New GM Discussion Thread

[ECWHSWI]

You've said it before and I have echoed it myself. Have the Habs develop local talent and maybe, just maybe the best candidate for the job will be a french speaking quebecer.

All I want is for the Habs to hire the best people for the job regardless of language. This isn't a "HIRE AN ANGLO". This is "HIRE A THE BEST PERSON FOR THE JOB, REGARDLESS OF LANGUAGE".

If the Habs hire Quintal or Roy, I may have to retire from caring about the Habs. Lucky for me in December I will have a big change and it may be what the doctor ordered to be preoccupied with something more important in my life!

They used to do that not even that long ago...

I guess they're "developping" Lefebvre ?

 

[ColinO]

Unless Molson changes his requirements, a new GM is not going to make much of a difference. There will be no rebuild until the owner decides there will be one. Until then, a new GM will just keep doing the same types of things that MB has done - make moves designed to have the Habs continue to make the playoffs and hoping for the best when they get there. The time to tear it down was when MB took over but that is not what Molson wanted at the time and there is no real evidence that that is what he wants now. So the GM that is hired to replace MB is not going to be the one that tells Molson to tear it down - it'll be one that tells Molson he can make the team playoff competitive, not Cup competitive.

 

[ECWHSWI]

I do not agree the majority of Habs fans speak only French. I do not think most Habs fans even listen when their GM speaks.

I could care less if the GM speaks no English or French as long as the team is competitive and has a chance to with the Stanley Cup.

Speak to the fans? Who cares... the language of the Montreal Canadiens are Stanley Cup Championships.

you know full well it will never happen.

 

[Habs Halifax]

It's sad to say but I reluctantly admit that you guys were right all along. If we were in charge the Habs would be a competitive team.

BS. You think others can make dream moves and not get denied along the way. You also think a rebuild = success like the Pens, Blackhawks, Leafs, Oilers and not like the Avs, Canes, Sabres, Coyotes.

Just because it looks like a off year, it don’t mean we are doomed next year

 

[ECWHSWI]

all this language talks reminds me of when MB/MT were hired...

(dont remember if it was for GM or coach) but everyone was saying no more language requirement, Habs are at a disadvantage, blablabla... yet ROy was the consensus around here.

Right now, same stupid shit, people whine about the language requirement, yet consensus is Brisebois for GM...

 

[Lshap]

And they probably wouldn't do that. But in Montreal, if are indecisive between 2 or 3 candidates, you will take the local one. Thing is nobody can whine that we are missing so many candidates if they are unable to name me a few. Thing is, whether he had a big or a small implication as far as the farm team is concerned, but the farm team GM, Brisebois, saw that team reach The finals 2 times as well as being an assistant GM to a pro team that reached the Finals once and a 3rd round another time. And are about to be dominating once again this year. He's young. Know the implications of being a GM ins and outs. And yep...speak the language too. No idea who else you could find that has that kind of record. Would love to know a name or 2.

I've said this many times: Julien Brisebois sounds like a great choice, based on what we know. But that just it -- "What we know" should be the starting point for a search, not the end. You wanted names? Here are a few names with hands-on NHL success: Joe Will (San Jose), Bill Zito (Columbus), Bill Guerin (Pittsburgh), Randy Lee (Ottawa), etc. These guys (and a few more, probably) have deep experience with development, contract negotiations, scouting, etc. and some have already been pursued by other teams as potential GMs. Should the Habs NOT speak to them?

You made a great point in another post about the NHL's built-in prejudices against Russian/Scandinavian GMs. You're 100% right that there are probably some amazing candidates who are passed over because of ethnicity & language. That's a fault of the NHL's old-buy's club. The concern is that Montreal takes that fault even further -- we're not just ignoring European & Russian candidates, we're also ignoring almost all of North America.

 

[TheBuriedHab]

Give Steve Yzerman whatever he wants. Back the truck up and dump it on his front lawn. Brian Burke left the ducks for the leafs while still under contract, why can't we do the same. Just add President to his job title and call it a promotion.

 

[NotProkofievian]

I've said this many times: Julien Brisebois sounds like a great choice, based on what we know. But that just it -- "What we know" should be the starting point for a search, not the end. You wanted names? Here are a few names with hands-on NHL success: Joe Will (San Jose), Bill Zito (Columbus), Bill Guerin (Pittsburgh), Randy Lee (Ottawa), etc. These guys (and a few more, probably) have deep experience with development, contract negotiations, scouting, etc. and some have already been pursued by other teams as potential GMs. Should the Habs NOT speak to them?

You made a great point in another post about the NHL's built-in prejudices against Russian/Scandinavian GMs. You're 100% right that there are probably some amazing candidates who are passed over because of ethnicity & language. That's a fault of the NHL's old-buy's club. The concern is that Montreal takes that fault even further -- we're not just ignoring European & Russian candidates, we're also ignoring almost all of North America.

For coaches, Jukka Jalonen is probably the best coach not in the NHL right now. The only coach besides Babcock to have won both WJC and WHC Gold. I think his contract with Jokerit is up this year. There might have been a time when Montreal would be forward thinking enough to give him a shot, I don't know, but that time isn't now. It'll probably be a team like Carolina. They'll look really smart for doing it.

 

[Habs Icing]

Bobby Smith for GM! http://ourhistory.canadiens.com/article/Where-Are-They-Now-Bobby-Smith

I'm only half-kidding. He has GM experience, owns/manages the Mooseheads and had PK Subban as his favorite player at the time of this interview.

He actually speaks French.

 

[Habs Icing]

There are 30 Assistant GMs in the NHL. Is there a reason the Habs should speak to only one of them?

We have three assistant GMs and I think a lot of teams are doing the same dance as us, so there are probably more than 30 assistant GMs

 

[Habs Icing]

Give Steve Yzerman whatever he wants. Back the truck up and dump it on his front lawn. Brian Burke left the ducks for the leafs while still under contract, why can't we do the same. Just add President to his job title and call it a promotion.

Yzerman was hurt when the Habs didn't interview him to replace Gainey. He said as much in interviews. But that ship has sailed. Besides he doesn't speak French.

 

[Natey]

For coaches, Jukka Jalonen is probably the best coach not in the NHL right now. The only coach besides Babcock to have won both WJC and WHC Gold. I think his contract with Jokerit is up this year. There might have been a time when Montreal would be forward thinking enough to give him a shot, I don't know, but that time isn't now. It'll probably be a team like Carolina. They'll look really smart for doing it.

I don't think we can expect Molson to eat $50M.

If he fires Bergevin, I think he makes them keep Julien for at least another season or two. Eating so much money just doesn't seem like something that will happen.

 

[Habs Icing]

Okay so for everybody who is whining about the language issue....give me the names of the GM and coach you'd have that would be anglos. I'M waiting.

When Gainey stepped down was Yzerman considered? Nope. Why? Because.

It looks like we should have gone with him instead of The Ghost or MB. How do you know there isn't another Yzerman out there right now unless you look. And what's wrong with getting a Rutherford or Lamoriello?

You ask who is out there that's an Anglo? Well, if the priority is to have a French speaking GM then that colors your search.

 

[groovejuice]

I don't think we can expect Molson to eat $50M.

If he fires Bergevin, I think he makes them keep Julien for at least another season or two. Eating so much money just doesn't seem like something that will happen.

You need to balance that by asking just how much money might the team lose by continuing this abysmal, embarrassing play.

 

[NotProkofievian]

I don't think we can expect Molson to eat $50M.

If he fires Bergevin, I think he makes them keep Julien for at least another season or two. Eating so much money just doesn't seem like something that will happen.

The bill is getting quite large. Perhaps this will have knocked some sense into him. You don't extend a nobody-never-won-nothing GM for 5 years with 2 years left on his contract. It's almost biblical how it all happened: signs extension in November 2015, a few weeks later the bottom drops out and never really comes back.

 

[Lshap]

For coaches, Jukka Jalonen is probably the best coach not in the NHL right now. The only coach besides Babcock to have won both WJC and WHC Gold. I think his contract with Jokerit is up this year. There might have been a time when Montreal would be forward thinking enough to give him a shot, I don't know, but that time isn't now. It'll probably be a team like Carolina. They'll look really smart for doing it.

That's a great suggestion. Imagine if the Habs were at the forefront of bringing in new talent, rather than perceived as keeping talent out.

 

[Lshap]

We have three assistant GMs and I think a lot of teams are doing the same dance as us, so there are probably more than 30 assistant GMs

Good point. I was thinking of a few assistants who have direct experience with NHL contracts, scouting, & development -- the meat and potatoes of the job. I'm really no expert on this; there may be many other possibilities.

 

[Istvan]

I've said this many times: Julien Brisebois sounds like a great choice, based on what we know. But that just it -- "What we know" should be the starting point for a search, not the end. You wanted names? Here are a few names with hands-on NHL success: Joe Will (San Jose), Bill Zito (Columbus), Bill Guerin (Pittsburgh), Randy Lee (Ottawa), etc. These guys (and a few more, probably) have deep experience with development, contract negotiations, scouting, etc. and some have already been pursued by other teams as potential GMs. Should the Habs NOT speak to them?

You made a great point in another post about the NHL's built-in prejudices against Russian/Scandinavian GMs. You're 100% right that there are probably some amazing candidates who are passed over because of ethnicity & language. That's a fault of the NHL's old-buy's club. The concern is that Montreal takes that fault even further -- we're not just ignoring European & Russian candidates, we're also ignoring almost all of North America.

Sadly true about the old-boy's-club. The language issue..........flogging a dead horse. I wonder how the "Habs world" zeitgeist would shift if the Habs won the Cup with a Swedish coach, a Finn assistant coach and an anglo GM?

 

[Whitesnake]

I've said this many times: Julien Brisebois sounds like a great choice, based on what we know. But that just it -- "What we know" should be the starting point for a search, not the end. You wanted names? Here are a few names with hands-on NHL success: Joe Will (San Jose), Bill Zito (Columbus), Bill Guerin (Pittsburgh), Randy Lee (Ottawa), etc. These guys (and a few more, probably) have deep experience with development, contract negotiations, scouting, etc. and some have already been pursued by other teams as potential GMs. Should the Habs NOT speak to them?

You made a great point in another post about the NHL's built-in prejudices against Russian/Scandinavian GMs. You're 100% right that there are probably some amazing candidates who are passed over because of ethnicity & language. That's a fault of the NHL's old-buy's club. The concern is that Montreal takes that fault even further -- we're not just ignoring European & Russian candidates, we're also ignoring almost all of North America.

We are not ignoring anybody. Jim Nill was met. Now...if you want to reply that he was probably met to pretend that we are interested in something else than francos, well fine....there's nothing I can say now.

Thing is...if we do start with the fact that there's a positive prejudice in Montreal towards locals, for every Will, Zito, Guerin and Lee....tell me what they have that Brisebois doesn't? I'M NOT advocating to take a local for the sake of taking one. I would not suggeste to take Damphousse, Stéphane Richard or Guy Lafleur as GM because they speak the language. But in a time where a guy like Brisebois is around....I have no idea why we can't be confidence he wouldn't do a good job. He is employed and loved by the TBay management who is not a bad management. And he knows the ins and outs of the job too. So in an anglo world where for 2 similar candidates, they'll probably go with the anglo instead of the franco, in Montreal, we do the opposite.

Yep, the anglo pool is bigger but based on the success or lack thereof, strangely, the success rate isn't bigger. Not that long ago, at least in the regular season, the top coaches in the league were Vigneault, Julien and Therrien. Maybe if the francos would have more friends, we'd see more of them in the management too.

Mind you...the Montreal Canadiens ALSO have themselves to blame for the lack of possible candidates. They still employ, at the helm of their farm team a guy who has no business becomoing a head coach in the NHL. They go and get Nick Carrière as assistant, they still employ a guy who has no business being an assistant in JJ Daigneault.....it baffles me that in a time where the management know that they will have to go with locals....that they don't employ more of them, and the best of them.

 

[Lshap]

Sadly true about the old-boy's-club. The language issue..........flogging a dead horse. I wonder how the "Habs world" zeitgeist would shift if the Habs won the Cup with a Swedish coach, a Finn assistant coach and an anglo GM?

I remember the 1972 Summit Series and the discovery of how the Soviets play the game. It was like an alien spaceship landed on Earth and we gawked as they taught us their advanced technology. The NHL sucked up the Russian systems, and then of course sucked up their players. The NHL's learning-curve spiked pretty dramatically thanks to that influx of ideas and personnel.

I would absolutely love to see Swedish, Russian, Czech talent give a chance to tweak the tired old coaching and management templates. Prejudices die hard; the first teams to get past that will reap the benefits. Once the NHL embraces its international character it'll take its next learning-curve spike.

 

[Whitesnake]

When Gainey stepped down was Yzerman considered? Nope. Why? Because.

It looks like we should have gone with him instead of The Ghost or MB. How do you know there isn't another Yzerman out there right now unless you look. And what's wrong with getting a Rutherford or Lamoriello?

You ask who is out there that's an Anglo? Well, if the priority is to have a French speaking GM then that colors your search.

Why? Well because Gauthier was already in place, was loved by Gainey, Gainey still had a thing to say despite stepping down, and the ownership wanted the infamous continuity in mediocrity. That's why. As far as Yzerman vs Bergevin, I'm sorry, but us criticizing Bergevin RIGHT NOW has nothing to do with him being the wrong choice. It was seen by EVERYBODY as a great choice, even by a lot of executives throughout the league. We had to try him. We did. Time to move on. This whole "best candidate" is just way too tough to figure out. Not that long ago....Jim Nill was seen as a saviour....and then not so much...but now maybe he is. Dallas Eakings was seen as the next scotty Bowman. How that turned out to be? I had Jim Benning in my list of possible GM's....he was ridiculzed so much by the Nucks fans....still is...but now...maybe a little less. I think that you still can get somebody the media and the fans will like so that you have enough time to build a real plan. That's what hiring Beregvin was all about. But now, some just figured out that they guy had no plans. I believe Brisebois will have one. But do not underestimate the destruction that took place lately with how Bergevin dealt his cards....and lost...big time. We will have to give Brisebois ANOTHER 5 years.So might as well give it to him now. Let make him the guy who will explain to the people that we need to start from scratch. That's the only way. We might have 2 or 3 bad years coming. But will be ready to compete in year 4 That,s what TBay needed. 1 Stamkos, 1 Hedman and 1 Drouin. Everything else are great picks and great trades.

 

[Lshap]

We are not ignoring anybody. Jim Nill was met. Now...if you want to reply that he was probably met to pretend that we are interested in something else than francos, well fine....there's nothing I can say now.

Thing is...if we do start with the fact that there's a positive prejudice in Montreal towards locals, for every Will, Zito, Guerin and Lee....tell me what they have that Brisebois doesn't? I'M NOT advocating to take a local for the sake of taking one. I would not suggeste to take Damphousse, Stéphane Richard or Guy Lafleur as GM because they speak the language. But in a time where a guy like Brisebois is around....I have no idea why we can't be confidence he wouldn't do a good job. He is employed and loved by the TBay management who is not a bad management. And he knows the ins and outs of the job too. So in an anglo world where for 2 similar candidates, they'll probably go with the anglo instead of the franco, in Montreal, we do the opposite.

Yep, the anglo pool is bigger but based on the success or lack thereof, strangely, the success rate isn't bigger. Not that long ago, at least in the regular season, the top coaches in the league were Vigneault, Julien and Therrien. Maybe if the francos would have more friends, we'd see more of them in the management too.

Mind you...the Montreal Canadiens ALSO have themselves to blame for the lack of possible candidates. They still employ, at the helm of their farm team a guy who has no business becomoing a head coach in the NHL. They go and get Nick Carrière as assistant, they still employ a guy who has no business being an assistant in JJ Daigneault.....it baffles me that in a time where the management know that they will have to go with locals....that they don't employ more of them, and the best of them.

I know the push/pull in your post isn't directed at me personally, but I'll establish my own baseline for clarity. I'd love to get Brisebois, based on what I've heard. I was amazed the Habs got Julien, who I consider one of the top coaches in the league. I've defended Bergevin against what I've felt was unjust criticism, and only become frustrated with him the last two/three years. Even so, I think he was a good choice at the time, a better one than Jim Nill. Ironically, this past off-season was Nill's best and Bergevin's worst, but I'm not pronouncing final judgment yet.

My point is that I bristle against any prejudice, whether it's tilted in favour of one group, or against it. Ideally, the Habs open the GM interviews to international candidates as well as the current old-boy North Americans (which include francophones, by the way). I understand the natural tilt towards local talent, but the less of a tilt the better. Consider this: Great and mediocre teams are separated by relatively tiny statistical differences, where .3 of a goal and .010 SV% is the difference between a bubble team and the Cup champ. It's the same with GMs and coaches, where tiny differences separate the great ones from the mediocre. No team can afford to settle for "Almost as good". If Brisebois is the clear best, fantastic! If he's 'almost as good', then we're settling for a bubble-GM.

 

[Whitesnake]

I know the push/pull in your post isn't directed at me personally, but I'll establish my own baseline for clarity. I'd love to get Brisebois, based on what I've heard. I was amazed the Habs got Julien, who I consider one of the top coaches in the league. I've defended Bergevin against what I've felt was unjust criticism, and only become frustrated with him the last two/three years. Even so, I think he was a good choice at the time, a better one than Jim Nill. Ironically, this past off-season was Nill's best and Bergevin's worst, but I'm not pronouncing final judgment yet.

My point is that I bristle against any prejudice, whether it's tilted in favour of one group, or against it. Ideally, the Habs open the GM interviews to international candidates as well as the current old-boy North Americans (which include francophones, by the way). I understand the natural tilt towards local talent, but the less of a tilt the better. Consider this: Great and mediocre teams are separated by relatively tiny statistical differences, where .3 of a goal and .010 SV% is the difference between a bubble team and the Cup champ. It's the same with GMs and coaches, where tiny differences separate the great ones from the mediocre. No team can afford to settle for "Almost as good". If Brisebois is the clear best, fantastic! If he's 'almost as good', then we're settling for a bubble-GM.

Of course it's not directed at you. Now, define "as good" or "almost as good". Thing is, those things are in the eye of the beholder. And if it's Molson who judges this, pray to god that he won't be wrong about the new one. So just before something happens, I'm going in the record, just before people say that I'M always unhappy, that I would be thrilled to see Brisebois....but not that thrielld to see Roy. I want somebody who seemed to have the humility to admit his mistakes and move on. We hate a Bergevin that seemed to have become an egomanic as soon as he signed his extension...well I don't see how Roy doesn't already have the same personnality. I don't see Brisebois to be the same type of personnality and just to be sure that he never is....don't give him a 5-year contract. Coaches and GM's...should get 3-year contract. Never more than that.

 

[habdynasty]

I would make offers to the top gms in the league, offer them double their salary to come to Montreal. The richest team should have no problem with money . No salary cap for gms. The leafs got Lou from New Jersey. Ken Holland in Montreal would be great. I know the gms wouldn’t be available until the summer but that’s the way it goes. I am sick of seeing this gong show in Montreal.

 

[Lshap]

Of course it's not directed at you. Now, define "as good" or "almost as good". Thing is, those things are in the eye of the beholder. And if it's Molson who judges this, pray to god that he won't be wrong about the new one. So just before something happens, I'm going in the record, just before people say that I'M always unhappy, that I would be thrilled to see Brisebois....but not that thrielld to see Roy. I want somebody who seemed to have the humility to admit his mistakes and move on. We hate a Bergevin that seemed to have become an egomanic as soon as he signed his extension...well I don't see how Roy doesn't already have the same personnality. I don't see Brisebois to be the same type of personnality and just to be sure that he never is....don't give him a 5-year contract. Coaches and GM's...should get 3-year contract. Never more than that.

Agree 100% about Roy. One of my all-time favourite players; one of my all-time scariest executives.

As to how we define "as good" when comparing candidates, the only thing I'd ask is to measure only their job-related credentials.