Nathan Mackinnon's legacy is at a pivotal point

[AvroArrow]

"Mackinnon wasn't even that good, guy only had multiple 100 point seasons and finished 2nd in scoring behind arguably a top 3 European forward of all time"

Yeah no.

He's already a HOFer and established his legacy. Everything from this point on is gravy on top, I'm sure he and Avs fans don't give a shit about personal achievements, just the cup. I'd give up all of Matthews personal accolades for 1 cup.

 

[TruePowerSlave]

I mean you clearly just have a personal problem with MacKinnon or something lol. Bizarre. We can end this conversation here - I know I'd prefer to.

Yes really hate the guy who's jersey I own.

 

[Griff Tannen]

Kucherov is 3 points back, with 2 games in hand. He’s at about a 1.5 PPG pace. This will end up being the greatest Art Ross race finish ever

 

[a mangy Meowth]

Yes really hate the guy who's jersey I own.

Maybe it's one of those love-hate relationships

 

[TruePowerSlave]

Maybe it's one of those love-hate relationships

Nah those are reserved for women

 

[a mangy Meowth]

Nah those are reserved for women

The heart wants what it wants

 

[landy]

Mack didn't win the cup as the best player on the team. Makar took home the Smythe and there really was no debate about it.

Eichel didnt win the Conn Smythe either. Doesnt mean he wasnt deserving if it went that way.

And Mack showed up when it counted most in the clinching game. McDavid wishes he could say the same.

 

[the_fan]

Lady Byng is all that matters. Can Kucherov, McDavid, Draisaitl say they ever won the Lady Byng?

Nope

 

[COHawk]

He has 3 100+ point seasons, 1000+ points in his career at age 29.
Won a cup.
Won multiple awards (Calder, Byng, Lindsay, Hart)


What is this thread hahahaha

Only 12 players in history have had 3 straight 110+ point seasons. I think Mack is doing just fine.

 

[a mangy Meowth]

You already know what the storylines going into 2025-26 are going to be: “McDavid no longer the best player in hockey?” “McDavid not as generational as we thought?” etc.

Seen these already this year on several occasions, including during the 4 nations.

 

[landy]

Lady Byng is all that matters. Can Kucherov, McDavid, Draisaitl say they ever won the Lady Byng?

Nope

Anyone have any idea how the voting goes for this? Sure the same names are usually in the voting, but one player runs away with it year after year and it snot consistent


18-19: Barkov dominated
19-20: MacKinnon 64 to Matthews/ROR/Slavin 21/10/31
20-21: Slavin dominated
21-22: Connor dominated
22-23: Kopitar over J Hughes
23-24: Slavin dominated

Is it one thing they did that season? Specifically lack of PIM? Most points + least PIM?

 

[the_fan]

Anyone have any idea how the voting goes for this? Sure the same names are usually in the voting, but one player runs away with it year after year and it snot consistent


18-19: Barkov dominated
19-20: MacKinnon 64 to Matthews/ROR/Slavin 21/10/31
20-21: Slavin dominated
21-22: Connor dominated
22-23: Kopitar over J Hughes
23-24: Slavin dominated

Is it one thing they did that season? Specifically lack of PIM? Most points + least PIM?

Yeah, I think it’s just putting up points and not taking penalties. Pretty much what Lady Byng is about

 

[Dirty Mind]

Imagine if Makar outscores McDavid.

Wouldn’t be surprising at all. McDavid is having such an off-year it’s making people question if he’s really the best in hockey. Only played 63 games and other players are passing him fast.

Makar is already close and is a generational defenceman. He’s done things I haven’t seen since Bobby Orr and I do NOT make that comparison lightly.

I’m not old enough to have watched Orr play but watched lots of his clips, read a lot about his life… I truly consider Orr to be the best of all-time for the simple fact that he was the most unique player of all-time. As an Oilers fan.

A defenceman winning the Art Ross? Twice? While still playing an elite level defensively to the tune of +124?

The man was a ****ing unicorn.

Avs fans were probably choked after losing the 2017 draft lottery but they still got the best player at 4th, a guy who would have went first in many other drafts.

 

[Griff Tannen]

Gretzky is the best and if you think otherwise, you’re a contrarian for the sake of it

 

[Coffee]

Good thing legacies arent built by mesaage boards

It's very rare at least

 

[Voight]

McDavid os arguably the 5th best player of all time (or will be that by the time he retires) and MackInnon has outscored him twice now.

I think his legacy is fine.

 

[crowfish]

There is no chance this era will be remembered as a "big 3, 4, 5 or anything"; it will be remembered as McDavid and everyone else. The only people saying otherwise are the types who have the memories of goldfish and judge everything by what is happening at this exact moment. A good example is when people said Matthews & McDavid are "close" in 2021. It turns out they weren't! Or when MacKinnon was the new best player in the world last year (lol) and then McDavid gets 42 points in the playoffs and wins the Conn Smythe.

 

[I Hate Blake Coleman]

f*** a legacy

Iron Mike was right

 

[a mangy Meowth]

There is no chance this era will be remembered as a "big 3, 4, 5 or anything"; it will be remembered as McDavid and everyone else. The only people saying otherwise are the types who have the memories of goldfish and judge everything by what is happening at this exact moment. A good example is when people said Matthews & McDavid are "close" in 2021. It turns out they weren't! Or when MacKinnon was the new best player in the world last year (lol) and then McDavid gets 42 points in the playoffs and wins the Conn Smythe.

Thank you for your contribution

 

[crowfish]

What? MacKinnon’s legacy is already cemented; he has a Cup and a 50-goal, 140 point season.

You already know what the storylines going into 2025-26 are going to be: “McDavid no longer the best player in hockey?” “McDavid not as generational as we thought?” etc.

The accompanying reality to go along with those storylines:

1st Teams+Hart+Ross+Lindsay+Smythe leaderboard:

McDavid: 18
MacKinnon 8 (if he wins all 5 this year)

That's right, MacKinnon can sweep all 5 of those awards in one season (only done by Gretzky), and not even be at half of McDavid's career totals, all while starting his career 2 years earlier. Get those storylines ready!

 

[landy]

There is no chance this era will be remembered as a "big 3, 4, 5 or anything"; it will be remembered as McDavid and everyone else. The only people saying otherwise are the types who have the memories of goldfish and judge everything by what is happening at this exact moment. A good example is when people said Matthews & McDavid are "close" in 2021. It turns out they weren't! Or when MacKinnon was the new best player in the world last year (lol) and then McDavid gets 42 points in the playoffs and wins the Conn Smythe.

Wrong. If McDavid doesnt get a Cup or worse gets a Cup via Leafs/Matthews, it will be remembered for either the best player to never win or Leafs finally won with McDavid leading the charge or 2nd fiddle.

But in terms of players, if MacKinnon gets a few Harts and/or Cups, you bet your ass he will surpass McDavid who is falling off already this season.

O and you forgot to add lost a Cup while getting a Conn Smythe. People already forgot about that CS. Oilers fans want to hold onto the million points he got that playoffs for some weird reason.

 

[landy]

The accompanying reality to go along with those storylines:

1st Teams+Hart+Ross+Lindsay+Smythe leaderboard:

McDavid: 18
MacKinnon 8 (if he wins all 5 this year)

That's right, MacKinnon can sweep all 5 of those awards in one season (only done by Gretzky), and not even be at half of McDavid's career totals, all while starting his career 2 years earlier. Get those storylines ready!

Cup > everything when it comes to superstars. What would Sid or AO be if they didnt have the Cups?

 

[RussianBum86]

HE wasnt the best player in the nhl last year or this year. He isn't even the best player on his team.

 

[landy]

HE wasnt the best player in the nhl last year or this year. He isn't even the best player on his team.

He was last year, but ill give you Makar this year.

1. Makar
2. MacKinnon
3. Kucherov
4. Hellebuyck
5. Werenski
6. Draisaitl
7. Eichel
8. Marner
9. McDavid

 

[crowfish]

Wrong. If McDavid doesnt get a Cup or worse gets a Cup via Leafs/Matthews, it will be remembered for either the best player to never win or Leafs finally won with McDavid leading the charge or 2nd fiddle.

But in terms of players, if MacKinnon gets a few Harts and/or Cups, you bet your ass he will surpass McDavid who is falling off already this season.

O and you forgot to add lost a Cup while getting a Conn Smythe. People already forgot about that CS. Oilers fans want to hold onto the million points he got that playoffs for some weird reason.

Forget about betting my ass, I wish I could bet my life savings against every take you just wrote

Nathan MacKinnon is drawing dead to have a better all-time perception than Connor McDavid. McDavid has already done things MacKinnon could not and will never do (and we can bet on it if you disagree). Things like leading the league in goals/assists same season. Winning the Art Ross by 40 points more than the next highest non-teammate. Winning the MVP unanimously (AKA the Gretzky and McDavid only club)

MacKinnon is getting badly outscored by McDavid THIS SEASON with a goalie in the net. Remember you are the one saying MacKinnon is close to surpassing him and McDavid is already "falling off". You would think that fact would be devastating to such a claim

And the reason people reference McDavids' "millions of points" in that playoff run is because points are a much more sophisticated way to analyze how great a player is. You will notice Gretzky is 1st all-time in points/game, and yet not top 50 in Stanley Cup wins. Lemieux is 2nd all-time in points/game, and not top 100 in Stanley Cup wins. McDavid is 3rd all-time pts/game, and has never won the Stanley Cup. It's not remotely complicated as a concept: Cups = team stats, Points = individual stats. Players are individuals, not teams, and therefore individual stats/awards will always be more important for measuring ability.