Blue Jays Discussion: No More AA, Everyone is very Sad (and by Sad, I mean Mad)

[mikebel111*]

I must admit I found it kinda funny how ppl were saying KC would lose to the Mets anyways after we lost to them. The same ppl who thought home field in the playoffs didn't matter. I guess it is a hockey forum after all.

Nice to see that home field doesn't matter. Look at how we played at home
Looks like we were right

 

[Edo]

Kevin Towers would be horrible.

http://www.beyondtheboxscore.com/20...s-tenure-in-arizona-four-years-of-poor-trades

For those who need a refresher on what he's done in Arizona. I would cry.

 

[weems]

Just finished watching this video of Shapiro being interviewed. Man this guy is extremely bright, well spoken and progressive.

 

[dredeye]

What is Zobrist going to command this offseason...5 year 100Million? If the Jays are going for it next season then they should try to sign him.

To play where? We need PITCHING

 

[Cor]

To play where? We need PITCHING

To be fair, Zobrist could probably pitch... dude can play everywhere

 

[KuleminFan41]

That's a crock of nonsense. You don't get to have a top-5 offensive stats by being built for the Skydome. Same goes for Kansas.

Have you actually seen the Jays stats? At home the Jays went 53-28 , away from home they were 40-41. The Jays record in one run games was 15-28

Now lets look at other teams records that made the playoffs this season

Royals away 44-37 and 23-17 in one run games
Cubs away record 48-33 and 34-21 in one run games
Rangers away record 45-36 and 27-22 in one run games
Pirates away record 45-36 and 36-17 in one run games
Cardinals away record 45-36 and 32-23 in one run games
Yankees away record 42-39 and 23-24 in one run games
Mets away record 41-40 and 25-24 in one run games
Dodgers away record 37-44 and 23-26 in one run games
Astros away record 33-48 and 21-29 in one run games

 

[hoglund]

Well at least it feels better losing to the World Series champs

It's about time they won the world series, a 30 year drought and even that world series was tainted with umpire assistance vs the Jays and especially the Cardinals. It's been a long time for them, not as long as the Cubs (107 years, but they have the longest drought in the American league).

 

[KuleminFan41]

Worst part is, we'll never hear the end of their 'clutchness'. Also, the myth that small ball = World Series will spread even more.

Normally you don't have teams outscoring the opposition in the world series or playoffs in general. If you look at the last several world series champions they usually have 2 guys who hit more than 20 home runs. The last team to have more than 3 was the 09 Yankees when they had 7 players with 20 or more home runs.

2014 Giants
2 players with 20 or more home runs. Posey with 22 and Pence with 20
2013 Red Sox
2 players with 20 or more home runs . Ortiz with 30 and Napoli with 23
2012 Giants
1 player with 20 or more home runs. Posey with 24
2011 Cardinals
3 players with 20 or more home runs . Pujols with 37 , Holiday with 22 and Berkman with 31
2010 Giants
2 players with 20 or more home runs . Huff with 26 and Uribe with 24
2009 Yankees
7 players with 20 or more home runs. Posada with 22 , Texieira with 39 , Cano with 25 , Rodriguez with 30 , Damond with 24 , Swisher with 29 , Matsui with 28

 

[Clark4Ever]

Well, at the very least, it appears as though we'll have LaCava and Gibbons staying on board next season to maintain some continuity.

 

[Giuseppe Sallo]

Royals could be a scary team next year but the blue jays are gonna be better. I knew KC would close it out -- just too good and confident even when their trailing. It's all about positive mentality.

 

[Stats01]

Royals could be a scary team next year but the blue jays are gonna be better. I knew KC would close it out -- just too good and confident even when their trailing. It's all about positive mentality.

see I never buy into "positive mentality" and all of these terms we use on why teams are better than others. The reason why KC is going to win the W.S is because they're the best team period. They were amazing this playoffs, they have the line-up, they have the pitching and pretty much owned anyone they played. We'll see if they can keep some of their free agents in the winter.

 

[Stats01]

Well, at the very least, it appears as though we'll have LaCava and Gibbons staying on board next season to maintain some continuity.

Gibbons will have a very short leash IMO.

 

[Giuseppe Sallo]

Just finished watching this video of Shapiro being interviewed. Man this guy is extremely bright, well spoken and progressive.

I dunno, something about THIS guy.

Being smart doesn't mean you're gonna be a great president. Look at beeston, he was a bum, but still managed to be decent.

 

[Giuseppe Sallo]

see I never buy into "positive mentality" and all of these terms we use on why teams are better than others. The reason why KC is going to win the W.S is because they're the best team period. They were amazing this playoffs, they have the line-up, they have the pitching and pretty much owned anyone they played. We'll see if they can keep some of their free agents in the winter.

KC was my pick to WIN the WS only because of their appearance last finals... experience and growth is huge.

I disagree. It's all about the approach. As much as I dislike host, he's preaching here, these guys are buying into the system and have confidence. You can see it, they never waver. But they do complain a lot.

Jays are very good but gibbons sucks, as a motivater. Never liked him.

 

[Mach85]

Have you actually seen the Jays stats? At home the Jays went 53-28 , away from home they were 40-41. The Jays record in one run games was 15-28

Now lets look at other teams records that made the playoffs this season

Royals away 44-37 and 23-17 in one run games
Cubs away record 48-33 and 34-21 in one run games
Rangers away record 45-36 and 27-22 in one run games
Pirates away record 45-36 and 36-17 in one run games
Cardinals away record 45-36 and 32-23 in one run games
Yankees away record 42-39 and 23-24 in one run games
Mets away record 41-40 and 25-24 in one run games
Dodgers away record 37-44 and 23-26 in one run games
Astros away record 33-48 and 21-29 in one run games

That's misleading, because the Jays' road record after the Tulowitzki and Price acquisitions was 18-10.

 

[Kurtz]

Royals could be a scary team next year but the blue jays are gonna be better. I knew KC would close it out -- just too good and confident even when their trailing. It's all about positive mentality.

Royals should fall off a bit next year. They'll lose Cueto+Zobrist, and probably Gordon too.

 

[hockeywiz542]

alex anthopoulos, in my estimation, deserves to still be here, deserves to keep building this team, and deserves autonomy over baseball operations. It’s hard not to say that he’s earned that, given how the 2015 season played out — especially from a business perspective. He’s earned the right to demand that.

the problem is, however, that incoming president mark shapiro can likely make a very strong case that the way anthopoulos divested the club of its future this summer was reckless, even though his labours bore plentiful fruit in the near term. David price is a free agent, so are mark buehrle and marco estrada, and gone are a number of players who might have helped fill those giant holes in the club’s rotation next season: Daniel norris, jeff hoffman, and matt boyd. Gone too is miguel castro, who might have helped in the bullpen, which could now lose roberto osuna and aaron sanchez to the rotation.

A lot of pitching depth is gone — and for good reason, most fans would agree. And yet, a lot of the media chatter in this city as anthopoulos turned his farm system into veteran talent was that the gm had this team in his heart and would always do right by the organization. That may well be true, but it’s hardly unreasonable that to an outsider, like shapiro, his moves looked more desperate than shrewd, the results more fortunate than by precise design, and that all of what he did this summer may have been alex’s only way out — his only chance to preserve his hold on one of the 30 gm chairs that currently exist, especially with a new boss due to come in above him.

If this is shapiro calling his bluff, now that’s shrewd. Impressively shrewd. And we can hardly call it unexpected, either. From the first whispers last winter about rogers’ clandestine approaches to candidates who might replace paul beeston, we’ve known that they were looking for someone with a baseball background. Someone who might threaten anthopoulos’s autonomy.

it’s understandable that alex wouldn’t want to be in that situation. What’s not understandable — what’s a little bit quaint, actually — is the way that fans act as though there are only thirty people capable of his job, and the blue jays just let go of one of the best ones!

The fact is, anthopoulos has done a lot of great things, and he’s done a lot of things that weren’t so great, or where the jury is still out — the price and tulowitzki trades belonging firmly in that last group. That doesn’t mean he should be fired or disrespected or that mark shapiro shouldn’t be able to work with him, but it also doesn’t mean that shapiro can’t find someone to do the job just as well.

 

[JS19]

Have you actually seen the Jays stats? At home the Jays went 53-28 , away from home they were 40-41. The Jays record in one run games was 15-28

Now lets look at other teams records that made the playoffs this season

Royals away 44-37 and 23-17 in one run games
Cubs away record 48-33 and 34-21 in one run games
Rangers away record 45-36 and 27-22 in one run games
Pirates away record 45-36 and 36-17 in one run games
Cardinals away record 45-36 and 32-23 in one run games
Yankees away record 42-39 and 23-24 in one run games
Mets away record 41-40 and 25-24 in one run games
Dodgers away record 37-44 and 23-26 in one run games
Astros away record 33-48 and 21-29 in one run games

What does that have to do with what I was talking about? Home/Away record =! Offensive stats.

 

[Sokil]

Gone too is miguel castro, who might have helped in the bullpen, which could now lose roberto osuna and aaron sanchez to the rotation.

You can't have it both ways.

First he says we're deplete of young pitching talent. Then in the next breath says Osuna and Sanchez are viable options for the rotation next year.

Also, it's easy to namedrop Hoffman while ignoring that we have Tulowitzki.

 

[deletethis]

A lot of pitching depth is gone — and for good reason, most fans would agree. And yet, a lot of the media chatter in this city as anthopoulos turned his farm system into veteran talent was that the gm had this team in his heart and would always do right by the organization. That may well be true, but it’s hardly unreasonable that to an outsider, like shapiro, his moves looked more desperate than shrewd, the results more fortunate than by precise design, and that all of what he did this summer may have been alex’s only way out — his only chance to preserve his hold on one of the 30 gm chairs that currently exist, especially with a new boss due to come in above him.

Finally the other side of the argument is represented in the mainstream media. It's understandable that it's difficult to sell the idea that a successful series of tactics was self-serving for the former GM.

 

[Stats01]

KC was my pick to WIN the WS only because of their appearance last finals... experience and growth is huge.

I disagree. It's all about the approach. As much as I dislike host, he's preaching here, these guys are buying into the system and have confidence. You can see it, they never waver. But they do complain a lot.

Jays are very good but gibbons sucks, as a motivater. Never liked him.

Gibbons is your typical laid back Texan. Even when Bautista hit that 3 run bomb against Texas his reaction was pretty low considering the circumstances. Pretty easy to say he's not much of a motivator at all, just let's the boys play

 

[Sokil]

Finally the other side of the argument is represented in the mainstream media. It's understandable that it's difficult to sell the idea that a successful series of tactics was self-serving for the former GM.

I don't think desperate is an accurate word here. Was swapping Reyes for Tulo desperate? Because most saw it as genius at the time. It wasn't future for present or a rental, it was Tulo for a long time.

Now, the next move that followed may have been desperate, or it may have been complimentary. When we got Tulo everyone was screaming "get pitching, we need pitching!" so he got pitching

 

[deletethis]

I don't think desperate is an accurate word here. Was swapping Reyes for Tulo desperate? Because most saw it as genius at the time. It wasn't future for present or a rental, it was Tulo for a long time.

Now, the next move that followed may have been desperate, or it may have been complimentary. When we got Tulo everyone was screaming "get pitching, we need pitching!" so he got pitching

The Tulo trade does have an element of "win in the short term" to it. He is currently still an excellent defensive shortstop but it's highly doubtful that he will be able to fulfill that level of defensive excellence for the balance of his contract. Colorado had their reasons to move him and get away from that contract commitment. A declining bat and perhaps a player better served to find a new defensive position in a few years to save his body make this player a less enticing future asset.

 

[Mach85]

The Tulo trade does have an element of "win in the short term" to it. He is currently still an excellent defensive shortstop but it's highly doubtful that he will be able to fulfill that level of defensive excellence for the balance of his contract. Colorado had their reasons to move him and get away from that contract commitment. A declining bat and perhaps a player better served to find a new defensive position in a few years to save his body make this player a less enticing future asset.

He provides a ton more value than Reyes, and at a cheaper price for the next 3 years. Tulo will decline somewhat by the end of the deal and likely won't be worth 20 mil per year, but having a top 5 shortstop until that happens matches better with this team's current makeup than the corpse of Jose Reyes who's basically costing a team wins at this point. Reyes is a guy without much power who relied on his legs and speed, and once that started to go he declined quickly. Tulo should be able to age a lot better.

 

[HamiltonNHL]

The Jays were 40-41 on the road

Yet. Gibbons threw away the Home Field advantage vs. The Royals by not caring after the AL East clinch. Nice Gibby. Nice.