Movies: next James Bond will be .... War behind the scenes of the Franchise? update post 1

[DaaaaB's]

I dont watch Marvel movies and it's not like he's known for much other than a small handful of good movies.

Fair enough. I didn't even know he was in Marvel movies until today but I don't watch them either. Kick Ass and Nowhere Boy made him a pretty big name imo. Savages kind of sucked but he's been in a few other good movies since then. The point is that he's not a bad choice just because you've never heard of him.

 

[Bakayoko Ono]

I hope they’ll go with a lesser known name, a fresh face.

 

[kihei]

Pretty solid choice. He's a good actor but a level removed from Craig's chops.

 

[Osprey]

I'm not familiar with him, either, at least by name. I've seen a few of the movies that someone said that he's in, so maybe I'd recognize him, but I can't put a face to his name.

That's the thing that beats me about someone having an issue with changing Bond's ethnicity.

In what way is his ethnicity central and important to either the character or the plots?

It doesn't have to be. It's simply a matter of fans wanting beloved characters to stay somewhat consistent and recognizable. For over 70 years and two dozen movies, James Bond has been Caucasian. It should be easy to understand why people would like him to remain that way.

If we were talking about a reboot of Beverly Hills Cop, would you support the casting of a white actor as the new Axel Foley? Ethnicity isn't that important to that character or those plots, either. In fact, Sylvester Stallone was originally going to play him. Is it wrong to want Foley to remain black?

 

[Spring in Fialta]

I'm not familiar with him, either, at least by name. I've seen a few of the movies that someone said that he's in, so maybe I'd recognize him, but I can't put a face to his name.

It doesn't have to be. It's simply a matter of fans wanting beloved characters to stay somewhat consistent and recognizable. For over 70 years and two dozen movies, James Bond has been Caucasian. It should be easy to understand why people would like him to remain that way.

If we were talking about a reboot of Beverly Hills Cop, would you support the casting of a white actor as the new Axel Foley? Ethnicity isn't that important to that character or those plots, either. In fact, Sylvester Stallone was originally going to play him. Is it wrong to want Foley to remain black?

I mean, no, I still don't really get it - or I do, but not in any way that leads to a comfortable conclusion.

Bond and Foley's main characteristics have nothing to do with their skin color or ethnicity. If producers hire a smooth-looking black dude to play Bond (or or or) or a wise-cracking, goofy white dude to play Foley, I don't think it's any sort of big deal and I think one's a weirdo for feeling any strong way about it.

There is nothing but color that makes either of these characters inconsistent if you hire someone of a different ethnicity. It's the same character and it's the same movie. Nobody should cater to the weak biases of someone else.

 

[Pranzo Oltranzista]

I mean, no, I still don't really get it - or I do, but not in any way that leads to a comfortable conclusion.

Bond and Foley's main characteristics have nothing to do with their skin color or ethnicity. If producers hire a smooth-looking black dude to play Bond (or or or) or a wise-cracking, goofy white dude to play Foley, I don't think it's any sort of big deal and I think one's a weirdo for feeling any strong way about it.

There is nothing but color that makes either of these characters inconsistent if you hire someone of a different ethnicity. It's the same character and it's the same movie. Nobody should cater to the weak biases of someone else.

I'm not sure I agree on either stance. I think you'd have a huge backlash if you were to cast a white dude as Foley - and not just from "weirdos" per se. I also don't think the character would work as well, having a black cop from Detroit coming in 1984 Beverly Hills added to his otherness and that's easy comedy.

That being said, a black Bond works fine. I mean, white Foley works ok, you just couldn't have a white dude in the original movie and say you have the same result - IMO.

 

[StreetHawk]

I hope they’ll go with a lesser known name, a fresh face.

They always want a mid 30's year old Bond, given the experience they mentioned in Casino Royale, with the time at Oxford, Military and the amount training Bond and other 00's would have to go through. Not sure how possible that is for a lesser name to be that unknown at that age to score this role.

I'm in old school, keep the IP the way it was intended. Want a minority 00, create a character for 001 or 008 or something.

 

[Spring in Fialta]

I'm not sure I agree on either stance. I think you'd have a huge backlash if you were to cast a white dude as Foley - and not just from "weirdos" per se. I also don't think the character would work as well, having a black cop from Detroit coming in 1984 Beverly Hills added to his otherness and that's easy comedy.

That being said, a black Bond works fine. I mean, white Foley works ok, you just couldn't have a white dude in the original movie and say you have the same result - IMO.

I guess the difference here is that the character of Foley is so strongly attached to one specific actor in one specific period of time (Eddie Murphy in the 80s) which differentiates it from Bond (multiple actors across multiple periods of time) and that makes it slightly more difficult to reinvent but I don't think it couldn't be done. The changes are still pretty slight because the formula isn't that difficult to change in my opinion.

With that said, I still don't really see how a black Bond doesn't work or could upset anyone. I'm not saying it comes from a bad place but I'd definitely raise an eyebrow at someone who cares.

 

[Ben Grimm]

If it's Johnson, he's starring in Kraven the Hunter this year.

Kraven the Hunter (2024) | Action, Thriller

| R

www.imdb.com

 

[KallioWeHardlyKnewYe]

Despite just slagging Johnson the other day in the movies thread for his performance in Savages I think he's a perfectly fine choice. The performances of his that I've liked have veered more to scummy than suave.

 

[tacogeoff]

fine choice. he is going to do the part justice.

 

[NyQuil]

I assume he's cheap too.

 

[Unholy Diver]

Isn't he the kid who married a woman like 25 years older than him when he was around 20? Will he be capable of pulling off the typical Bond suaveness with the younger ladies? Or will Bond now have to be chasing women at the Bingo games?

 

[Pranzo Oltranzista]

Isn't he the kid who married a woman like 25 years older than him when he was around 20? Will he be capable of pulling off the typical Bond suaveness with the younger ladies? Or will Bond now have to be chasing women at the Bingo games?

Yes that's him. And I think he's sexy enough to steal both your wife and daughter. No worry.

 

[AtlantaWhaler]

He was awesome in Bullet Train (underrated movie).

 

[The Mars Volchenkov]

At this point, I'm sick of hearing about it. It's a fine casting. Just do it and get on with the next movie.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

I agree audiences will accept a change of age over ethnicity. But I would argue that Bond being an established, experienced agent is much more essential to Fleming's creation than the color of his skin.

If people truly feel established traits/canon/whatever shouldn't be muddled with then his age/experience SHOULD be a hands off issue too.

Of course it isn't but that's because some people don't care about all of Bond's traits they only care about one very specific trait.

This all could be moot of course. As we both noted "younger" doesn't necessarily mean "young."

Fleming did create Bond as a white male though. He's likened to the singer/actor Hoagy Carmichael in the books. That said, it sounds like TPTB have at least entertained a non-white Bond. I doubt they will do it for a number of reasons.

 

[StreetHawk]

Fleming did create Bond as a white male though. He's likened to the singer/actor Hoagy Carmichael in the books. That said, it sounds like TPTB have at least entertained a non-white Bond. I doubt they will do it for a number of reasons.

Should try to stay true to the IP. Can always make a 001 or some other character.

Fine with Taylor though I do think Cavill would make an excellent Bond. Guess it comes down to when they will begin shooting. Cavill is 40 so the longer they take to begin than his 3rd movie he’d be pushing 50.

 

[DaaaaB's]

Should try to stay true to the IP. Can always make a 001 or some other character.

Fine with Taylor though I do think Cavill would make an excellent Bond. Guess it comes down to when they will begin shooting. Cavill is 40 so the longer they take to begin than his 3rd movie he’d be pushing 50.

I don't understand why they need to "stay true" to the original character. I put that in quotations because they would be staying true other than him being black. It's not like having a black Bond was an option when the first book or movie was created.

I'm sorry but making a movie starring a black 001 character would be a horrible idea and not at all the same as having a black Bond. Now I'm not saying they have to have a black Bond, I really don't care what they do, just think people getting upset about the idea is bizarre albeit predictable.

 

[KallioWeHardlyKnewYe]

Fleming did create Bond as a white male though. He's likened to the singer/actor Hoagy Carmichael in the books. That said, it sounds like TPTB have at least entertained a non-white Bond. I doubt they will do it for a number of reasons.

Daniel Craig is a squat blonde. Connery is a strapping Scotsman (and wasn't liked by Fleming himself, at least initially). Brosnan is a lanky Irishman. Lazenby is Lazenby. Craig and Dalton are serious. Moore and Brosnan are not. Connery is a veteran. Craig is a rookie. Moore is horny. Craig gets attached and heartbroken. Shit, they gave him a f***ing kid in the last movie! A kid! James Bond has a child. Daddy Bond!

And I'm not sure how much any of them really look like Hoagy Carmichael.

They've played with so many aspects of Bond already from his look to his personality, many of such changes have never lined up with Fleming's vision. So that standard was stretched if not outright snapped long ago.

In period story going back to the 60s or something, I can see the argument for Bond's need to be white. But in a modern context there is ZERO reason why Bond can't be played by a person of color.

This is moot because I do agree they're probably never going to pull the trigger on that idea. But I don't for a second believe it's fealty to Ian Fleming's vision that's stopping them ...

 

[Rabid Ranger]

Daniel Craig is a squat blonde. Connery is a strapping Scotsman (and wasn't liked by Fleming himself, at least initially). Brosnan is a lanky Irishman. Lazenby is Lazenby. Craig and Dalton are serious. Moore and Brosnan are not. Connery is a veteran. Craig is a rookie. Moore is horny. Craig gets attached and heartbroken. Shit, they gave him a f***ing kid in the last movie! A kid! James Bond has a child. Daddy Bond!

And I'm not sure how much any of them really look like Hoagy Carmichael.

They've played with so many aspects of Bond already from his look to his personality, many of such changes have never lined up with Fleming's vision. So that standard was stretched if not outright snapped long ago.

In period story going back to the 60s or something, I can see the argument for Bond's need to be white. But in a modern context there is ZERO reason why Bond can't be played by a person of color.

This is moot because I do agree they're probably never going to pull the trigger on that idea. But I don't for a second believe it's fealty to Ian Fleming's vision that's stopping them ...

Fleming envisioned Bond as a white male. That's my only point. I guess it's up to each person to decide, including the Brocollis, how important that is to maintain.

 

[KallioWeHardlyKnewYe]

Fleming envisioned Bond as a white male. That's my only point. I guess it's up to each person to decide, including the Brocollis, how important that is to maintain.

All good.

I'm just saying Fleming envisioned a lot of things that haven't been honored or maintained ... from characters like Sheriff JW Pepper to Jaws falling in love to a para-surfing Pierce Brosnan to Bond and Blofeld being adoptive brothers.

This franchise abandoned fealty to the source material decades ago.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

All good.

I'm just saying Fleming envisioned a lot of things that haven't been honored or maintained ... from characters like Sheriff JW Pepper to Jaws falling in love to a para-surfing Pierce Brosnan to Bond and Blofeld being adoptive brothers.

This franchise abandoned fealty to the source material decades ago.

That's fair. The movies haven't always "stuck to the script" where Fleming's Bond is concerned although I think Craig's Bond was actually more of a return to form even if he isn't a dead ringer for the literary Bond. If one wants to think of Bond as more of a "concept" than sure, he (or even she) could come from any background. There's considerable risk in going that route though, which is why it hasn't been done.

 

[kihei]

The Guardian has presented a surprisingly (for them) vague teaser article with no real information claiming ATJ is off the candidate list and now the producers have to resume their search. No other news outlet even hints at this, but the The Guardian is one of the few impeccable sources around.

Keoghan, Madden, James Martin: who should be James Bond, if Aaron Taylor-Johnson is out?

Idris Elba has been waiting in the wings for years but perhaps the time has come for Matt Smith, Henry Golding … or a certain TV chef

www.theguardian.com

 

[Rabid Ranger]

The Guardian has presented a surprisingly (for them) vague teaser article with no real information claiming ATJ is off the candidate list and now the producers have to resume their search. No other news outlet even hints at this, but the The Guardian is one of the few impeccable sources around.

Keoghan, Madden, James Martin: who should be James Bond, if Aaron Taylor-Johnson is out?

Idris Elba has been waiting in the wings for years but perhaps the time has come for Matt Smith, Henry Golding … or a certain TV chef

www.theguardian.com

It sounds like ATJ doesn't want to commit to the franchise. Interesting.