Norris or Pinto

[bicboi64]

Re: your 2nd paragraph

If people think the risk of re-injury is omnipresent, and other GMs think the same way, then how are we going to get the right combo of young players & picks?

I agree that it would be nice if we did that kind of return, but you said in your 1st paragraph that the return wouldn’t be too useful.

I don't think the return would be the best, but even if we just get draft picks and very meh prospects, we can start stocking the cupboards. I think the most effective use of moving Norris would be having almost $8 million in capspace to improve the roster somewhere else.

 

[BigRig4]

I would move out Norris b/c of the contract and injury history, even though he’s almost certainly the better player with the higher ceiling.

 

[Answer]

2 Average players who don't move the needle one bit

I will go with Pinto since I hate Norris contract, that doesn't fit into his small tunnel vision

 

[Loach]

Ya, he may have come back at less than 100%, usually health is the most likely explanation for a drastic fall off.

I think Pinto will rebound, but until then, it's hard to argue Norris hasn't been more important to the team. I suppose you could frame the question as what''s more important, Pinto playing to his abilities, or Norris playing to his,

What if they put Pinto, Brady and Bath back together? Run Norris onbthe 3rd line. He would feast there.

 

[Answer]

What if they put Pinto, Brady and Bath back together? Run Norris onbthe 3rd line. He would feast there.

Can you elaborate on that?

 

[Loach]

Can you elaborate on that?

He would be up against weaker lines from the other team. Maybe... lol

 

[PlayOn]

What if they put Pinto, Brady and Bath back together? Run Norris onbthe 3rd line. He would feast there.

Norris was with Amadio and Perron last game, it didn’t last long. Mind you they didn’t have Bath with Pinto and Tkachuk, it was Greig, but no one was feasting and 15 minutes later the lines were shuffled again.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

I voted Pinto but it is really, really close.

 

[Loach]

Norris was with Amadio and Perron last game, it didn’t last long. Mind you they didn’t have Bath with Pinto and Tkachuk, it was Greig, but no one was feasting and 15 minutes later the lines were shuffled again.

Pinto, Brady and Bath were good last year.

 

[JungleBeat]

Non difference makers but I’ll take the guy not making $8M and is injury prone.

 

[PlayOn]

Pinto, Brady and Bath were good last year.

They were but did they not fizzle by the end? Maybe they checked out, I don’t know. I think Pinto specifically slowed down a lot to end last year.

One thing about our forward lines is that none of them have chemistry for sustained periods. They get hot and it works, then it gets cold. We’ve had a similar core for years now and there isn’t really a line you can always fall back on. There have been injuries obviously but still kind of unusual.

 

[Big Muddy]

I don't think the return would be the best, but even if we just get draft picks and very meh prospects, we can start stocking the cupboards. I think the most effective use of moving Norris would be having almost $8 million in capspace to improve the roster somewhere else.

OK. I get that, but if we are rebuilding, then maybe cap space isn’t as important unless of course people think they can rebuild mostly through trades. But, then once again, if Norris is used as trade bait, then as you’ve mentioned you’re not expecting a big return.

Guess what I’m wondering is if people think there’s some kind of quick fix?

He would be up against weaker lines from the other team. Maybe... lol

Not sure what required elaboration. It was pretty obvious what the consequences would be of your suggestion.

 

[OD99]

I see exactly 53.1% of the voters are wrong.

People always want to chase the magical prospect or the sure to be used effectively cap space.

Norris is criminally underrated on this forum.

He is easily the better player and has been since he entered the league. He was out all season and has adjusted well, and seems to be heating up.

Let's revisit this 20 games from now and see where we are. Scoring goals in the NHL is hard, and he is one of the few on our team that does it regularly.

 

[robsenz]

Obviously Norris is the more effective player. But neither should be viewed as core, they both constantly go unnoticed in games and have been over hyped by the fans.

 

[Tuna99]

So Pinto, Zub, Sanderson, Perron, and possibly Brady (took a maintenance day early in the season) and Norris (no sign of the one-timer, except for one instance) are all at less than 100%. Hard to play competitive hockey or to assess your team where your key players are all limping.

it’s not hard to asses the team. They are inconsistent not because of injuries but because their top players are inconsistent, the fans called it “not back checking” and Green re-framed it as “playing with emotion” as a nice excuse for Brady not doing what he’s supposed to be doing because he was overcome with the need to punch someone in the face instead of win hockey games, but the top players are inconsistent from Ullmark to Brady to Chabot to Sandy to Pinto to Zub to Forsenrg to Giroux and that’s why we aren’t good, nothing new, the real news isn’t injuries, it’s “the top players haven’t learned to be consistent in the NHL” end of story

We’ll see tonight what they are made of, could be a turning point game, we’ll see

 

[Sun God Nika]

Though it should be expected by now it always fascinates me how fast this fan base can turn on a player. The trade Bath folks were insufferable

 

[PlayOn]

Though it should be expected by now it always fascinates me how fast this fan base can turn on a player. The trade Bath folks were insufferable

I think people lose sight of the fact that there aren’t actually many NHLers that are consistent year over year. Most have ups and downs, especially early on in their careers.

 

[BankStreetParade]

I see exactly 53.1% of the voters are wrong.

People always want to chase the magical prospect or the sure to be used effectively cap space.

Norris is criminally underrated on this forum.

He is easily the better player and has been since he entered the league. He was out all season and has adjusted well, and seems to be heating up.

Let's revisit this 20 games from now and see where we are. Scoring goals in the NHL is hard, and he is one of the few on our team that does it regularly.

No kidding.

I did a mini-breakdown of him the other day and it's honestly staggering how much people sleep on him. Not to mention, it's like everyone forgets he's played like 50 games total in the previous 2 seasons. He has some catching up to do.

First unit PK
First unit PP
Elite faceoff guy
35 goal pace
Excellent defensively, often out in the last minute of games protecting the lead (when we're in that situation)

I'm not entirely sure what more people could want out of the guy, especially given the distinct lack of secondary scoring.

 

[OD99]

No kidding.

I did a mini-breakdown of him the other day and it's honestly staggering how much people sleep on him. Not to mention, it's like everyone forgets he's played like 50 games total in the previous 2 seasons. He has some catching up to do.

First unit PK
First unit PP
Elite faceoff guy
35 goal pace
Excellent defensively, often out in the last minute of games protecting the lead (when we're in that situation)

I'm not entirely sure what more people could want out of the guy, especially given the distinct lack of secondary scoring.

It's the money, IMO. It blinds people to what players provide.

From what I saw, he has the 71st highest cap hit in the league and that ranking will go down more and more.

He isn't flashy, but he is important.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

I think we should bump this thread and reopen the voting in another couple of years; or alternatively we can have a new thread every 3 months and not reopen the voting

 

[Blotto71]

I'm hopeful that Pinto finds his game and takes step, allowing Norris to move to LW and Ostapchuk to take over 3rd C.

Pinto

 

[NinjaSens]

I am conflicted about Norris' contribution to the team. As pointed out by other posters, Norris plays on the special teams (PP and PK), is good on draws, good goal scorer and decent defensively.

On the flip side, is Norris making his linemates better? If we compare Norris to Stutzle, it is obvious that Timmy creates lots of scoring opportunities and makes his linemates better. I don't see the same from Norris. He may be doing well individually, but as a centerman, he needs to make his linemates better as well.

I'm not a data guru. I would welcome any metrics confirming or contradicting my post.

 

[OD99]

I'm hopeful that Pinto finds his game and takes step, allowing Norris to move to LW and Ostapchuk to take over 3rd C.

Pinto

Norris is a C, and it is obvious. His skills would be wasted as a winger.

I am conflicted about Norris' contribution to the team. As pointed out by other posters, Norris plays on the special teams (PP and PK), is good on draws, good goal scorer and decent defensively.

On the flip side, is Norris making his linemates better? If we compare Norris to Stutzle, it is obvious that Timmy creates lots of scoring opportunities and makes his linemates better. I don't see the same from Norris. He may be doing well individually, but as a centerman, he needs to make his linemates better as well.

I'm not a data guru. I would welcome any metrics confirming or contradicting my post.

That is old school thinking. C don't have to be distributing. As much as I like that type of pivot, there are many wingers who are more playmaker than scorer.

Norris is on pace for over 30 goals again! WTF do people want?

 

[Blotto71]

Norris is a C, and it is obvious. His skills would be wasted as a winger.

So is Pinto, so is Ostapchuck, so is Stutzle. If Pinto takes the step we all want him to, he isn't a bottom 6 player - means one of he, Norris, or Stutzle moves to wing. That's not a bad thing. Move Pinto to RW if that makes it more platable. Reality is Giroux is getting long in the tooth and we'll need a top 6 winger to replace him, if not next year, the year after. Ostapchuck is going to be a force and will be perfectly placed as a 3rd liner (contract will be right for that spot too).

If it MUST be Norris and Pinto at center, be ready to move one for somebody else.

 

[NinjaSens]

To add to my post, I don't mind Norris as a player, or even having him as a center. He is a good player. My biggest issue with Norris is his contract. For close to 8M/year, I'm expecting more.

Maybe his contract will look better as the cap rises over the years which would reduce expectations and make him less subject to criticism.