Confirmed Trade: [NYR/FLA] Dylan McIlrath for Steven Kampfer and conditional 7th

[One Winged Angel]

Because you don't have to watch a player play often to know a guy who can't crack the NHL at 24 is not a better player than the guy who is a top pairing D and was commanding a 1st Rd pick + when he was on the trade block... something a certain poster refuses to admit.

Again, read my post. I don't care about the Fowler argument. I think he's a good defender, maybe overrated by some but every team's fan base will do that for certain players.

My point is that people are saying he's overrated when in reality that's just not correct, Ranger fans just think he deserved more of a chance when there are lesser players with bigger contracts who have not played as good as Dylan did last year on this team who continuously get minutes. It's just like Tanner Glass. Were all Ranger fans wrong about Vigneault's love for glass?

I could care less about Fowler, the hatred for McIlrath (although I don't get why) and everything else, I'm just pointing out that it's not anyone overrating him, it's people who watched him on a nightly basis saying that he didn't get a fair shake and that's not wrong by any stretch if you've actually watched him play, which many in this thread definitely have not.

 

[HanSolo]

If you actually watched him last season, him and Yandle were the team's best pairing when they played together. So no, he wasn't overrated. He played well and a lot of the fans thought he deserved a chance to play. He was better than Girardi and Staal last season. Anyone who watched the Rangers on a nightly basis could tell you this.

I honestly don't care about Fowler and the arguments between you guys and Machinehead, it holds no relevance to me. However, a lot of you guys simply have not watched the guy, so why chime in on the guy and sit here and hate on someone who has done nothing to you?

It's just as childish as the "asinine" statements that Machinehead has supposedly made.

The fact that someone who has played a grand total of 38 games in the NHL can have this much of an effect on people's lives is just... sad.

Let's go Rangers and best of luck to Dylan in Florida. Hopefully, he gets his shot.

Oh and technically isn't it only 28 general managers, since one of the other 29 traded for him?

Well it certainly doesn't help that Machinehead is still pushing this narrative that the guy who has been our best player is still terrible.

I know it was spurned on by ducks fans getting on McIlrath's case, but after we kept hearing how Dylan definitively proved that he was gonna be the better player and now we have this result while Fowler has been our best defenseman I think we earned the right to poke a little fun.

This debate with Machinehead and a select few others has been going on for the better part of the last year every time Fowler's name pops up around here.

And maybe we didn't watch McIlrath much but a child could come to the conclusion that if the whole league wouldn't take one player for free and there's another who is one of the top defensemen on another team, the former is not as good as the latter.

 

[Lindberg Cheese]

Mac is an excellent kid/guy, hope he makes it. Classic asset mismanagement.

 

[Rangers ftw]

Wait what? Is this a discussion who's is the better/more valuable player of Fowler or Mcilrath? I mean, yeah, AV sure didn't cut him some extra slack, but one of them has played like 500 NHL games while the other has 50 and is given away for free. That is enough evidence, you don't have to weigh in point production, salary etc.

Mcilrath can still become a NHL defenseman, but the comparison to Fowler is stupid no matter how you twist it. Unfortunately.

 

[One Winged Angel]

Well it certainly doesn't help that Machinehead is still pushing this narrative that the guy who has been our best player is still terrible.

I know it was spurned on by ducks fans getting on McIlrath's case, but after we kept hearing how Dylan definitively proved that he was gonna be the better player and now we have this result while Fowler has been our best defenseman I think we earned the right to poke a little fun.

This debate with Machinehead and a select few others has been going on for the better part of the last year every time Fowler's name pops up around here.

And maybe we didn't watch McIlrath much but a child could come to the conclusion that if the whole league wouldn't take one player for free and there's another who is one of the top defensemen on another team, the former is not as good as the latter.

Ok but there's a general manager who just traded assets (lower level ones, albeit) for the player in question even after all 29 teams passed on him when he went through waivers.

What I'm saying here is that it's not as black and white as you're saying.

Also, I'm not arguing Fowler vs McIlrath. Count me as one of the guys who had Fowler up on his list (behind Burmistrov, Tarasenko and Kuznetsov) and would have rather have taken Fowler and dealt another asset. I always go with BPA over need. You can address needs in other ways, especially when top young cost controlled talent is hard to come by. It's fairly obvious who is the better player.

However, Machinehead has a right to feel gunshy about defenders who are not cost controlled (like Fowler) considering the decisions that the Rangers front office have made over the past 8 or so years handing out contracts. Also, cost controlled young talent helps the Rangers more at this point.

I think people misunderstand him to an extent, to be honest.

 

[Sojourn]

Ok but there's a general manager who just traded assets (lower level ones, albeit) for the player in question even after all 29 teams passed on him when he went through waivers.

What I'm saying here is that it's not as black and white as you're saying.

Also, I'm not arguing Fowler vs McIlrath. Count me as one of the guys who had Fowler up on his list (behind Burmistrov, Tarasenko and Kuznetsov) and would have rather have taken Fowler and dealt another asset. I always go with BPA over need. You can address needs in other ways, especially when top young cost controlled talent is hard to come by. It's fairly obvious who is the better player.

However, Machinehead has a right to feel gunshy about defenders who are not cost controlled (like Fowler) considering the decisions that the Rangers front office have made over the past 8 or so years handing out contracts. Also, cost controlled young talent helps the Rangers more at this point.

I think people misunderstand him to an extent, to be honest.

By assets you mean another player that passed through waivers. Let's not pretend this is anything more than a change of scenery for both guys. It's waiver fodder for waiver fodder, until either shows otherwise. Oh, and potentially a 7th round pick, which is about as close to a bag of pucks as you can get in the NHL.

Misunderstand him? He lives or dies by the shot differential statistics. To the point where a player with poor statistics is crap, period. Do I need to remind you what was said?

Obviously the pick was Tarasenko there, but if I could go back I'd still pick McIlrath over Fowler with ease.

I never liked Fowler. Never understood what people like about him. He was better when they were teenagers. He's not better now and he won't be better going forward.

This is him stating, outright, that McIlrath was the better player from the age 20 on. Based on an absurdly small sample size by McIlrath, mind you. It was, what? 10 games, at the time? Maybe more? There is no misunderstanding that. A statement like that isn't made from objective observations of the two players on the ice, certainly not over any extended period of time. People are entitled to ridiculous opinions. They are entitled to state those opinions. Hell, that's part of why we're here. Others are also entitled to call them out on those statements, and point out when they are wrong.

It is what it is. If I say something stupid, and I do occasionally, I expect to get crap for it. Hey, I'll even own it, and admit I'm wrong. It happens to us all. Things start to get silly when you deny that you were wrong, in the face of overwhelming evidence.

 

[WesMcCauley]

Ok but there's a general manager who just traded assets (lower level ones, albeit) for the player in question even after all 29 teams passed on him when he went through waivers.

What I'm saying here is that it's not as black and white as you're saying.

Also, I'm not arguing Fowler vs McIlrath. Count me as one of the guys who had Fowler up on his list (behind Burmistrov, Tarasenko and Kuznetsov) and would have rather have taken Fowler and dealt another asset. I always go with BPA over need. You can address needs in other ways, especially when top young cost controlled talent is hard to come by. It's fairly obvious who is the better player.

However, Machinehead has a right to feel gunshy about defenders who are not cost controlled (like Fowler) considering the decisions that the Rangers front office have made over the past 8 or so years handing out contracts. Also, cost controlled young talent helps the Rangers more at this point.

I think people misunderstand him to an extent, to be honest.

Florida traded a 28 year old AHL defensemen+7th rounder for Mcilrath. Thats a basically a one for one and the player we got back is worth absolutely nothing

 

[Sojourn]

Florida traded a 28th year old AHL defensemen+7th rounder for Mcilrath. Thats a basically a one for one and the player we got back is worth absolutely nothing

I only saw McIlrath a couple of times, but his lateral and backwards mobility looked a bit questionable. Big or not, that type of issue could be the kiss of death in the league these days, especially if he hasn't shown any real improvement in that area since being drafted.

He looked pretty mobile for his size moving forward, but backwards and laterally he seemed slow and vulnerable. Might have just been the games I saw, though.

 

[HanSolo]

Ok but there's a general manager who just traded assets (lower level ones, albeit) for the player in question even after all 29 teams passed on him when he went through waivers.

What I'm saying here is that it's not as black and white as you're saying.

Also, I'm not arguing Fowler vs McIlrath. Count me as one of the guys who had Fowler up on his list (behind Burmistrov, Tarasenko and Kuznetsov) and would have rather have taken Fowler and dealt another asset. I always go with BPA over need. You can address needs in other ways, especially when top young cost controlled talent is hard to come by. It's fairly obvious who is the better player.

However, Machinehead has a right to feel gunshy about defenders who are not cost controlled (like Fowler) considering the decisions that the Rangers front office have made over the past 8 or so years handing out contracts. Also, cost controlled young talent helps the Rangers more at this point.

I think people misunderstand him to an extent, to be honest.

Let's be honest here. Kampfer and a conditional 7th isn't that far above free. Yes it's assets but not all that substantial.

And the animosity doesn't come from Machinehead and other NYR fans not wanting Fowler. What New York does with their blueline is of less than zero consequence to Ducks fans. No one is crying over not being able to send Fowler to NYR as most Ducks fans would prefer to keep Fowler in Anaheim.

It's comments like "McIlrath is better than Fowler in that he has a pulse" I'm gonna give Machinehead the benefit of the doubt and assume that was hyperbole, but what does that imply? Any human being who can stand up straight on skates is better than Fowler. It's stuff like that that incites and inflames our fanbase. He tells us we don't know what we're talking about because we don't accept his interpretation of the stats and we retort that he's wrong because he doesn't care about our impressions we get from watching him play 82+ games a year for the last 6 years.

It's insulting enough to be told we don't know how to judge hockey ability based on actually watching hockey rather than numbers, but it's done in such a way that our entire fanbase on this site knows this poster's name and agenda.

 

[RangerGuru]

Don't let the extreme views of one poster impact your views of the player in question (McIlrath) or the entire Ranger fan base as a whole. It's like reading Bern trade proposals and assuming all Ranger fans are like that as well

Fowler is a very solid defenseman who in some circumstances the Rangers would love to have. He's unquestionably better than McIlrath, and if he was a RHD with the same skillsets we'd be all over him.

It's a shame McIlrath didn't get more of a look for us. I honestly thought he'd end up as the perfect #5 or #6, who plays decently, has an okay shot and a nasty edge. Hopefully he does well in FLA (when he's not playing us of course) and gives Simmonds a few more beatings

 

[Savant]

another great draft pick by the rags

It's hard to make good picks when you are stuck drafting in the late teens and 20s.

The Rangers haven't had the luxury of multiple top 5 picks in the last 10-15 years to build their current teams. The Rangers have had zero top 5 picks in fact.

 

[Sheppy]

Would have loved to see McIlrath on Boston. I still think he has some upside.

 

[Revelation]

Really really smart of Florida to reunite him with Yandle basically for free. If they regain their chemistry that's a high end 2nd pairing.

 

[HanSolo]

Don't let the extreme views of one poster impact your views of the player in question (McIlrath) or the entire Ranger fan base as a whole. It's like reading Bern trade proposals and assuming all Ranger fans are like that as well

Fowler is a very solid defenseman who in some circumstances the Rangers would love to have. He's unquestionably better than McIlrath, and if he was a RHD with the same skillsets we'd be all over him.

It's a shame McIlrath didn't get more of a look for us. I honestly thought he'd end up as the perfect #5 or #6, who plays decently, has an okay shot and a nasty edge. Hopefully he does well in FLA (when he's not playing us of course) and gives Simmonds a few more beatings

On my own personal level, because I cannot speak for the whole of the HFDucks community, I don't let Machinehead taint my view of McIlrath (nor does he taint my view of Rangers fans)

I'll admit my experience with McIlrath started with that 2010 draft. Fowler was a guy I never considered we'd get because I was sure he'd go top 5. So from the beginning I viewed Dylan McIlrath as a blessing to us because he and Jack Campbell being selected enabled us to make an excellent value pick at number 12.

When I considered WHY McIlrath went before Fowler I believe at the time I remember reading that the managerial mindset at the the time was to make NYR grittier and more in line with Western powerhouses at the time. But I immediately came to the conclusion that McIlrath was not a smart pick at number 10. While he had an intriguing toolkit, he wasn't the kind of guy worth picking in the top 10 and he certainly wasn't BPA.

I watched a few of McIlrath's games with the Rangers and I saw he appeared to be competent. And I understand that given the circumstances maybe he didn't get a fair shake. But I don't think it's unfair to say he's not very good. If he was very good he'd have locked in a roster spot. But instead he was waived and then traded for peanuts.

Now, could he still be an effective NHLer? Absolutely. And for his sake being a top 10 pick I would hope he does. But when we were told a year ago that 10 games made him better than a 5 year NHL veteran, when we see McIlrath's situation now it's worth it to us to revisit the issue.

 

[lastcupever75]

It's hard to make good picks when you are stuck drafting in the late teens and 20s.

.

Dylan McIlrath 10th overall, 2010
New York Rangers

 

[Machinehead]

It is what it is. If I say something stupid, and I do occasionally, I expect to get crap for it. Hey, I'll even own it, and admit I'm wrong. It happens to us all. Things start to get silly when you deny that you were wrong, in the face of overwhelming evidence.

Overwhelming evidence. The irony.

 

[Savant]

Dylan McIlrath 10th overall, 2010
New York Rangers

I'm glad that you left off the part where I was comparing to teams that had the luxury of consecutive top 5 picks. Picking 10th overall is not in the top five. Every team makes mistakes. The Rangers probably would have taken Tarasenko if not for what happened with Cherepanov. Things happen.

 

[RempireStateBuilding]

By assets you mean another player that passed through waivers. Let's not pretend this is anything more than a change of scenery for both guys. It's waiver fodder for waiver fodder, until either shows otherwise. Oh, and potentially a 7th round pick, which is about as close to a bag of pucks as you can get in the NHL.

The Rangers turned a 7th round pick in to Lundqvist, so that's potentially a pretty good bag of pucks.

I'm glad that you left off the part where I was comparing to teams that had the luxury of consecutive top 5 picks. Picking 10th overall is not in the top five. Every team makes mistakes. The Rangers probably would have taken Tarasenko if not for what happened with Cherepanov. Things happen.

Not sure I understand this. Because Cherepanov had some freak heart condition, they were scared of drafting more top tier Russians..? Wouldn't what happened to Cherepanov have spurred them to gun for a guy like Tarasenko above all else?

 

[Pharrell Williams]

wow!

 

[Vipers31]

Overwhelming evidence. The irony.

"No, no, this obviously and by design flawed data, that rather weakly correlates with success on a large scale and climbed the throne of the "new least crappy projector around", which regularly brings clearly flawed results when you narrow the scope, that IS the evidence, that is ALL the evidence!"

Yeah, we get it, we found it hilarious for some time, as well, but it became a "bit" dull.

 

[Vitto79]

Really really smart of Florida to reunite him with Yandle basically for free. If they regain their chemistry that's a high end 2nd pairing.

People it's a waiver player for waiver player and mcilrath has no confidence w the rangers coaching so kampfur is more experienced so actually would be a dependable call up

 

[Maukkis]

So this McIlrath was supposed to be our Trouba replacement. Well then.

 

[Duck Off]

If you actually watched him last season, him and Yandle were the team's best pairing when they played together. So no, he wasn't overrated. He played well and a lot of the fans thought he deserved a chance to play. He was better than Girardi and Staal last season. Anyone who watched the Rangers on a nightly basis could tell you this.

I honestly don't care about Fowler and the arguments between you guys and Machinehead, it holds no relevance to me. However, a lot of you guys simply have not watched the guy, so why chime in on the guy and sit here and hate on someone who has done nothing to you?

It's just as childish as the "asinine" statements that Machinehead has supposedly made.

The fact that someone who has played a grand total of 38 games in the NHL can have this much of an effect on people's lives is just... sad.

Let's go Rangers and best of luck to Dylan in Florida. Hopefully, he gets his shot.

Oh and technically isn't it only 28 general managers, since one of the other 29 traded for him?

The guy was just waived, passed on by every other team in the league, and then traded for another guy that no one wanted for free... Yeah, I'd say he was overrated based on a small sample size. I'll flat out admit that I didn't watch many of his games, but if several were saying he's better than Fowler, and then this happens; it's a safe assumption to say he was overrated by many.

Spare us the whining as well. Duck fans had to deal with several Ranger fans chiming in about the topic for a year now. Forgive us if we find karma in the situation.

 

[Thucydides]

This is a kid to watch. I was hoping the hawks would put a claim in on mcilrath . Kid would be invaluable in the playoffs .

I'll be watching his progress in Florida .

 

[nbwingsfan]

Overwhelming evidence. The irony.

He was just given away... are you really still trying to say he's better than Fowler?