Post-Game Talk: No Cup for Winnipeg this Year | 4-1 Leafs Win

[The Podium]

So because you don't "understand the angle", you think Matthews is lying?


Source?

Source? I’ve played hockey, and know how the good players feel about the scrubs.

 

[al secord]

Typical Leafs fans. We win and there are still some comparing about Simmonds and Clifford. These guys are never happy unless Malgin and Petan are in the lineup.

Typical Leaf fan.

 

[Ianturnedbull]

I think people are giving Simmonds and Clifford a bit too much credit here…. They were invisible physically. Clifford was just invisible period, at least Simmonds had a great game.

I never understand the “feel protected” angle when these guys are playing less than 10 minutes and never against the guys who are “punishing” our players. I understand when you have a Tom Wilson or Tkachuk brother, but a 4th line enforcer will never convince a top 9 player to engage in a fight, and may get burned trying a retaliatory hit. The enforcer role is going extinct for a reason.

Maybe there is some merit to the “prepare them mentally for a physical game” angle, but the Leafs/Jets games always get out of hand so they were likely expecting a physical game regardless.

Happy Simmonds got back in the lineup, especially when NAK has had a rough start to the season, but I don’t think his presence is the reason Reilly fought in defense of Robertson.

Ok I somewhat agree, but in no way were Clifford/Simmons "invisible".

A primary assist (for instance) is not a play an invisible player does. You have to be active in the offensive zone (in most occasions) to get a primary assist.

It seems to me that you're worried that 2 fighters are now stealing 4th line jobs. I don't think they are. Not yet. I don't think ZAR and NAK are though. They might have better defensive track records, but it doesn't show. At least not yet.

The 4th line for Dubas/Keefe is a work in progress.

 

[All Mod Cons]

Source? I’ve played hockey, and know how the good players feel about the scrubs.

Matthews seems to disagree with you. Unless you are calling him a liar.

 

[egd27]

I never understand the “feel protected” angle when these guys are playing less than 10 minutes and never against the guys who are “punishing” our players.

It's been explained several times in both the GDT and the PGT. It's bigger than simply TOI and direct actions.

 

[Metroid]

Lol this sub.

Even winning gets everyone arguing about who's right or wrong for fox lakes.

Go leafs go.

 

[The Podium]

Ok I somewhat agree, but in no way were Clifford/Simmons "invisible".

A primary assist (for instance) is not a play an invisible player does. You have to be active in the offensive zone (in most occasions) to get a primary assist.

It seems to me that you're worried that 2 fighters are now stealing 4th line jobs. I don't think they are. Not yet. I don't think ZAR and NAK are though. They might have better defensive track records, but it doesn't show. At least not yet.

The 4th line for Dubas/Keefe is a work in progress.

Simmonds had a great game and definitely earned another start. Without question he was a bigger contributor in last nights game than NAK has been all season.

Clifford was invisible, that is who I was referring to.

Matthews seems to disagree with you. Unless you are calling him a liar.

Of course he is a liar, has a player ever, in the history of the game, publicly called out a teammate? Especially in this market! Come on man…

 

[All Mod Cons]

Simmonds had a great game and definitely earned another start. Without question he was a bigger contributor in last nights game than NAK has been all season.

Clifford was invisible, that is who I was referring to.



Of course he is a liar, has a player ever, in the history of the game, publicly called out a teammate? Especially in this market! Come on man…

Matthews is a liar. Good to know.

I, for one, think more of him.

 

[ErnieLeafs]

Source? I’ve played hockey, and know how the good players feel about the scrubs.

That’s funny. Many have both played and coached, and know this well too, and they disagree with you. The players on the pro team we’re discussing disagree with you.

So how did the good players on the team feel about playing with you, since you have intimate knowledge

 

[The Podium]

That’s funny. Many have both played and coached, and know this well too, and they disagree with you. The players on the pro team we’re discussing disagree with you.

So how did the good players on the team feel about playing with you, since you have intimate knowledge

Fun fact: I was the physical scrub, I have a ton of self awareness.

You guys are willing to settle for mediocrity, that’s the difference. Gary Roberts, Wendel Clark, Cam Neely, or more recently Matthew/Brady Tkachuk, Tom Wilson, those are the types of players that can protect their teammates in todays game. Those are the players who physical presence is felt and will convince other teams to shy away from contact.

 

[notbias]

Lets ask Leafs best player.

What is he supposed to say? "They are tough but not good hockey players?"

Clifford is not good, he just takes too many dumb penalties, but I wouldn't mind seeing Simmonds in the lineup longer.

I could see a high-energy guy like NAK who throws around his weight do well with Simmonds.

 

[ErnieLeafs]

Fun fact: I was the physical scrub, I have a ton of self awareness.

You guys are willing to settle for mediocrity, that’s the difference. Gary Roberts, Wendel Clark, Cam Neely, or more recently Matthew/Brady Tkachuk, Tom Wilson, those are the types of players that can protect their teammates in todays game. Those are the players who physical presence is felt and will convince other teams to shy away from contact.

Who says anyone is willing to settle for anything? It’s irrelevant. Nobody here has any say in roster moves of the team.

When we play the Jets, the cheap garbage happens, and you need guys who will respond, or set the tone. Guys like Simmonds do that. Clifford is little more than a willing puncher, but in a game that gets outta hand, you may need one or two of those.

This idea that guys don’t get juiced up and rally around the guys who swing is false.

Source: Everyone but you

 

[Ianturnedbull]

Source? I’ve played hockey, and know how the good players feel about the scrubs.

Yeah. You keep mentioning that. How well did you do in a team sport where you had no respect for your team?

Which Junior A team did you play for?

I think many of us played hockey. Do we have the authority to put down 4th line NHLers?

 

[The Podium]

Who says anyone is willing to settle for anything? It’s irrelevant. Nobody here has any say in roster moves of the team.

When we play the Jets, the cheap garbage happens, and you need guys who will respond, or set the tone. Guys like Simmonds do that. Clifford is little more than a willing puncher, but in a game that gets outta hand, you may need one or two of those.

This idea that guys don’t get juiced up and rally around the guys who swing is false.

Source: Everyone but you

They literally were not physical last night though. Reilly dropped the gloves, to think Reilly had some revelation that he’s allowed to fight because Clifford is in the lineup is BS in my opinion.

 

[All Mod Cons]

Sweet. Auston Matthews is a liar.

Another agenda-driven narrative to go with the rest of the crusades.

 

[The Podium]

Yeah. You keep mentioning that. How well did you do in a team sport where you had no respect for your team?

Which Junior A team did you play for?

I think many of us played hockey. Do we have the authority to put down 4th line NHLers?

I respected my team… I was a very self aware physical scrub. I’m literally talking from experience.

Anyway, this conversation got way out of hand.

Simmonds had a great game, I hope he’s in for the next one.

Summary of my point: the Leafs need physicality in their Top 6, not on the 4th line.

 

[ShaneFalco]

Fun fact: I was the physical scrub, I have a ton of self awareness.

You guys are willing to settle for mediocrity, that’s the difference. Gary Roberts, Wendel Clark, Cam Neely, or more recently Matthew/Brady Tkachuk, Tom Wilson, those are the types of players that can protect their teammates in todays game. Those are the players who physical presence is felt and will convince other teams to shy away from contact.

We don't have that. The core is soft in that regard which is why being able to insert a guy like Simmonds in there allows the core to play shit bigger noone someone has your back and won't just stand there and watch you get ragdolled

 

[crump]

Liked game and physical response. Rielly was great jumping in. For a smaller guy, Sandin crushes guys constantly.

Probably won’t see both Clifford and Simmonds in the lineup together unless it’s a heavy team or a history of violence. I like the idea of rotating in guys, keeps effort level honest. Simmonds will probably stay in the lineup for a bit.

Tavares is playing like he’s mid twenties and not 30 something.

Samsonov is looking really good. Thank God.

Matthews grabbing his back still is worrying, must look like the right side of the visible light spectrum based on how it’s still bugging him days after the cross check. Would explain missed shots and trouble rotating into 1 timers.

 

[Lilou]

I never seen a more useless donkey than stanley. What the hell is he doing. I rewatched the game this morning and that pylon is useless when he isn't trying to play pretend tough guy which he isn't even good at. Very SOFF, low IQ, and a low energy donkey.

 

[All Mod Cons]

The vitriol being spewed for Matthews, Simmonds and Clifford is unbelievable.

 

[kb]

Why didn't Logan Stanley dress tonight?

He did. Except it was in a bra and panties.

 

[Mess]

Simmonds and Clifford clearly had an agenda to change the narrative last night. They were on a crusade. They were honest with the team and didn't lie to each other. The refs were unlucky last night with their expected goals.

What's is Matthews' agenda here? Why is he lying? It's like he's on a crusade to keep the narrative alive. Unlucky.

I don't like it one bit.

Dallas Stars abused Matthews the game prior and Auston was still holding his hip in this game after some shots feeling the effects of the abuse he took unanswered.

Had Jamie Benn done that with Simmonds and Clifford in the line-up he might be missing a few teeth today, and most certainly would have been challenged to a fight.

Its great that Auston has added "hits and physical play" to his game to try and get his teammates more engaged physically, but he knows he has added help driving up the teams intensity level when Simmonds and Clifford are also sitting on the Leafs bench willing to do their parts as well.

I personally enjoyed this game the most of the Leafs 6 games this season, because I got to watch high impact real Hockey and not low contact figure skating.

 

[The Podium]

We’ll see if this team continues to be physical with Simmonds in the lineup. Then maybe I’ll believe the “protection” effect. It’s been 2 years already where it hasn’t paid off, but maybe this year is different. Who am I to know… apparently

 

[Gallagbi]

Dallas Stars abused Matthews the game prior and Auston was still holding his hip in this game after some shots feeling the effects of the abuse he took unanswered.

Had Jamie Benn done that with Simmonds and Clifford in the line-up he might be missing a few teeth today, and most certainly would have been challenged to a fight.

Its great that Auston has added "hits and physical play" to his game to try and get his teammates more engaged physically, but he knows he has added help driving up the teams intensity level when Simmonds and Clifford are also sitting on the Leafs bench willing to do their parts as well.

I personally enjoyed this game the most of the Leafs 6 games this season, because I got to watch high impact real Hockey and not low contact figure skating.

Benn is as tough as either of those players. Retributiom is fun to watch, but doesn't change how Matthews is feeling today

 

[Ianturnedbull]

I respected my team… I was a very self aware physical scrub. I’m literally talking from experience.

Anyway, this conversation got way out of hand.

Simmonds had a great game, I hope he’s in for the next one.

Summary of my point: the Leafs need physicality in their Top 6, not on the 4th line.

I don't think I agree with you about Clifford. I'm not saying he's the answer, but he was not invisible. Yes. I wish TOR had a lot more jam in the top 6. That's Dubas' cross to bare. The likelihood of 1 or 2 players with physicality being injected into the top 6 is slim. I think they thought Thornton and Foligno could have done this, but it didn't work out. I also think that Matthews has tried to be a physical presence in early season and is now suffering an injury because of it.