By track record I mean experience too - maybe 'track record' wasn't the best terminology to use.
The roster/talent surrounding Winnipeg, Toronto and Edmonton hasn't changed a ton in the past 12 months has it? And in the summer majority opinion would have said
1. Edm 2. Tor 3. Winnipeg (or they'd be 5th or 6th)
now people say:
1. Winnipeg 2. Tor 3. Edmonton
Why? a year ago Winnipeg's current players sucked, could only score points but not win games and would never really amount to playoff success. And a year ago Edmonton's player were so good that they were bound to dominate their division and also playoffs for the next 5-7 years.
Now that the standings are different - the opposite is true?
now I don't want to alarm any one here but the reason Edmonton and Winnipeg have had this switcheroo in fortunes this season from last, is well, Matt hendricks. Hendo. The ol'man. No idea why... its just he is the common denominator.
Matt Hendricks, the magic man.
The Leafs are probably the team to beat as far as Canadian teams go. they are as deep up front as you can get, they have an elite goalie, Riely is developing into a #1 D man it appears they have every core piece you need
Jets say hello...
1st Line:
Connor > Hyman
Scheifele > Matthews
Wheeler > Nylander
2nd Line:
Perreault > Marleau
Little < Kadri
Roslovic < Marner
3rd Line:
Ehlers > JVR
Lowry < Bozak
Laine > Brown
4th Line:
Tanev = Komarov
Hendricks > Moore
Armia > Kapanen
I can go overkill and mention the Defence if you please... I mean yeah you have Rielly but let’s not forget both Byfuglien and Myers are currently better(Defensive Metrics are currently much better, while both boasting great Point numbers)...
You read the OP?The Leafs are probably the team to beat as far as Canadian teams go. they are as deep up front as you can get, they have an elite goalie, Riely is developing into a #1 D man it appears they have every core piece you need
You read the OP?
Performance today has nothing to with being the next canadian team to win a cup.
TML have the 1st rd curse, jets the 0 win curse, and evidentally for the Oilers- the "when we win we win, when we lose we win" curse. We show up and show up well in the playoffs, or win 1st overall and a potential Karlsson.
Oilers will be the next to win the cup. i would say 2 years.
Myers is not, and never has been better than Rielly, Perrault is not better than Marleau and never has been
I also like how you conveniently choose to compare Laine and Brown, comparing your franchise player to a 3rd liner good job.
Myers has less PPG, but lets not primarily judge them off of they’re secondary job(in scoring) but rather defensive shutdown game. Myers has a better oiSV%, lower amount of oiGA per 60 minutes(which means better than Riellys oiGA), he has more Blocks(pg) and more Hits(pg), so he does more. Myers has played nearly triple the PK minutes(so less sample size) and has nearly 1 point less of oiGA per 60 minutes and has a 90.9 our oiSV% on ice PK compared to Rielly’s 86.2 oiSV%. 5 on 5 Myers also has a better oiGA as well.. I mean yeah you could just look at points though, lol. Or judge them off they primary job and say who’s better at that.
oiGA = On Ice Goals Against(the goals that are scored while the players on the ice, the smaller the number the better)
oiSV% = on ice Save Percentage(the save percentage the team has while that player is on the ice, the higher the number the better).
Myers/Rielly Stats:
Tyler Myers Stats | Hockey-Reference.com
Morgan Rielly Stats | Hockey-Reference.com
Perreault is nearly better in every metric including points themself and has more 3 more points in 6 less games. I mean a 58.8 Corsi(it’s not a lucky year either he’s one of the highest corsi players in the league and has been for a while) to Marleau’s 49.1... I’ll just start with that and end with that because you know a guy is better in every metric when they nearly have 10+ corsi on them(you can look it up too he really does nearly sweep Marleau in most statistic metrics).
Perreault/Marleau Stats:
Mathieu Perreault Stats | Hockey-Reference.com
Patrick Marleau Stats | Hockey-Reference.com
To your Laine > Brown complaint I was only comparing the Lines/Depth chart(when healthy). Nothing was convenient and anyways if I was biasedly comparing I could had used many Jets forward over Brown for that one but I simply used the current lineup to be as fair as possible and to avoid bias.
Please dont pronounce someone better before you do your research.
Also I think it’s fair to say now that I proved you wrong that argument and this is how they unbiasedly compare:
Perreault > Marleau
Myers > Rielly
Not with Matthews being injury prone.
You realize you kill your argument with analytics, right? Nobody beyond a novice buys that ****. The only teams who use those numbers to evaluate players are the Coyotes and Panthers - look how that’s going.Myers has less PPG, but lets not primarily judge them off of they’re secondary job(in scoring) but rather defensive shutdown game. Myers has a better oiSV%, lower amount of oiGA per 60 minutes(which means better than Riellys oiGA), he has more Blocks(pg) and more Hits(pg), so he does more. Myers has played nearly triple the PK minutes(so less sample size) and has nearly 1 point less of oiGA per 60 minutes and has a 90.9 our oiSV% on ice PK compared to Rielly’s 86.2 oiSV%. 5 on 5 Myers also has a better oiGA as well.. I mean yeah you could just look at points though, lol. Or judge them off they primary job and say who’s better at that.
oiGA = On Ice Goals Against(the goals that are scored while the players on the ice, the smaller the number the better)
oiSV% = on ice Save Percentage(the save percentage the team has while that player is on the ice, the higher the number the better).
Myers/Rielly Stats:
Tyler Myers Stats | Hockey-Reference.com
Morgan Rielly Stats | Hockey-Reference.com
Perreault is nearly better in every metric including points themself and has more 3 more points in 6 less games. I mean a 58.8 Corsi(it’s not a lucky year either he’s one of the highest corsi players in the league and has been for a while) to Marleau’s 49.1... I’ll just start with that and end with that because you know a guy is better in every metric when they nearly have 10+ corsi on them(you can look it up too he really does nearly sweep Marleau in most statistic metrics).
Perreault/Marleau Stats:
Mathieu Perreault Stats | Hockey-Reference.com
Patrick Marleau Stats | Hockey-Reference.com
To your Laine > Brown complaint I was only comparing the Lines/Depth chart(when healthy). Nothing was convenient and anyways if I was biasedly comparing I could had used many Jets forward over Brown for that one but I simply used the current lineup to be as fair as possible and to avoid bias.
Please dont pronounce someone better before you do your research.
Also I think it’s fair to say now that I proved you wrong that argument and this is how they unbiasedly compare:
Perreault > Marleau
Myers > Rielly
I don't need to do research because I watch the games, with the eyes that are attached to my face, they eye test is what I trust because it's exactly that what I see, when Nazem Kadri put up his 39 and 45 point seasons a couple years ago, I was told he was a #1 center, some even said he was the level of Stamkos because the advanced stats said so, the thing is neither of those things ae true, he isn't a #1 center, he's a great #2 but not a #1, because #1 centers don't go through a stretch of 1 goal in 20+ games, that doesn't happen for them, it went through it, he came out of it and is now on fire, but if the advanced stats people were right and he was the guy they said he was, that 25 game stretch or whatever it was with 1 goal, doesn't happen.
I don't need to do research because I watch the games, with the eyes that are attached to my face, they eye test is what I trust because it's exactly that what I see, when Nazem Kadri put up his 39 and 45 point seasons a couple years ago, I was told he was a #1 center, some even said he was the level of Stamkos because the advanced stats said so, the thing is neither of those things ae true, he isn't a #1 center, he's a great #2 but not a #1, because #1 centers don't go through a stretch of 1 goal in 20+ games, that doesn't happen for them, it went through it, he came out of it and is now on fire, but if the advanced stats people were right and he was the guy they said he was, that 25 game stretch or whatever it was with 1 goal, doesn't happen.
You can say Morgan Rielly isn't as good as Myers all you want, and you can come up with any "advanced stat" you want as "proof"
Fact is the game comes down to 2 teams on the ice and whoever scores the most wins.
Give me the 2 way d man over the guy that plays good defense and doesn't score any day of the week, you know why? because the 2 way D man can do both, that is why they are called 2 way D men.
Myers is having a rebound season this year and that's great for him but he had about 4-6 year steady decline in his offensive numbers so he is going to have to show that this isn't a 1 off before I put him on Rielly's level.
You realize you kill your argument with analytics, right? Nobody beyond a novice buys that ****. The only teams who use those numbers to evaluate players are the Coyotes and Panthers - look how that’s going.
I actually agree that MP is playing better than Marleau, but the Rielly-Myers comparison is silly. Very silly.
....and with the amount of time you spent on all that nonsense, it might shock you to know it has no bearing on what actually happens on the ice.
OP- The Jets and Leafs are the only ones close. Flames are a whole lot of mediocre and the Oilers are pretty bad beyond their top end. Sens and Canucks aren’t winning anytime soon (or ever) but dark horse pick would be Montreal IF they can land Tavares this summer.
Jets are the deepest and most well rounded.
But I’ve seen stats posted that show Jake Gardiner as an elite defenseman and Nazem Kadri as an elite centre? If something can be so wrong, why would I ever trust it? I’ve looked at the formulas on how most of these numbers are calculated and never even finish, I just end up giggling and tossing them aside.Those aren’t even metrics really, they’re just stats that tell us whose been on the ice and let more goals in while doing so and what percentage of shots have been taken before there is a goal, and Myers has done better in that category compared to Reilly with less sample size as he is older(who knows Reilly might even one day become better but he’s not today).
Perreault is not “Playing Better” he simply is better. Look at the stats and watch them play, to be honest I don’t even like all that extra work in looking at all the extra metrics beyond basic stats and all the other stuff that comes with it(unless it is a defensemen I am judging in which you have to look at that to judge how good he is at defending) but people usually use them as a counter argument and I was strictly saying your not even gonna find a metric that Marleau is better at because Perreault is completely better.
It's good that you support your team and all, but that is very debatable. One could argue that the Leafs are just as deep, if not deeper.
Leafs have four 20+ goal scorers so far.
Jets have three.
Leafs have six guys on pace to score 20 goals.
Same with Winnipeg.
Leafs have three players with 30+ assists so far.
Winnipeg has two.
Leafs have ten players with 30+ points so far.
Winnipeg has nine.
And I'm sure arguments could be made to support your statement. Fact is......they are BOTH super close to each other. To call one "deeper & more well rounded" is not really true at this point. It's neck and neck.
Let’s see if the Leafs can get something similar to the 25/32 possible points (78%) when their 1C is out.
#HymanGauthierNylander
But I’ve seen stats posted that show Jake Gardiner as an elite defenseman and Nazem Kadri as an elite centre? If something can be so wrong, why would I ever trust it? I’ve looked at the formulas on how most of these numbers are calculated and never even finish, I just end up giggling and tossing them aside.
“Analytics, what a thing. Look at all the people who have jobs in hockey working analytics.... they don’t mean anything, but good for them!”
-Mike Babcock
You’re right about Perrault. I chose the wording of ‘playing better’ because Marleau is 38 years old and obviously not the player he used to be.. but aside from that, I’ve always been a MP fan and defended his deployment when a handful of Finnish posters felt Maurice was sabotaging Laine’s Calder run by playing Perreault. No arguments there.... but your Myers > Rielly theory is pretty sus.
Um. Yeah. Getting crunched between two players makes him "injury prone". That's right.
Shouldn't you be in the "worst Canadian team" thread?
I guess getting injured 3 times this year doesn’t count as injury prone guys.
You hypocrites can’t call Tanev injury prone if you think Matthews isn’t then. Tanev blocks pucks with his face etc