Confirmed with Link: Nick Ritchie to Toronto (2x2.5M AAV)

[al secord]

Big, slow and takes dumb penalties.

But i guess if he's going to drop his gloves occasionally to hug an opposing player, it will make some of the meatheads happy.

 

[dubey]

Trash.

lottery pick incoming this season.

Here's the attention you're looking for

Hyman is significantly better than anyone we signed.

Our forward group isn't good as a whole, it's just not.

Probably should have stopped after the first part of this post. This forward group as a whole isn't good? lol

It definitely should be improved in the top 6 but to say it isn't good LOL

 

[TDotMassive]

Eh... Hyman is from another level.
This guy is slow, stone hands, takes stupid penalties, and he fanishes way to often...

He did score from PP last season but there were luck involved fanishes after that. Oh. He took stupid penalties though.

Second bad from Dubas in a row.

Fanishes?

 

[Mess]

I think you have to think of it as what the Core 4/Big 4 are likely to do for you and everyone else is window dressing.

Agreed, all the rest is simply “Rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic,” as the core 4 combined cap hits is the Iceberg and there is no way around it.

Every year as more and more player contracts come up and are due the middle is cut out and new deck chairs at cheaper prices are brought in as the next season sets sail.

Rinse and repeat... This year its Ritchie, Bunting, Kämpf, Gabriel, Menell, Kase, Mrazek IN and Hyman, Foligno, Galchenyuk, Thornton and Bogosian, Andersen out.

Last year it was Spezza, Simmonds, Thornton, TJ Brodie, Bogisian, Kerfoot, Clifford IN and Kapanen, Johnsson, Kadri, Moore Barrie, Ceci, Out.

Every year Leafs are tinkering around the edges trying to find cheaper contracts to replace the departed contracts which no longer fit under the cap in an effort to find that magic combination to surround the core 4 that those big 4 will carry the team to success.

This year we get to see what Ritchie, Bunting playing alongside the core 4 in the top 6 can achieve, but mostly come playoff time will it be the missing pieces to secure playoff round advancement?.

 

[HyperX]

Don Cherry will like this. 15 goals last year. Should be able to get 20 playing with 34 or 91.

Im not sure penciling Ritchie into a top-6 spot is likely or smart

 

[cupcrazyman]

When do you have to be under the salary cap ?

 

[al secord]

So you're saying if our elite 4 forward group including a rocket richard award winner and top 5 point getter go missing in the playoffs, we're doomed?

Ya don't say?

 

[Albus Dumbledore]

His career high is 15 goals last year. He certainly could score as much as Hyman but he’s shown no ability yet to do that on a consistent basis in his career so far.

Hymans career-high in goals is 21 at age 26. The same age Ritchie is turning this year. Goal-scoring-wise they're pretty close. Don't get me started on usage and teammates and stuff lol.

 

[cupcrazyman]

Im not sure penciling Ritchie into a top-6 spot is likely or smart

That's Keefes decision not ours.

 

[ToneDog]

Im not sure penciling Ritchie into a top-6 spot is likely or smart

Agreed but as of today he appears to be our best LWer. One could argue Kerfoot is better but Ritchie might be able to keep some of the flies off his linemates.

 

[123offtheglass]

When do you have to be under the salary cap ?

I think it's like day 1 of the regular season; believe you can go over salary cap by 10% during the offseason. Leafs are still just under though.

 

[kb]

Not if we're talking about Mess' scenario about activating Kase from LTIR for the playoffs.

Ah - that explains why the idea was stupid. Ruin any chance at adding at the deadline over a $1.25 million salary on LTIR?

Critical thinking is required.

 

[kb]

Hyman is significantly better than anyone we signed.

Our forward group isn't good as a whole, it's just not.

This is incorrect.

Did you not see Hyman post injury? He was a minimum salary player to end his tenure.

 

[Carltons Cup]

Nothing would please Leafs Nation more than Ritchie playing up to his high draft pedigree.

 

[ULF_55]

Hyman is significantly better than anyone we signed.

Our forward group isn't good as a whole, it's just not.

Then it wasn't good last year either.

Hyman isn't the difference between a good forward group and one that isn't good.

He's a support player who got to play with the 1st. line all-star in marner and the 2nd. line all star in Matthews.

 

[Wafflewhipper]

His career high is 15 goals last year. He certainly could score as much as Hyman but he’s shown no ability yet to do that on a consistent basis in his career so far.
Anyone expecting him to replace Hyman on the top line will likely be disappointed unless Ritchie turns out to be one of those very rare players who has an epiphany at 25.5 years of age.

I like having him better than Hyman obviously because of salary. He’s a different beast in the net front on our Powerplay. Nobody is going to start face washing him like we seen all to often from Hyman in front either even strength or powerplay. He won’t watch anyone run Matthews or Marner or Willy or Tavares.
He will hurt them if it happens. Like i said,i hope he comes in in great shape. Hyman isn’t making $5,500,000 today not being on the top line.Hymans game was as a for checkers energy guy for that top line.It turned in to money for Hyman. Ritchie helps the burden on Simmonds having to take care of everything. I like the threat he brings in many ways.

I like having Ritchie over Hyman. Great signing for team and player

 

[cupcrazyman]

Looking forward to see what the Leafs can do with Ritchie.Dubas can just keep the roster the way it is until his hand is forced to make a move.

 

[Cor]

You think Bunting can match Hymans 25-30 goal 55 point pace next Season?

Wow, I mean, I'd love to see that happen but that's quite the stretch.

Yes, I think playing with two 90-100 point players he can put up 50-60 points.

 

[93LEAFS]

Yes, I think playing with two 90-100 point players he can put up 50-60 points.

Hyman's production per 60 at 5v5 was comparable to someone like Landeskog who had comparable linemates to Hyman. I think people are sleeping a bit on how effective Hyman was at 5v5. Not that I'd be comfortable giving him the contract he got, but not anyone can be slotted in there and produce like Hyman while providing similar intangibles.

 

[Wafflewhipper]

Im not sure penciling Ritchie into a top-6 spot is likely or smart

He was top 6 in Boston last year and had a good year. Boston spreads it around and are pretty stingy on icetime and he was 5th in forwards icetime 15:22 but no Boston forward had 19:00 per game average.
He could have a career year and will help the team big time. I wager he out scores Hyman if anyone wants to take that bet

 

[Mess]

Salary cap issues or not, in a vaccum the Hyman and Foligno deals are poor and I don't think Dubas would have signed those deals anyways.
It's not a salary cap thing, it's a value thing.

You'd have to agree that there's more value in paying Bunting, Kase and Ritchie 4.5 million than having paid Hyman and Foligno almost 10 million. And that's not even considering term on Hyman.

No question, there is more value in the current groups contracts in a vacuum, with the disclaimer based on their NEW contracts. That's great to compare new contracts to new contracts to prove that point of bang for your buck contract wise. But these aren't the Droids you're looking for.

However real apples to apples comparison in terms on impacting the Leafs roster via the changes its really OLD former contracts (previous contribution at that price point) vs expected contribution of the New ones. Did the Leafs get better or worse talent wise as a team?

ie Where Hyman at $2.25 mil (43 games 15 goals 18 assists 33 points & +19) >>> Nick Ritchie at $2.5 mil (56 games 15 goals 11 assists 26 points & -7) . Will Ritchie match Hyman's departed totals now as his replacement? Ditto the rest etc.

You'd have to agree however also that Hyman, Foligno, Bogosian, Thornton, Galchenyuk etc have more value in actual contribution goals and assists (towards wins) etc than the new crew Ritchie, Bunting, Kampf, Gabriel. All you have to do is add up the points Out vs IN that you're also downgrading the surrounding cast talent and skill level to account for those new higher value contract signings.

That unfortunately is the trade off. Hyman >> Ritchie, Foligno >> Bunting, Thornton >> Kampf, Galchenyuk > Gabriel, Bogosian >> Menell etc.

If you were going into a playoff series based on contribution, experience, veteran leadership proven NHL talent would you prefer the OLD players at OLD prices, or the NEW players at New prices? This is the million dollar question we're about to find out in terms of team success going forward.

Hyman's new contract with Edmonton at $5.5 mil isn't really relevant (as that's Oiler's concern not Leafs) to the question did the Leafs get better by replacing his previous contribution @ $2.25 mil with Nick Ritchie at the same price point before and after now?

 

[Superstar]

Idk if something like this was posted or not but didn't want to scroll through 15 pages to see. I'd say that's a nice trade off considering we badly needed depth scoring in case our top line decides to no show again when it comes to scoring.

That would be quite a haul for Hyman if that was a trade...looks like a winner for the Leafs!

 

[HyperX]

He was top 6 in Boston last year and had a good year. Boston spreads it around and are pretty stingy on icetime and he was 5th in forwards icetime 15:22 but no Boston forward had 19:00 per game average.
He could have a career year and will help the team big time. I wager he out scores Hyman if anyone wants to take that bet

Not that I dont hope it works put for you, but I think Hyman is a decent bit more skilled

 

[Gary Nylund]

I also don't see how we're better today with Matthews making 11.634 and Marner making 10.893
I thought we were far better set up when they were on their entry level contracts...
What're we talking about here?lol

We were talking about this year's Leafs vs last year's Leafs. You mentioned Hyman at 5.5m cap hit and I pointed out that that has no relevance to the discussion as Hyman's cap hit was 2.25m not 5.5m. It's pretty straightforward stuff I think, hopefully that puts you back on track. And Matthews/Marner have the same cap hits as last year so again, that has no relevance to this discussion.

Outside of Hyman the rest of our complimentary players were pretty bad.

Vesey, Thornton, Foligno's short stint.

The Leafs downgraded on Hyman for sure, but have upgraded depth while keeping our D and G relatively intact.

More importantly Dubas targeted players that fit the roles.

Bunting - Agitating pest with offensive upside
Ritchie - Big bodied scoring winger that isnt afraid to get dirty
Kampf - Strong defensive C who can crush it on the PK; arguably our biggest need for years now.

Kase is a bit of a wildcard, he can be literally nothing or he can be a solid 3rd line offensive winger in the same role as Kapanen.

I see no reason to think the new bunch are any better, in fact I'd say that losing Hyman means we're more likely to be a bit worse than a bit better. Maybe not a huge swing either way but I see zero reason to claim we're better now. Hyman brought a ton to the team for a tiny cap hit, I doubt any of these new guys comes close to that.

Look at the guys we brought in. You can hope they'll do this and that and fit better and whatever else but we're talking about Nick Ritchie who hasn't exactly set the world on fire up to this point (and he's been around for a while now) and then a bunch of spare parts who we were able to sign for peanuts for the simple reason that there wasn't a single team in the league who thought they worth more than peanuts.

This team I'd say is roughly on the same level as last year's team and is likely to finish somewhere in the 6-10 range overall. Then in the playoffs, who knows. These new guys aren't likely to move the needle for us, our best chance of being better I'd say is Marner who can't possibly be as bad as he's been. In the playoffs his production went down by more than 50% from the regular season, he took what might be the dumbest penalty in Maple Leafs history when he went brain dead at a crucial time and wasn't even under a ton of pressure and in general, he looked like a boy playing with men who was afraid to get hit. If next season a miracle happens and he plays closer to the 1st team all-star that excelled during the regular season then we're a much better team. How likely that is to happen - I have no idea but if he was even a little bit better then we would have at least gotten past MTL.

 

[Havoc]

Agreed, all the rest is simply “Rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic,” as the core 4 combined cap hits is the Iceberg and there is no way around it.

Every year as more and more player contracts come up and are due the middle is cut out and new deck chairs at cheaper prices are brought in as the next season sets sail.

Rinse and repeat... This year its Ritchie, Bunting, Kämpf, Gabriel, Menell, Kase, Mrazek IN and Hyman, Foligno, Galchenyuk, Thornton and Bogosian, Andersen out.

Last year it was Spezza, Simmonds, Thornton, TJ Brodie, Bogisian, Kerfoot, Clifford IN and Kapanen, Johnsson, Kadri, Moore Barrie, Ceci, Out.

Every year Leafs are tinkering around the edges trying to find cheaper contracts to replace the departed contracts which no longer fit under the cap in an effort to find that magic combination to surround the core 4 that those big 4 will carry the team to success.

This year we get to see what Ritchie, Bunting playing alongside the core 4 in the top 6 can achieve, but mostly come playoff time will it be the missing pieces to secure playoff round advancement?.

Well good thing real life doesn't work the same as Xbox. I think you're looking at the "deck" as a bunch of interchangeable ratings when it's much more complicated than that.

Leafs are 1-2 guys away that give more value than their contract + core clicking + no injuries from making a deep run.

Signing guys with upside who are hitting their prime is a very good route to take when you already have pieces other teams are dying to have.