Player Discussion Nylander After the Contract

[ULF_55]

Something like that could work. He can create offense out of nothing, he just needs guys to keep up with him and not getting his way. And ideally one of the line mates can help cover him Defensively when he's looking to break out.

And I think JT can even benefit from being away from him too, by getting paired with a couple guys who play more along his style

McMann could be his lower case Hyman.

 

[ULF_55]

Season is coming down to ... watch their stars produce, maybe hit some records.

So go Nylander, get your first 100 point season.

Team kind of given up on at this point, they just don't seem to have grown as a team.

 

[mjd1001]

To go back to the original title of the thread literally, how has he performed before the contact singing/announcement compared to since then?

Before: 37 games, 21 goals, 33 assists, 54 points, +5
82 game pace: 47 goals, 73 assists, 120 points, +11
Team had 47 points in 37 games: 104 point pace in the standings.

After: 34 games, 19 goals, 21 assists, 40 points, -2
82 game pace: 45 goals, 51 assists, 96 points, -4
Team had 42 points in 34 games: 98 point pace in the standings.

On one hand, judging a player on 30-40 games is a VERY small sample size. On the other hand, there has been a drop-off in production since he signed (small, but noticable).

I still think this contract is expensive and will start to hurt in the last few years, but ultimately it will be, and should be judged on his (and the team's) playoff success the next couple of seasons.

 

[notDatsyuk]

To go back to the original title of the thread literally, how has he performed before the contact singing/announcement compared to since then?

Before: 37 games, 21 goals, 33 assists, 54 points, +5
82 game pace: 47 goals, 73 assists, 120 points, +11
Team had 47 points in 37 games: 104 point pace in the standings.

After: 34 games, 19 goals, 21 assists, 40 points, -2
82 game pace: 45 goals, 51 assists, 96 points, -4
Team had 42 points in 34 games: 98 point pace in the standings.

On one hand, judging a player on 30-40 games is a VERY small sample size. On the other hand, there has been a drop-off in production since he signed (small, but noticable).

I still think this contract is expensive and will start to hurt in the last few years, but ultimately it will be, and should be judged on his (and the team's) playoff success the next couple of seasons.

Here is the same breakdown for Tavares, his usual centre:

Before: 37 games, 12 goals, 22 assists, 34 points, +4
82 game pace: 27 goals, 49 assists, 75 points, +9

After: 33 games, 11 goals, 12 assists, 23 points, -3
82 game pace: 27 goals, 30 assists, 57 points, -7

A lot bigger dropoff - I wonder if that has any bearing on Willy's smaller one?

 

[ZEBROA]

Keefe please make three lines now and into the playoff. A Matthew, a Nylander and a Tavares line. Keep em separated. So they can get a hang of it. Stop the juggeling of key players. And no Knies or Nylander with Tavares! Marner is the best player and only key player to juggle around. Put him were he is needed the most at the time.

 

[mjd1001]

Here is the same breakdown for Tavares, his usual centre:

Before: 37 games, 12 goals, 22 assists, 34 points, +4
82 game pace: 27 goals, 49 assists, 75 points, +9

After: 33 games, 11 goals, 12 assists, 23 points, -3
82 game pace: 27 goals, 30 assists, 57 points, -7

A lot bigger dropoff - I wonder if that has any bearing on Willy's smaller one?

Possibly. It can go either way though....Did Nylander's play get worse and cause a drop-off in JT's play? or did JT not being as effective cause Nlanders's stats to fall off? I guess that is why its fun to discuss this on message boards, and sometimes....the 'eye test' might be better than over-analyzing statistics.

 

[Nylander88]

Keefe please make three lines now and into the playoff. A Matthew, a Nylander and a Tavares line. Keep em separated. So they can get a hang of it. Stop the juggeling of key players. And no Knies or Nylander with Tavares! Marner is the best player and only key player to juggle around. Put him were he is needed the most at the time.

I agree.
Knies-Matthews-Marner
Bertuzzi-Domi-Nylander
McMann-Tavares-Jarnkrok (if healthy)

 

[notDatsyuk]

Possibly. It can go either way though....Did Nylander's play get worse and cause a drop-off in JT's play? or did JT not being as effective cause Nlanders's stats to fall off? I guess that is why its fun to discuss this on message boards, and sometimes....the 'eye test' might be better than over-analyzing statistics.

Exactly. The bigger dropoff suggests that it's more JT than Willy slipping, which is supported by the eye test.

 

[Confucius]

Possibly. It can go either way though....Did Nylander's play get worse and cause a drop-off in JT's play? or did JT not being as effective cause Nlanders's stats to fall off? I guess that is why its fun to discuss this on message boards, and sometimes....the 'eye test' might be better than over-analyzing statistics.

The eye test shows me he has nobody to pass to and when he does they can’t finish.

 

[saffronleaf]

I agree.
Knies-Matthews-Marner
Bertuzzi-Domi-Nylander
McMann-Tavares-Jarnkrok (if healthy)

Domi matthews bertuzzi
Mcmann Jt marner
Nice Youngster willy

 

[saffronleaf]

nice assist on the jt goal

 

[notDatsyuk]

JT nice finish on the Willy rush and setup.

 

[authentic]

Possibly. It can go either way though....Did Nylander's play get worse and cause a drop-off in JT's play? or did JT not being as effective cause Nlanders's stats to fall off? I guess that is why its fun to discuss this on message boards, and sometimes....the 'eye test' might be better than over-analyzing statistics.

The eye test tells me that Nylander played his best hockey before the contract, not just looking at points only, I've never seen him play a more dominant or more consistent all around game ever in his career

 

[ULF_55]

Played 3:30 on the perfect PK last night.

 

[BM14]

Domi matthews bertuzzi
Mcmann Jt marner
Nice youngster willy

….bro

 

[notDatsyuk]

….bro

Auto-incorrect. (We hope.)

 

[notDatsyuk]

The eye test tells me that Nylander played his best hockey before the contract, not just looking at points only, I've never seen him play a more dominant or more consistent all around game ever in his career

He's still, on the whole, been our best player this season.

Yes, Matty with 60 is our top scorer, and there have been a bunch of games where various players have been our best (Sammy on Saturday for example), but when Willy gets the puck ....

 

[ULF_55]

Knies-Matthews-marner
McMann-Domi&Bertuzzi$/Holmberg-Nylander
Cowan-Tavares-Jarnkrok
Kampf-Minten-Reaves-Dewar-Holmberg

Realistically, it will be same lines as this year.

Knies-Matthews-marner
McMann-Tavares-Nylander
Holmberg-?-Jarnkrok
Scramble

 

[arso40]

The eye test tells me that Nylander played his best hockey before the contract, not just looking at points only, I've never seen him play a more dominant or more consistent all around game ever in his career

even our "best players" havent been able to sustain that level of play and definitely not a player at 6.9 mill lets save the negative comments on a positive season for next year lol when hes getting nearly double the salary

 

[Sundinisagod]

He will be the new Marner getting heat for not playing up to his contract.. until Marner signs. then its back to Marner again.

This started with Tavares and just gone out of hand. If Nylander play like this 5 years or so, not many will complain to much, in five years he will be a bargain if this continues. But he should slow down in only two tree years. Maby as soon as next year. I blame the dude getting Tavares for all of this.

I respectfully disagree about this starting with Tavares. He was offered the exact same or more by several teams, it was his true market value, though still a terrible signing for us to spend 11m on a 2nd line centre. Imho it started with Nylander's previous deal, where he sat for 2 months until he got about 500k per season above his market value. Then Matthews and Marner would not take market value either. I think we would have been happy to pay them market value but they made it all about squeeezing the team for all they could. Second round same story. Wouldn't be surprised if Micheal Nylander convinced the other 2 to take as much as they could. It's not that hard to convince people to take more money. Dissappointing to see it happen this second go around, considering how it has affected our playoff success (lack of obviously).

 

[notDatsyuk]

I respectfully disagree about this starting with Tavares. He was offered the exact same or more by several teams, it was his true market value, though still a terrible signing for us to spend 11m on a 2nd line centre. Imho it started with Nylander's previous deal, where he sat for 2 months until he got about 500k per season above his market value. Then Matthews and Marner would not take market value either. I think we would have been happy to pay them market value but they made it all about squeeezing the team for all they could. Second round same story. Wouldn't be surprised if Micheal Nylander convinced the other 2 to take as much as they could. It's not that hard to convince people to take more money. Dissappointing to see it happen this second go around, considering how it has affected our playoff success (lack of obviously).

JT's true market value may have been $11M, but as you say, we shouldn't have paid it for a 2C.

But don't you think paying $11M for a 2C was more an issue than $7M for a 2W, especially if you're trying to keep two better players, both on the top line, to lower cap hits?

 

[arso40]

I respectfully disagree about this starting with Tavares. He was offered the exact same or more by several teams, it was his true market value, though still a terrible signing for us to spend 11m on a 2nd line centre. Imho it started with Nylander's previous deal, where he sat for 2 months until he got about 500k per season above his market value. Then Matthews and Marner would not take market value either. I think we would have been happy to pay them market value but they made it all about squeeezing the team for all they could. Second round same story. Wouldn't be surprised if Micheal Nylander convinced the other 2 to take as much as they could. It's not that hard to convince people to take more money. Dissappointing to see it happen this second go around, considering how it has affected our playoff success (lack of obviously).

are we seriously blaming a 6.9 million dollar player for the 10.9 and 11.6 ask by our anointed 2 best players??

 

[ZEBROA]

I respectfully disagree about this starting with Tavares. He was offered the exact same or more by several teams, it was his true market value, though still a terrible signing for us to spend 11m on a 2nd line centre. Imho it started with Nylander's previous deal, where he sat for 2 months until he got about 500k per season above his market value. Then Matthews and Marner would not take market value either. I think we would have been happy to pay them market value but they made it all about squeeezing the team for all they could. Second round same story. Wouldn't be surprised if Micheal Nylander convinced the other 2 to take as much as they could. It's not that hard to convince people to take more money. Dissappointing to see it happen this second go around, considering how it has affected our playoff success (lack of obviously).

In hindsight Tavares was a bad deal and Nylander was a good/ok deal. Market value or not. Tavares position was not our biggest need. And without Tavares deal i dont think Marner or Matthews would have gotten 4ish mill more then Nylander. Tavares 11mil made them a case to get more or same as Tavares. But who knows.

 

[Sundinisagod]

are we seriously blaming a 6.9 million dollar player for the 10.9 and 11.6 ask by our anointed 2 best players??

Actually I'm blaming (speculating) his father.

To be perfectly honest, im still at a loss as to why we have had to overpay the me3. Still looking for answers, originally thought it was due to Babcock. That theory is out the window now.

With regards to Tavares, off hand i can't recall other ufa deals affecting the teams rfa deals. If anyone has some examples I'm all ears.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Actually I'm blaming (speculating) his father.

To be perfectly honest, im still at a loss as to why we have had to overpay the me3. Still looking for answers, originally thought it was due to Babcock. That theory is out the window now.

With regards to Tavares, off hand i can't recall other ufa deals affecting the teams rfa deals. If anyone has some examples I'm all ears.

I don't think UFA/RFA had anything to do with it.

If you pay a 2C $11M, why wouldn't a couple of top line players look for comparable?