League News: NHL Talk - (News n' Scores n' Stuff) | 2024-25 Summer Edition

[BobRouse]

James Dolan is the Man!!! Love that guy!

Up there with Dan Snyder and Woody Johnson as impact sports owners of all time.

Read Mercagliano’s article and did t realize how important Sather was to them in terms of keeping Dolan impulses at bay.

Sorry Rongo fans

 

[hb13xchamps]

Merry Christmas……you’re fired. Absolute brutal timing for a team that has been dogshit for the majority of the year. Seems a little too late.

Also we’ve seen how many guys get chances now who have had success from AHL/CHL/NCAA gigs. Bruce and Carbs immediately from our system. Plus Jared Bednar, Jon Cooper, Knoblauch last year, Jim Montgomery etc.

Then you have long time assistants like Evanson and Berube get their chances. There’s definitely success stories for sure

 

[AlexModvechkin8]

Yeah that’s lazy reasoning IMO…but hey….I’m open to proof that that’s how the interview/selection process works.

And just being knowledgeable about a sport, playing a sport at a high level doesn’t qualify you to lead a team as a successful HC….ask #99.

Lazy or realistic? Is it more realistic to think an entire generation of coaches don’t know the game well enough and can’t interview well enough to get an NHL HC job or that older, entrenched GMs prefer to hire the older, entrenched guys they came up with?

I grant you there’s certainly a level of experience that experienced hires bring but those retreads were once first time head coaches too.

What’s the last example of a retread coach actually working out? Paul Maurice is the obvious answer but besides him. Trotz for a bit in New York? Mike Sullivan was a first time HC. So was Jon Cooper. Ryan Suska, Jim Hiller, and obviously Carbs have the Flames, Kings, and Caps playing way better than anyone gave them credit for. Sheldon Keefe broke the first round curse for the Leafs. Kris Knobloch came in as a first time head coach and had the Oilers within a game of winning the Cup.

Every situation is different and both new and old coaches will and won’t work out for various reasons but I don’t agree with the assertion that younger coaches aren’t getting opportunities because they’re lesser qualified or bad interviewers, there’s too strong a track record of recent first-time coaches having significant success for that to be the reason.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

Lazy or realistic? Is it more realistic to think an entire generation of coaches don’t know the game well enough and can’t interview well enough to get an NHL HC job or that older, entrenched GMs prefer to hire the older, entrenched guys they came up with?

I grant you there’s certainly a level of experience that experienced hires bring but those retreads were once first time head coaches too.

What’s the last example of a retread coach actually working out? Paul Maurice is the obvious answer but besides him. Trotz for a bit in New York? Mike Sullivan was a first time HC. So was Jon Cooper. Ryan Suska, Jim Hiller, and obviously Carbs have the Flames, Kings, and Caps playing way better than anyone gave them credit for. Sheldon Keefe broke the first round curse for the Leafs. Kris Knobloch came in as a first time head coach and had the Oilers within a game of winning the Cup.

Every situation is different and both new and old coaches will and won’t work out for various reasons but I don’t agree with the assertion that younger coaches aren’t getting opportunities because they’re lesser qualified or bad interviewers, there’s too strong a track record of recent first-time coaches having significant success for that to be the reason.

Sullivan retread (was the Bruins HC long before Pens)…hired by Pitt and won immediately.

Laviolette HC at NYI, hired by Carolina won year 2.

Cassidy HC at Bos, hired by Vegas won immediately.

Sutter retread, hired by LA, won immediately.

Trotz, retread, won year 4.

Julien retread, won year 4.

Quenneville retread, won year 2.

Maurice, retread, won year 2.


Cooper first won in his 8th season, Bednar his 6th.

This covers all the Cups back to 2006…

Seeing a pattern?

(Edited for spelling and accuracy)

 

[Ridley Simon]

Yeah… no. It’s because nobody got fired for hiring IBM but they did get fired for hiring the unknown startup. Even if IBM f***ed the job up they could say they did their diligence and went with the safest pick with the longest track record.

You mean to tell me you actually think that somehow there’s a 20-year gap where coaches in their 20s, 30s, and early 40s who played and coached the game in the modern era are less knowledgeable about the sport than guys who played in the 70s and 80s and all interview poorer than the old retreads?

I know you like taking the contrarian view on things but sometimes it’s really just Occam’s Razor. The most likely scenario is the old GMs continue to hire names they’re familiar with and think somehow it’ll work out better for them.

NHL GMs hiring new coaches is essentially just this scene on repeat.

Well — we did win our only Cup, with a recycled coach.

So there is that.

Edit — and yes I am a tad bit late to this party

 

[twabby]

Coaches should have zero playing experience IMO.

New GM hires shouldn't even know what hockey is.

 

[kicksavedave]

Well — we did win our only Cup, with a recycled coach.

So there is that.

Edit — and yes I am a tad bit late to this party

I mean, we won with a recycled coach, but apart from Barry we went through a ton of first time NHL coaches with varying degrees of success. Cassidy, Hanlon never did much. Gabby won in the RS but not in the playoffs. Hunter and Oates didn't really work out, then Trotz finally broke through, but then Rierden stunk. Carbs would be breaking a trend if he can deliver the ultimate goal... even if he can't, he's clearly a great coach who is pulling all the right strings.

I think its fair to say the NHL loves to recycle coaches, but the reason for that is probably a lot more varied than just one answer. But in general, @twabby answer is the right one, NHL GMs aren't always very good.

 

[Empty Goal Net]

Expansion has meant that fringe players and coaches continue to get consideration and a spot on a roster or behind the bench. Sometimes a 'safe' choice works, sometimes not. Age/experience by themselves are not necessarily disqualifying criteria, but often seem to be overrated by those making the decisions. Napkin guy was hired out of the minors, and finally won a cup a couple of decades later.

 

[Ridley Simon]

I’ve said it before. I will say it again. Ted and Dick (George?) made some crap hires for HC’s.

Like bad, really bad. The lucked into Gabby, as he was NOT some “master stroke”, but just a guy that wanted to move up. Career coach and all.

GMBM got Trotz
Then Reirden
Then Laviolette
Now Carbs

GMBM has made 75% the correct hires, at the correct times.

 

[usiel]

I’ve said it before. I will say it again. Ted and Dick (George?) made some crap hires for HC’s.

Like bad, really bad. The lucked into Gabby, as he was NOT some “master stroke”, but just a guy that wanted to move up. Career coach and all.

GMBM got Trotz
Then Reirden
Then Laviolette
Now Carbs

GMBM has made 75% the correct hires, at the correct times.

Always, always hindsight 20/20 but man was Reirden a mistake with still some peak years from a stanley cup winning team. Covid years even now seem inexplicable the Caps couldn't jell. Lavi seemed like it was a good pick but somewhere in the caps management they didn't have a feel for the existing culture to take the team where it needed to go.