Next World Cup

[Albatros]

Come on, you know fans would rather see better players play in better leagues. If you can't tell the significant talent and quality difference between SHL and NHL games then you are a casual fan at best.

And yes, while the NHL has expanded into new regions. Same market revenue is up consistently over time.

Expansion and moving teams to more viable markets is ONE reason for revenue growth, what is your point?

How many sports fans in North America would watch the SHL if they had all the best Swedish players, or even the best players in the world for that matter? Hardly anyone at all, maybe a few hockey hipsters as an extremely small-time version of the North American EPL fans. Just like the overwhelming majority doesn't give a damn about how the NPB compares to the MLB. If an Ohtani comes over and makes it big then and only then they may take interest in that individual. If he stays in Sapporo then absolutely no one will care about him even if by some objective metric he's the best player in the world.

 

[Albatros]

What about us Swedish-speaking Finns? We have lived in on the Finnish west- and southcoast probably longer than the Finnish speaking population has been here...

The Finns first arrived to the coasts of the Baltic Sea ca. 1000 BC, while the first Swedish colonies in the area were established in the 12th century as a part of the crusades, more than 2000 years later.

 

[Breakfast of Champs]

How many sports fans in North America would watch the SHL if they had all the best Swedish players, or even the best players in the world for that matter? Hardly anyone at all, maybe a few hockey hipsters as an extremely small-time version of the North American EPL fans. Just like the overwhelming majority doesn't give a damn about how the NPB compares to the MLB. If an Ohtani comes over and makes it big then and only then they may take interest in that individual. If he stays in Sapporo then absolutely no one will care about him even if by some objective metric he's the best player in the world.

A lot of it is the time zone, if the SHL or KHL or NPB etc were played at convenient times in NA more might watch , but you aren't going to have many people watching games that start at 1pm or whatever.

It's not that different from other countries either, lots of Japanese people are interested in the MLB but rarely actually watch the games because of the timezone. Exposure is often rooted in convenience, as big of a sports fan as you can be you still have to sleep or go to work etc.

 

[mattihp]

The Finns first arrived to the coasts of the Baltic Sea ca. 1000 BC, while the first Swedish colonies in the area were established in the 12th century as a part of the crusades, more than 2000 years later.

Not sure about the 12th century, considering the short distances through the respective archipelagos probably much earlier. But then we'd also have to look at the Swedish eastern coast; especially the area from Gävle in the north to Roslagen in the south where archeologists find a bit too clear influences from what is now Finland and Estonia.

And let us also remember that most swedish speaking finns aren't closer genetically to Swedes than Finnish speaking finns are. Language in Finland was much more a part of one's chosen identity than ethnic background. Swedish speakers became finnish speakers and vice versa. Once finnish names became more clearly see in the church books how the same family had their name translated to the other language in one branch and kept it in others - to a beginning as an identifier with the chosen language which then blurred more and more as time went on and the Finlandification caught on.

How many sports fans in North America would watch the SHL if they had all the best Swedish players, or even the best players in the world for that matter? Hardly anyone at all, maybe a few hockey hipsters as an extremely small-time version of the North American EPL fans. Just like the overwhelming majority doesn't give a damn about how the NPB compares to the MLB. If an Ohtani comes over and makes it big then and only then they may take interest in that individual. If he stays in Sapporo then absolutely no one will care about him even if by some objective metric he's the best player in the world.

This is so true. Many North Americans are NHL fans and not hockey fans.

 

[Breakfast of Champs]

Not sure about the 12th century, considering the short distances through the respective archipelagos probably much earlier. But then we'd also have to look at the Swedish eastern coast; especially the area from Gävle in the north to Roslagen in the south where archeologists find a bit too clear influences from what is now Finland and Estonia.

And let us also remember that most swedish speaking finns aren't closer genetically to Swedes than Finnish speaking finns are. Language in Finland was much more a part of one's chosen identity than ethnic background. Swedish speakers became finnish speakers and vice versa. Once finnish names became more clearly see in the church books how the same family had their name translated to the other language in one branch and kept it in others - to a beginning as an identifier with the chosen language which then blurred more and more as time went on and the Finlandification caught on.


This is so true. Many North Americans are NHL fans and not hockey fans.

You can't expect people in NA to watch games at those times though.

 

[jonlin]

The Finns first arrived to the coasts of the Baltic Sea ca. 1000 BC, while the first Swedish colonies in the area were established in the 12th century as a part of the crusades, more than 2000 years later.

Uncorrect. Swedish speaking ppl have actually populated the coastal regions of Finland long before any Finnish speaking ppl have lived there. Actually Finnish speaking ppl started to move to the coast a lot later than the crusades. There has always been swedish speaking ppl around the coasts of Baltic Sea. Even in Estonia there were settlements. In some regions of the Finnish coast there were like 10-20% Finnish speaking ppl like a few decades ago - Are you suggesting The Finns suddenly left the coast...
It was "christian Swedes" that came with the crusades. Long before that swedish speaking ppl lived on the coast. There are very much bronze-age finds in theese coastal regions ans thoose finds are from long before the crusades. It`s not like there wasnt a population before them...

 

[1878rgw]

Expansion and moving teams to more viable markets is ONE reason for revenue growth

I like the sport of hockey and don't care about more revenue, sure it should be enough for eveyone to avoid bankruptcy but every expansion is watering the sport product with players which will never play an NHL game in a 24 team league.

Europe has over 500 million people, US and Canada 370 million, the europeans love the IIHF tournament and it will be interesting to see what final has more tv attendance world wide.

Best on best at Olympic games yes please, World Cup of hockey with gimmick teams no thanks.

 

[Albatros]

Uncorrect. Swedish speaking ppl have actually populated the coastal regions of Finland long before any Finnish speaking ppl have lived there. Actually Finnish speaking ppl started to move to the coast a lot later than the crusades. There has always been swedish speaking ppl around the coasts of Baltic Sea. Even in Estonia there were settlements. In some regions of the Finnish coast there were like 10-20% Finnish speaking ppl like a few decades ago - Are you suggesting The Finns suddenly left the coast...
It was "christian Swedes" that came with the crusades. Long before that swedish speaking ppl lived on the coast. There are very much bronze-age finds in theese coastal regions ans thoose finds are from long before the crusades. It`s not like there wasnt a population before them...

Swedish-speaking people didn't populate even most of what is Sweden today at that point in time, but that's getting off topic.

(9th century)

 

[CutOnDime97]

Since in North America people speak English, Canada and the US should also have one team.

We could do just four teams:

North America (us, canada)
Scandinavia (fins, sweds, norway and dnmk)
Eastern Europe (slovaks, czech n russia)
Western Europe (austrians, swiss, germans)

You're overcomplicating things with 4 teams. We had this figured out years ago.

2 team system. North America vs the World.

 

[mattihp]

You can't expect people in NA to watch games at those times though.

Exactly. Because only Europeans would. Because we are fans of the game, not just one league

 

[Breakfast of Champs]

Exactly. Because only Europeans would. Because we are fans of the game, not just one league

No because people are busy at work lmao , I'd love to watch KHL or SHL games but those times in the day I am busy working.

 

[Silky Johnson]

How many sports fans in North America would watch the SHL if they had all the best Swedish players, or even the best players in the world for that matter? Hardly anyone at all, maybe a few hockey hipsters as an extremely small-time version of the North American EPL fans. Just like the overwhelming majority doesn't give a damn about how the NPB compares to the MLB. If an Ohtani comes over and makes it big then and only then they may take interest in that individual. If he stays in Sapporo then absolutely no one will care about him even if by some objective metric he's the best player in the world

I don't think Swedes should watch the NHL. I think more Swedes would watch domestic leagues if they were better. My point is that the NHL has done a very good job in building the best hockey league in the world.

I will be clear on this. I am happy about the current status quo. I don't care about Euro leagues or their fans. My point is/was that the IIHF is feckless organisation and the world championships don't mean shit or settle anything.

Many of you blame the NHL but that is because you are bitter and don't understand (or choose to not) their mandate and motivation. I for one applaud their efforts.

Swedish-speaking people didn't populate even most of what is Sweden today at that point in time, but that's getting off topic.

(9th century)

Show sources. Also, I'm sure everyone religiously followed those lines on maps.

 

[Albatros]

If you're interested in medieval history, Swedes and Getes did sail east around that time (Varangians) but primarily they navigated the great rivers of modern-day Russia and Ukraine towards Constantinople. Closest Varangian-ruled settlements to modern-day Finland were on the Neva and Lake Ladoga not far from the modern-day city of St. Petersburg. Staraya Ladoga probably the most significant of these. That being the case, much of the "Swedish" influence from that era in Finland is found in the east in Karelia due to (fur) trading links of local population with these settlements. Minor trade and slave raids occasionally took place also along the coasts, but these poor and sparsely populated areas weren't of much interest to the Varangians for any purpose compared to the wealths of the major Eurasian trade routes further southeast.

If you want a source that provides an overview try for example "Warfare, Trade or Colonisation? Some General Remarks on the Eastern Expansion of the Scandinavians in the Viking Period" by Ingmar Jansson.

 

[Tuoppi]

Uncorrect. Swedish speaking ppl have actually populated the coastal regions of Finland long before any Finnish speaking ppl have lived there. Actually Finnish speaking ppl started to move to the coast a lot later than the crusades. There has always been swedish speaking ppl around the coasts of Baltic Sea. Even in Estonia there were settlements. In some regions of the Finnish coast there were like 10-20% Finnish speaking ppl like a few decades ago - Are you suggesting The Finns suddenly left the coast...
It was "christian Swedes" that came with the crusades. Long before that swedish speaking ppl lived on the coast. There are very much bronze-age finds in theese coastal regions ans thoose finds are from long before the crusades. It`s not like there wasnt a population before them...

Here is an example from Parainen:

Parainen – Wikipedia

fi.m.wikipedia.org

And Kemiönsaari

Kemiönsaari – Wikipedia

fi.m.wikipedia.org

 

[Shocker]

Many of you blame the NHL but that is because you are bitter and don't understand (or choose to not) their mandate and motivation. I for one applaud their efforts.

It's to make the most amount of money, what a hard thing to grasp.

Also, pretty sure absolutely no one cares about what you think, so bringing up what you care about is useless information.

 

[Silky Johnson]

It's to make the most amount of money, what a hard thing to grasp.

Also, pretty sure absolutely no one cares about what you think, so bringing up what you care about is useless information.

I'd say that most NHL owners are in it for the prestige or love of the game as much as money. There are lost of ways to spent your billions with as good or better return.

As to my opinion, you read it and commented, so.....

 

[vorky]

While I do agree that the World Champs in their current format are a casual hockey vacation trip at best, this right here is the issue with the whole international hockey. The IIHF and IOC might dwell in corruption but the NHL having all the leverage has completely broken international hockey. They have this mindset that they "own" hockey and don't need to cooperate with the international organizations unless it's financially beneficial for them. This might be just fine for NA fans as that's just how team sports work in there but having no relevant international competition is alienating European fans.

Hockey is just in a weird spot as it has a big 4 league in NA but also has a credible international competition, which can't be said for any other sport. It makes the relationship between the NHL, the international organizations, the players and the fans kind of awkward.

True, but there is another reason as written by Zislis: hockey officials from Europe, running IIHF, are top-level bureaucrats in the worst sense of the word. You can't expect them to come up with new ideas to develop the game, to increase the influence of IIHF, or to cooperate with the NHL on anything (not my words!)

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

Exactly. Because only Europeans would. Because we are fans of the game, not just one league

Oh stop it, Listen i'm a fan of all leagues and I catch some SHL here and there especially playoffs but would Europeans watch the NHL if it was SHL level talent? I doubt it , if the best talent was in europe they would only watch euro hockey just like we do here.

Im talking about casuals of course not actual hockey fans who enjoy the sport and go on HFboards obviously people like me and you will watch the best league + show interest in others regardless of where it is

 

[Mathieukferland]

Apparently sources in the NHLPA say that the players will not accord to a World Cup if Russia is not involved…. I doubt there’s a World Cup in 2025

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

Hockey is in need of international hockey.

The development of hockey goes through the development of international competitions as is the case in Rugby, Handball and Volleyball.

But the NHL prevents that. The most beautiful potential posters in hockey are meetings between Canada, USA, Russia, Sweden whose potential level is higher than an NHL franchise.

 

[Jumptheshark]

Sounds like the NHL will f*** things up yet again.

They are trying to decide between 4 or 6 teams. Seriously the nhl has no idea how to grow the game on a global market.

The two countries that looks to be on the outside looking in sounds like Germany and the Swiss. By not having those 2 teams the NHL is leaving a lot of money on the table they could go home with.

For me here is what countries should be there
Canada
US
Finland
Sweden
Czechia
Swiss
Germany

With an 8th spot decided by a tournament where these guys play it out.
Slovakia
Latvia
Denmark
Norway

The under 23 and team Europe is a STUPID idea

 

[mattihp]

Sounds like the NHL will f*** things up yet again.

They are trying to decide between 4 or 6 teams. Seriously the nhl has no idea how to grow the game on a global market.

The two countries that looks to be on the outside looking in sounds like Germany and the Swiss. By not having those 2 teams the NHL is leaving a lot of money on the table they could go home with.

For me here is what countries should be there
Canada
US
Finland
Sweden
Czechia
Swiss
Germany

With an 8th spot decided by a tournament where these guys play it out.
Slovakia
Latvia
Denmark
Norway

The under 23 and team Europe is a STUPID idea

If not by your setup they just don't care about growing the game. Might just as well go with USA Red, White and blue, Canada Red and white and then Team Gatorade.

 

[Czechboy]

No Czechs seems to be a thought... Or some bastardized team again. f*** off NHL.

 

[Mathieukferland]

Sounds like the NHL will f*** things up yet again.

They are trying to decide between 4 or 6 teams. Seriously the nhl has no idea how to grow the game on a global market.

The two countries that looks to be on the outside looking in sounds like Germany and the Swiss. By not having those 2 teams the NHL is leaving a lot of money on the table they could go home with.

For me here is what countries should be there
Canada
US
Finland
Sweden
Czechia
Swiss
Germany

With an 8th spot decided by a tournament where these guys play it out.
Slovakia
Latvia
Denmark
Norway

The under 23 and team Europe is a STUPID idea

I still think the NHLPA rejects this if Russia is not involved, regardless whether the NHL is able to organize it at all

 

[Korpse]

The NHL sucks.