 1987 vs. Boston was on his home ice. I know that for sure.

 

[Big Phil]

Okay, I may have posted this already, I know I have before on these boards.

But the Pens have won 5 Cups and none were at home. Only once in 2016 did they actually have the opportunity to win it at home, but didn't, and then won it the next game in San Jose. But there is more. The city of Pittsburgh hasn't seen their teams win on home soil since 1960 when the Pirates beat the Yankees on Maz's home run. The Pirates won in 1971 and 1979, both on the road, the Steelers of course never won in a home Super Bowl before with their 6 championships, and the Pens have never won at home. Strange.

 

[McGarnagle]

Hextall in 1987 vs. Boston was on his home ice. I know that for sure.

It seems that I misread the wikipedia chart key and was completely wrong with that fact. I read where it said bold was home games, but that was supposed to be a bold scoreline. The bold goalie name indicates the goalie is still active (which smith is the only one). So 7 of the 15 actually were at home. Derp.

 

[The Panther]

Okay, I may have posted this already, I know I have before on these boards.

But the Pens have won 5 Cups and none were at home. Only once in 2016 did they actually have the opportunity to win it at home, but didn't, and then won it the next game in San Jose. But there is more. The city of Pittsburgh hasn't seen their teams win on home soil since 1960 when the Pirates beat the Yankees on Maz's home run. The Pirates won in 1971 and 1979, both on the road, the Steelers of course never won in a home Super Bowl before with their 6 championships, and the Pens have never won at home. Strange.

Yeah, I've noticed that about the Pens, too. It is odd. (Also about Pittsburgh!)

 

[Big Phil]

Yeah, I've noticed that about the Pens, too. It is odd. (Also about Pittsburgh!)

I don't know other sports cities that have it that way either.

In 1991, 1992 and 2017 they won on the road before they were needing to get back home. 2016 they could have closed it out at home but went back to San Jose for Game 6. 2009 they hit their limit either way and were never in the position to win at home. Just off the top of my head what other sports teams have that sort of track record with winning on the road? I know that post expansion the Habs have a lopsided number in the amount of times they won the Cup on the road. In fact, in 1993 when they won at home it was pretty rare. Was done in 1979 before that, and then 1968 prior to that. And even in 1968 for whatever reason the Blues had home ice advantage, so it didn't make sense that they were playing Game 4 at home.

 

[kaiser matias]

I just posted this elsewhere, but as it's definitely obscure I'll post it here, too:

There have been 6 NHL players who played for the Cowichan Valley Capitals of the BCHL. Three of them (Geoff Courtnall, Dean Evason, and Dan Hodgson) were on the 1980-81 Caps.

 

[alko]

Claude Giroux is the only man in NHL history, who played exactly 1000 regular season games for 1 franchise.

 

[OneSniffTwoSniff]

Antarro nittymaaki went 17-0-0 against the Trashers.

 

[seventieslord]

I don't want to give away this little tidbit right away - first let's see if anyone can figure it out.

In NHL history, just 8 players have managed to do something:

Glenn Anderson
Daniel Briere
Andrew Brunette
Doug Gilmour
Wayne Gretzky
Busher Jackson
Michael Ryder
Miroslav Satan

what did they do?

In the same vein, just 3 players have managed to do a similar thing:

Joe Murphy
Stephane Richer
Jeremy Roenick

what did these three players do?

 

[Hockey Outsider]

I don't want to give away this little tidbit right away - first let's see if anyone can figure it out.

In NHL history, just 8 players have managed to do something:

Glenn Anderson
Daniel Briere
Andrew Brunette
Doug Gilmour
Wayne Gretzky
Busher Jackson
Michael Ryder
Miroslav Satan

what did they do?

In the same vein, just 3 players have managed to do a similar thing:

Joe Murphy
Stephane Richer
Jeremy Roenick

what did these three players do?

No idea on the 2nd one, but the first one - OT goals with two or more franchises?

Full disclosure, I cheated and looked up Satan (I figured he must have scored at least one OT goal for the Sabres, but forgot he did that for the Bruins as well) and Jackson (I didn't recall he had a short stint with the Bruins, let alone scored an OT goal for them, but the rest of the pattern seemed obvious).

 

[seventieslord]

No idea on the 2nd one, but the first one - OT goals with two or more franchises?

Full disclosure, I cheated and looked up Satan (I figured he must have scored at least one OT goal for the Sabres, but forgot he did that for the Bruins as well) and Jackson (I didn't recall he had a short stint with the Bruins, let alone scored an OT goal for them, but the rest of the pattern seemed obvious).

you're on the right track, but that's not exactly it.

 

[The Panther]

Yesterday, Connor McDavid matched Paul Coffey for career points as an Edmonton Oiler (in 61 fewer games). The Oilers' top-10 now looks like this:
1669 - Gretzky
1043 - Kurri
1034- Messier
906 - Anderson
669 - McDavid
669 - Coffey
631 - Smyth
596 - Draisaitl
577 - Weight
515 - Nugent-Hopkins

 

[FrozenJagrt]

Discounting Gretzky & Lemieux & Hawerchuk, nobody else has had five 100+ seasons by age 25, have they?

That's a good one. I couldn't think of anybody. Peter Stastny reached 100 in his first six seasons, but of course he didn't hit the NHL until he was 22 or 23.

Orr was 26 when he got his fifth 100 point season I think.

 

[Mohar Ikram]

Claude Giroux is the only man in NHL history, who played exactly 1000 regular season games for 1 franchise.

Hope he never re-signs with Philly again in the offseason. That record seems special.

 

[Sinter Klaas]

I don't want to give away this little tidbit right away - first let's see if anyone can figure it out.

In NHL history, just 8 players have managed to do something:

Glenn Anderson
Daniel Briere
Andrew Brunette
Doug Gilmour
Wayne Gretzky
Busher Jackson
Michael Ryder
Miroslav Satan

what did they do?

In the same vein, just 3 players have managed to do a similar thing:

Joe Murphy
Stephane Richer
Jeremy Roenick

what did these three players do?

Score OT goals for and against a franchise they played with?

 

[seventieslord]

Score OT goals for and against a franchise they played with?

Yes, the first group scored a playoff OT goal both for and against the same franchise.

 

[Sadekuuro]

In the same vein, just 3 players have managed to do a similar thing:

Joe Murphy
Stephane Richer
Jeremy Roenick

what did these three players do?

They scored OT winners against the same team with two different franchises.

 

[seventieslord]

They scored OT winners against the same team with two different franchises.

That's right.

The list of players with 2 or more playoff OT winners is about 186 players long, which means the list of players to do it with 2 or more teams is probably ~50 players.

But only those eight have ever done so both for and against the same team, and only those three have ever done it against the same team twice for different teams.

 

[seventieslord]

Of course, at this point if I asked you to tell me what only Glenn Anderson, Doug Gilmour and Martin Havlat have done in NHL history, you'd get it pretty quickly.

 

[Sadekuuro]

Playoff OT is my jam, and I've got a very comprehensive spreadsheet to back me up if I need it

Anderson, Gilmour and Havlat scored in OT for three different teams, though I never would have remembered Havlat without checking.

 

[The Panther]

If anyone saw the farcical Edmonton - Calgary game the other day, the Oilers (cough..! cough...!) defense gave up 9 even strength goals. I'm wondering when is the last time an NHL club gave up 9 ES goals in one game?