NHL attendance down, everything else up

[guyincognito]

While the rest of your post may very well be valid, could you please not use as a source the TMR numbers, whose invalidity has been demonstrated approximately 684 times on this very forum?

and are in this case.

the only seats in the Prudential Center that are below $48.50 or whatever number he quoted are the 200 level seats, which are all $35 except for the small day of game sections.

we do not have a big 200 level. maybe 4,000 seats, maybe a little less than that.

every other seat in the building is at least $56. the price points are lower than the used to be though, when the Devils tickets (not counting the hocus pocus these studies use) were one of the most expensive tickets around anywhere.

so, there's no way it's $48.50, I've been down this road a bajillion times and I think the old average was between $75-80. it's lower than that now.

 

[MAROONSRoad]

Could Atlanta's attendance actually end up lower than Phoenix?

The official NHL announced numbers so far this season are as follows:

Coyotes: 9,911

Thrashers: 13,511

However, anytime you watch the games or highlights this year, the lower bowl at Philips Arena in Atlanta appears to be half full at best with very large swaths of empty seats (see my above link to Thursday's game, for example).

GHOST

 

[IslesDude]

To be fair the last two games were probably Atlanta's worst of the year in terms of attendance.

 

[GSC2k2*]

they have to advertise like crazy.

You're right, of course. They probably haven't thought of that.

 

[LadyStanley]

http://network.nationalpost.com/np/...2/05/NHL-attendance-continues-to-decline.aspx

National Post on attendance thus far

 

[vivianmb]

You're right, of course. They probably haven't thought of that.

from what i've read about their marketing dept. maybe they haven't.

 

[Enstrom39]

I would argue that Atlanta doesn't have more choices than Detroit, there are similar choices however. The real issue is not to compare Detroit or Buffalo to Atlanta. Business competition is tough, whether looking at sports entertainment or any other business.

Disagree. Having grown up in Michigan you can't go golfing in December and enjoy it, you can in Atlanta. Lots of days where you can do outdoor activities in the middle of winter.

Atlanta's attendance woes are well documented in this forum. Several of the complaints from Thrasher fans is that the team isn't marketed well. I'm not sure about any of you guys but when I see a Toronto Raptors commercial to buy X amount of tickets for X amount of dollars, I don't care. Quite frankly, I don't even care if its advertising Marlies tickets. I'm making this point to the fact that I'm sure Atlanta is running commercials and quite expectantly the people of Atlanta don't care.

My suggestion is this: Go to high traffic areas (Malls, Parks, Tourist Destinations, etc.) and set up a booth. Include the NHL10 video game, have clips of bone crushing hits, sick moves, and Ilya Kovalchuk roofing the puck into the corner from the blueline, and most importantly give away some tickets properly. Have say 1000 free tickets to the booth per day. Have games to compete to who gets the tickets. Have a convincing sales person that GETS IN YOUR FACE.

People don't want to notice hockey in Atlanta? Give them no choice. Draw them in.

/rant.

That's a nice idea, but I actually feel sorry for the marketing people of the Thrashers.

You can only dress up a turkey so many ways. For 10 years they have been out there trying to sell tickets to a "losing" franchise. That's 10 years of negative branding.

People say "the ownership isn't serious about winning" or "the GM is incompetent." Neither ownership nor the GM has changed--so you can't use that as a selling point. The only thing you can do is begin winning.

And a good 2 months in 2009 is only a down payment on un-doing the negative brand label that has been created over the past 10 years. Those marketing people have a task that will only get easier with a sustained improvement on the ice--and the marketing department has no control over that.

 

[CanadaBacon]

When i flew to Florida in Feb i had a stop over in Atlanta. They had Kovy posters ALL OVER the airport.

I dont really have a point

 

[CanadaBacon]

Do you all realize how self conscious we have gotten as a society where we will only support something if it is "winning". Like that makes us better people, or we had something to do with said team actually "winning".

Mod: deleted.

 

[vivianmb]

saturday night ...6 games in the NHLdraw less spectators than what the MTS Centre in winnipeg's capacity (15003)
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[guyincognito]

http://network.nationalpost.com/np/...2/05/NHL-attendance-continues-to-decline.aspx

National Post on attendance thus far

someone should explain to the writer that the Caps are in the Southeast Division.

edit: never mind, didn't see the "almost". still, poorly written. it either is or it isn't, almost is only good in horseshoes and hand grenades. and Washington is proof positive that debacles can be fixed.

 

[CanadaBacon]

saturday night ...6 games in the NHLdraw less spectators than what the MTS Centre in winnipeg's capacity (15003)
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Now someone is going to point out the location of these teams

 

[MAROONSRoad]

http://network.nationalpost.com/np/...2/05/NHL-attendance-continues-to-decline.aspx

National Post on attendance thus far

saturday night ...6 games in the NHLdraw less spectators than what the MTS Centre in winnipeg's capacity (15003)
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Note, however, that the above-linked article and attendance figures refer to the official NHL "announced attendance" numbers which don't necessarily reflect a) actual paid attendance or b) actual turnstile count. In addition, they say nothing about the average ticket price in various markets, which varies substantially.

GHOST

 

[MAROONSRoad]

Here is the Coyotes' record so far this season:

Western Conference
Team GP Pts
1. * San Jose 31 43
2. * Chicago 28 39
3. * Calgary 28 39
4. Colorado 31 38
5. Los Angeles 30 37
6. Phoenix 29 35
7. Nashville 29 34
8. Dallas 29 34
9. Vancouver 29 32
10. Detroit 28 31
11. Columbus 29 31
12. St. Louis 27 29
13. Minnesota 28 29
14. Edmonton 29 28
15. Anaheim 28 25
* = Division Leader

And the official NHL attendance last night for the Coyotes' home game win over the Senators: 8,642.

Link:

http://www.nhl.com/ice/boxscore.htm?id=2009020425

GHOST

 

[Enstrom39]

Here is the Coyotes' record so far this season:



And the official NHL attendance last night for the Coyotes' home game win over the Senators: 8,642.

Link:

http://www.nhl.com/ice/boxscore.htm?id=2009020425

GHOST

Are you being intentially obtuse or do you know understand that an entire summer devoted to bankruptcy hearings is about the worst marketing campaign a franchise could have?

Remind me again what happened to Jets attendance after it was announced they were likely to move? Did they go up or down? Not exactly rocket science.

 

[GetPucksDeep]

saturday night ...6 games in the NHLdraw less spectators than what the MTS Centre in winnipeg's capacity (15003)
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The NHL plays a preseason game in Winnipeg in 2006 - attendance - 15,015. A sell-out.

They come back in 2008, attendance - 12,621.

and then again in 2009. Curiously, the wiki for the MTS centre, which reads like a shill for bringing the NHL back to Winnipeg, doesn't mention the attendance for this year's pre-season NHL game. I wonder why? I guess because the economy is in the tank, the same reason attendance is down all over.

A little googling and I found the number. 11,644. That's pretty pathetic for hockey attendance in Canada in a town where the NHLers only come once a year. Mod: deleted.

 

[GSC2k2*]

The NHL plays a preseason game in Winnipeg in 2006 - attendance - 15,015. A sell-out.

They come back in 2008, attendance - 12,621.

and then again in 2009. Curiously, the wiki for the MTS centre, which reads like a shill for bringing the NHL back to Winnipeg, doesn't mention the attendance for this year's pre-season NHL game. I wonder why? I guess because the economy is in the tank, the same reason attendance is down all over.

A little googling and I found the number. 11,644. That's pretty pathetic for hockey attendance in Canada in a town where the NHLers only come once a year.

Indeed. Rather than quoting the capacity of the MTS Centre, since that number seems to be irrelevant in terms of MTS attendance (and, as some posters are only too fond to point out 800-900 times, that is only ANNOUNCED attendance, and MTS actual attendance was undoubtedly supplemented by comps when they realized it would be low, and God only knows who actually attended), perhaps future posters should only note which NHL games had less than 11,644. Or perhaps who is AVERAGING less than 11,644. Or perhaps who has had a total of 11.644 in attendance this year.

 

[berklon]

A little googling and I found the number. 11,644. That's pretty pathetic for hockey attendance in Canada in a town where the NHLers only come once a year.

That's pretty good considering it's not actually their team they're watching. Give Winnipeg a team, and attendance will be close to capacity every game.

All we keep hearing are excuses for Atlanta, Florida, etc for attendance. All they need to do is win. The problem is even if they won a cup - they'll drop back down to poor attendance when the team starts losing. Carolina's been to the finals twice, winning the cup once - and look at their attendance. NJ has a long history of winning, and look at them. Colorado is already suffering and they're actually doing decent this year. That's the problem - hockey isn't important enough in many US markets for people to support losing teams, even after having great success.

Maybe the answer is to treat hockey like wrestling. Have different titles given out. We could have Stanley Cup champions, Intercontinental champions, US champions, and even a pairing of teams to get a Tag-Team champion. This will increase the odds that those poor markets will field winners - since not every team can win the Cup every year.

Hey, it works for wrestling... it draws better in the US than hockey.

 

[Foy]

That's pretty good considering it's not actually their team they're watching. Give Winnipeg a team, and attendance will be close to capacity every game.

All we keep hearing are excuses for Atlanta, Florida, etc for attendance. All they need to do is win. The problem is even if they won a cup - they'll drop back down to poor attendance when the team starts losing. Carolina's been to the finals twice, winning the cup once - and look at their attendance. NJ has a long history of winning, and look at them. Colorado is already suffering and they're actually doing decent this year. That's the problem - hockey isn't important enough in many US markets for people to support losing teams, even after having great success.

Maybe the answer is to treat hockey like wrestling. Have different titles given out. We could have Stanley Cup champions, Intercontinental champions, US champions, and even a pairing of teams to get a Tag-Team champion. This will increase the odds that those poor markets will field winners - since not every team can win the Cup every year.

Hey, it works for wrestling... it draws better in the US than hockey.

No it doesn't. And it's not even close. The WWE may have up to 8 events a week, 50 weeks of the year. It's probably lower than that when you figure a couple of European tours, etc. Less than a quarter of those events sell out, and most of them are in arenas that hold far less than your average NHL arena.

400 events a year, smaller arenas and crowds than the NHL on average.

In the US, there are 24 teams, with each one hosting 41 games a year, for more than double the events of 984.

People think of wrestling crowds and they think of the once a week television tapings and PPVs. They don't realize that large portions of the arena at many of those shows is roped off because they couldn't sell them. They don't realize that they sell the tickets that the cameras pick up first so that the crowd looks big. They pump in extra noise through the telecast.

And then they spend half of their dates playing at places like where they are this weekend:

Friday: Texarkana, Ark
Saturday: Bossier, City Louisiana
Sunday: Monroe, Louisiana
Monday: Beaumont, Texas and Dallas, Texas
Tuesday: Houston Texas. I don't think most of those places have NHL-capacity arenas, no offense attended to the locales.

 

[Hollywood3]

The NHL plays a preseason game in Winnipeg in 2006 - attendance - 15,015. A sell-out.

They come back in 2008, attendance - 12,621.

and then again in 2009. Curiously, the wiki for the MTS centre, which reads like a shill for bringing the NHL back to Winnipeg, doesn't mention the attendance for this year's pre-season NHL game. I wonder why? I guess because the economy is in the tank, the same reason attendance is down all over.

A little googling and I found the number. 11,644. That's pretty pathetic for hockey attendance in Canada in a town where the NHLers only come once a year. Mod: deleted.

There was a lot of buzz when Edmonton played Phoenix a few years ago. But I can tell you the typical fan here has yawned at subsequent games. Many would only go watch a certain team and others would rather save their money for the AHL.

 

[bigtimehockeyfan]

Teams like the Yotes and Thrashers are really setting the NHL back after all the good momentum it has gained since the lockout.

You know it's only a matter of time until ESPN starts talking about it, even though the NBA has just as many bad markets going.

 

[Chives]

Teams like the Yotes and Thrashers are really setting the NHL back after all the good momentum it has gained since the lockout.

You know it's only a matter of time until ESPN starts talking about it, even though the NBA has just as many bad markets going.

What about the Avs and Islanders? Why do they get a free pass? Just because they have a history?

 

[bigtimehockeyfan]

What about the Avs and Islanders? Why do they get a free pass? Just because they have a history?

The Isles have bad attendance for obvious reasons. Old building, high ticket prices, no name players. It's been that way for years now.

When the Isles had cheap student tickets going, they'd get 90 percent capacity on weeknights. Then that all ended.

The Avs is a bit of a mystery, but I'm sure it has to do with the front office pretty much sending the message to fans they are in a full-fledged rebuild mode by trading Smyth this summer after tanking in last place.

The Thrashers are practically giving away tickets, and they made some nice off-season signings. Fans have no excuse to stay away. The only excuse is their is not a big enough fanbase IMO.

 

[Fugu]

Red Wings play in one of the oldest arenas, and in a city whose downtown died 30+ yrs ago. The arena was blamed for the Pens' woes for a while, until they got two franchise players and a Cup.

 

[btn]

The Isles have bad attendance for obvious reasons. Old building, high ticket prices, no name players. It's been that way for years now.

When the Isles had cheap student tickets going, they'd get 90 percent capacity on weeknights. Then that all ended.

The Avs is a bit of a mystery, but I'm sure it has to do with the front office pretty much sending the message to fans they are in a full-fledged rebuild mode by trading Smyth this summer after tanking in last place.

The Thrashers are practically giving away tickets, and they made some nice off-season signings. Fans have no excuse to stay away. The only excuse is their is not a big enough fanbase IMO.

I suggest you take a look at the Thrashers annual attendance figures since the lockout and then get back to us.

You obviously have no idea what you are talking about when it comes to who has good attendance and who does not. There are three teams with worse attendance than the Thrashers this year....and only once have the Thrashers been in the bottom two in annual attendance since the lockout.

Instead of just picking on random southern teams, do a little research before you start accusing teams of making the NHL look bad.