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NHL attendance down, everything else up

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leek said:
So will you spend the money for the full 45 game Red Wings tickets as the economy catches up, or will you still be thinking about splitting 10-20 games with your dad?

The fact that the Red Wings have succeeded without any legitimate contribution from you doesn't make you superior to Atlanta fans who do the same things you do does it?
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He lives in one of the most depressing cities in the world. He needs someone to beat up on.

I remember a radio interview with Stan Kasten after he left the employ of Turner. He talked about the difficulty of attracting fans to Atlanta sporting events because of...

1 - the huge choice of sports in this town to go to (much more than Detroit.)
2 - the great weather that gives people lots of other choices for things to do (golf in December!)

His final quote really stuck in my mind.

"The backyard of the average Atlantan is practically nicer than the average country club in Buffalo."
 
LetNoneIn said:
He lives in one of the most depressing cities in the world. He needs someone to beat up on.

I remember a radio interview with Stan Kasten after he left the employ of Turner. He talked about the difficulty of attracting fans to Atlanta sporting events because of...

1 - the huge choice of sports in this town to go to (much more than Detroit.)
2 - the great weather that gives people lots of other choices for things to do (golf in December!)

His final quote really stuck in my mind.

"The backyard of the average Atlantan is practically nicer than the average country club in Buffalo."
Click to expand...

I would argue that Atlanta doesn't have more choices than Detroit, there are similar choices however. The real issue is not to compare Detroit or Buffalo to Atlanta. Business competition is tough, whether looking at sports entertainment or any other business.


It's really, "What does Atlanta Spirit need to do to make their NHL business successful?" Posters mentioned above that they have an ad agency that has no clue, it's possible customer service people who are perhaps unfamiliar with the team according to another post, and the real bottom line is the arena has a lot of empty seats game after game. Clearly their marketing is not doing the job. How can they fix it?
 
leek said:
I would argue that Atlanta doesn't have more choices than Detroit, there are similar choices however. The real issue is not to compare Detroit or Buffalo to Atlanta. Business competition is tough, whether looking at sports entertainment or any other business.


It's really, "What does Atlanta Spirit need to do to make their NHL business successful?" Posters mentioned above that they have an ad agency that has no clue, it's possible customer service people who are perhaps unfamiliar with the team according to another post, and the real bottom line is the arena has a lot of empty seats game after game. Clearly their marketing is not doing the job. How can they fix it?
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Leek, great post.
 
leek said:
So will you spend the money for the full 45 game Red Wings tickets as the economy catches up, or will you still be thinking about splitting 10-20 games with your dad?

The fact that the Red Wings have succeeded without any legitimate contribution from you doesn't make you superior to Atlanta fans who do the same things you do does it?
Click to expand...


I wasn't talking about split 10-20 games, I was talking about getting 2 ST for 10-20 games. Now I have too wait just a little while longer because we are hearing of possible transfers within the company I work for. Heck I may end in your neck of the woods at our Coshocton mill.
 
yooper wings fan said:
I wasn't talking about split 10-20 games, I was talking about getting 2 ST for 10-20 games. Now I have too wait just a little while longer because we are hearing of possible transfers within the company I work for. Heck I may end in your neck of the woods at our Coshocton mill.
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Then it's important to support them now while you can isn't it? I mean you wouldn't want to be like those Phoenix and Atlanta fans who don't support their team would you?

I checked for you, while it's not as good as the whole 45 game season ticket package, they will gladly sell you the Yzerman 19 game for this year. You get to pick 19 of the remaining games. I checked and you can get two seats to 19 games for only $2166.00 if you buy the most expensive ones available in the plan. I gotta admit, those tickets are very affordable. That's only $57 per ticket! You'll never get a deal like that in Columbus if you move to Coshocton.
 
leek said:
I would argue that Atlanta doesn't have more choices than Detroit, there are similar choices however. ..
Click to expand...


Okay - state your case. Here's mine.

Atlanta

1 Braves
2 Hawks
3 Falcons
4 Thrashers
5 SEC Football
6 ACC Football
7 ACC Basketball
8 NASCAR
9 Pro Golf

Detroit

1 Tigers
2 Pistons
3 Lions
4 Red Wings
5 Big 10 Football


What am I missing?
 
LetNoneIn said:
Okay - state your case. Here's mine.

Atlanta

1 Braves
2 Hawks
3 Falcons
4 Thrashers
5 SEC Football
6 ACC Football
7 ACC Basketball
8 NASCAR
9 Pro Golf

Detroit

1 Tigers
2 Pistons
3 Lions
4 Red Wings
5 Big 10 Football


What am I missing?
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6 UM hockey
7 MSU hockey
8 Big 10 Basketball (UM/MSU) (MSU won national championship 8 years ago and lost in the final last spring)
 
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yooper wings fan said:
6 UM hockey
7 MSU hockey
8 Big 10 Basketball (UM/MSU) (MSU won national championship 2 years ago)
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Actually Sparty won the NCAA tournament 9 years ago, and went to the finals this year. The Wolverweenies won the NCAA in 1988 and made several final fours as well.

NASCAR
If you want to break up NCAA sports by league then:

CCHA
WCHA
Pro Golf- Hey I realize Atlanta has AAC and Eastlake. How about Oakland Hills and Inverness?

Major US sports markets all have many choices, whether it's Atlanta, Detroit, Phoenix, LA, Boston, Philly etc. I think one could easily argue that cities like NY, Philly and Boston have many more competitive offerings than most others, but it really doesn't matter.

What do businesses like the Thrashers and others have to do to make their business a success? Everybody has competition. The Red Wings need to compete with other sports offerings like the Pistons/Wolverweenies/Lions/Tigers etc. The Thrashers need to compete with the Ramblin Wreck/Dawgs/Braves/Hawks/Falcons etc., as well as other entertainment options is each city. Each either takes enough of the discretionary dollars or they fail.

I'll repeat this for emphasis:

What do businesses like the Thrashers and others have to do to make their business a success?

In fact you could substitute any franchise in this question (Panthers, Blue Jackets, Bobcats, Grizzles, Thunder and on and on).
 
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leek said:
Actually Sparty won the NCAA tournament 9 years ago, and went to the finals this year. The Wolverweenies won the NCAA in 1988 and made several final fours as well.

NASCAR
If you want to break up NCAA sports by league then:

CCHA
WCHA
Pro Golf- Hey I realize Atlanta has AAC and Eastlake. How about Oakland Hills and Inverness?

Major US sports markets all have many choices, whether it's Atlanta, Detroit, Phoenix, LA, Boston, Philly etc. I think one could easily argue that cities like NY, Philly and Boston have many more competitive offerings than most others, but it really doesn't matter.

What do businesses like the Thrashers and others have to do to make their business a success? Everybody has competition. The Red Wings need to compete with other sports offerings like the Pistons/Wolverweenies/Lions/Tigers etc. The Thrashers need to compete with the Ramblin Wreck/Dawgs/Braves/Hawks/Falcons etc., as well as other entertainment options is each city. Each either takes enough of the discretionary dollars or they fail.

I'll repeat this for emphasis:

What do businesses like the Thrashers and others have to do to make their business a success?

In fact you could substitute any franchise in this question (Panthers, Blue Jackets, Bobcats, Grizzles, Thunder and on and on).
Click to expand...
they have to advertise like crazy.
 
vivianmb said:
they have to advertise like crazy.
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I don't agree. It's much more complex than just advertising.

Let's use Winnipeg as an example. Most Winnipeg posters believe every single game would be a sell out if they get a team. Now imagine it's October and the Blue Bombers have a game around the same time as a "Jets" game. How do the Blue Bombers get enough people to fill their stadium? What if the Bombers are in the Grey Cup finals at the same time as a Jets home game. How do they fill the MTS Centre? I doubt just advertising gets it done, not at an efficient rate anyway.
 
leek said:
I don't agree. It's much more complex than just advertising.

Let's use Winnipeg as an example. Most Winnipeg posters believe every single game would be a sell out if they get a team. Now imagine it's October and the Blue Bombers have a game around the same time as a "Jets" game. How do the Blue Bombers get enough people to fill their stadium? What if the Bombers are in the Grey Cup finals at the same time as a Jets home game. How do they fill the MTS Centre? I doubt just advertising gets it done, not at an efficient rate anyway.
Click to expand...

The CFL would likely go out of its way to accommodate the NHL game and the NHL game vice versa if its something like the Grey Cup. Much like what the NHL does when the World Series is on.
 
htpwn said:
The CFL would likely go out of its way to accommodate the NHL game and the NHL game vice versa if its something like the Grey Cup. Much like what the NHL does when the World Series is on.
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What if they don't?
Solve the problem. Many markets are in a position that they must compete for the customer.

You think the NFL gives a crap when an NHL game is played?
Life's a competition. Businesses need to roll up their sleeves and compete.
 
From NHL.com

Through November, NHL® teams played to 91.3% capacity, the second-highest percentage capacity through the comparable number of games in the last four seasons.

Through November, 17 teams played to more than 95% capacity at home.

Teams with year-to-year gains in attendance through November include the Boston Bruins, Columbus Blue Jackets, Florida Panthers, Los Angeles Kings, New Jersey Devils, St. Louis Blues and Washington Capitals.
 
Wetcoaster said:
Compared to Vancouver your tickets are cheap as I understand it - when you can actually get a ticket to a Vancouver game.

We have capped our season tickets and have very few single tickets available. There is also about a 5-7 year wait for even partial season tickets. Canucks Full, Half Season, 15 and 11-game Ice Paks are sold out and the season ticket base for General Motors Place has been capped at 17,000 with a seating capacity of 18,800 so there are less than 2000 single game tickets available to the general public. Every game has been sold out since 2002.

BTW you have to pay to get on the wait list (called the Blue Line) for any sort of season ticket or pak and pay a yearly fee to keep your place in line.

In comparison our cheapest ticket is $55.00 and that is in Canuck bucks. Yours looks to be $35 for the equivalent.

Your lower level corners and ends can be had for $79 - in GM Place that same seat would cost you $131.50.

According to this chart the average ticket in New Jersey is $48.05 for this season and in Vancouver $62.05. Vancouver is second only to Toronto.
http://www.andrewsstarspage.com/ind...erage_ticket_prices_since_1994_95/119-2008-09
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Yes, I think we can safely say that Vancouver and its province are a better hockey market than New Jersey. I don't see your point at all.
 
odgersfan83 said:
Was at the Thrashers game last night. Crowd was VERY light, as have been all of the weeknight games this year.

The Thrash's marketing department needs to start giving away A LOT of comp tickets to weeknight games, especially when we play teams like the Islanders, Panthers, Hurricanes (no offense to fans, but these teams don't bring in a lot of away fans). There are sections up top behind the goals where there are literally 5-10 people sitting in the entire section. Why not give those away? Not only does it fill the arena, but you get a whole new group of people to experience the game and hopefully get them to come back...
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I just don't see or hear much effective marketing for The Thrashers this year outside of a big push in radio interviews. The team just isn't visible, and the news doesn't cover them at all...they insist on covering every fart and hangnail that these College Football morons have, but the Hawks could win the NBA and they'd give it thirty seconds.

I hate to say it, but if the freakin' ECHL Gwinnett Gladiators weren't in the Atlanta suburbs, attendance would be up a couple thousand. The Gladiators' attendance is off too - but in 2008 they were drawing 5,600 a game. At least half of those people would be going to Thrashers' games if the Glads weren't around. I'm part of the problem, because I love going to the Glads games - very passionate and hockey-smart fans and a better energy than Philips Arena: more intimate.
 
leek said:
What if they don't?
Solve the problem. Many markets are in a position that they must compete for the customer.

You think the NFL gives a crap when an NHL game is played?
Life's a competition. Businesses need to roll up their sleeves and compete.
Click to expand...

No the NFL doesn't give a crap but the CFL will. Why? Simple, reschedule your game or lose money. The Jets should be more popular then the Bombers. The Grey Cup I can see the NHL at minimum adjusting the start times as they do the same thing for the world series.

------

Now on another note:

Atlanta's attendance woes are well documented in this forum. Several of the complaints from Thrasher fans is that the team isn't marketed well. I'm not sure about any of you guys but when I see a Toronto Raptors commercial to buy X amount of tickets for X amount of dollars, I don't care. Quite frankly, I don't even care if its advertising Marlies tickets. I'm making this point to the fact that I'm sure Atlanta is running commercials and quite expectantly the people of Atlanta don't care.

My suggestion is this: Go to high traffic areas (Malls, Parks, Tourist Destinations, etc.) and set up a booth. Include the NHL10 video game, have clips of bone crushing hits, sick moves, and Ilya Kovalchuk roofing the puck into the corner from the blueline, and most importantly give away some tickets properly. Have say 1000 free tickets to the booth per day. Have games to compete to who gets the tickets. Have a convincing sales person that GETS IN YOUR FACE.

People don't want to notice hockey in Atlanta? Give them no choice. Draw them in.

/rant.
 
htpwn said:
No the NFL doesn't give a crap but the CFL will. Why? Simple, reschedule your game or lose money. The Jets should be more popular then the Bombers. The Grey Cup I can see the NHL at minimum adjusting the start times as they do the same thing for the world series.
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I think you totally missed my point. Don't get caught up in specifics. I used Winnipeg as an example because I was responding to Vivian and wanted to make this point: There is a finite amount of discretionary income available for entertainment. The Thrashers need to capture enough to succeed. Every business needs to capture enough top line to succeed.

------

Now on another note:

Atlanta's attendance woes are well documented in this forum. Several of the complaints from Thrasher fans is that the team isn't marketed well. I'm not sure about any of you guys but when I see a Toronto Raptors commercial to buy X amount of tickets for X amount of dollars, I don't care. Quite frankly, I don't even care if its advertising Marlies tickets. I'm making this point to the fact that I'm sure Atlanta is running commercials and quite expectantly the people of Atlanta don't care.

My suggestion is this: Go to high traffic areas (Malls, Parks, Tourist Destinations, etc.) and set up a booth. Include the NHL10 video game, have clips of bone crushing hits, sick moves, and Ilya Kovalchuk roofing the puck into the corner from the blueline, and most importantly give away some tickets properly. Have say 1000 free tickets to the booth per day. Have games to compete to who gets the tickets. Have a convincing sales person that GETS IN YOUR FACE.

People don't want to notice hockey in Atlanta? Give them no choice. Draw them in.

/rant.
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Now there is an idea. Thank you. You might see your post as a rant. I think it's constructive.

You are in Hamilton, I think the Blue Jays are a good comparable to the Thrashers, except they've actually won a championship. The Jays had 48,000 on opening day. After that 23,000 was a good crowd, until closing day which was their second biggest crowd at 39,000. What would the Jays have to do to fill the Skydome/Rogers Centre for the majority of their games, instead of just opening day?
 
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leek said:
You are in Hamilton, I think the Blue Jays are a good comparable to the Thrashers, except they've actually won a championship. The Jays had 48,000 on opening day. After that 23,000 was a good crowd, until closing day which was their second biggest crowd at 39,000. What would the Jays have to do to fill the Skydome/Rogers Centre for the majority of their games, instead of just opening day?
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Put a sheet of ice in the Skydome and become a professional hockey team? :sarcasm:

..........

Re. discussion of the Atlanta Thrashers' attendance woes above, see the NHL.com highlights of last night game:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvaKv0v30yw

GHOST
 
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