This list looks great and im excited about a lot of the top end names. But looking at your op from 2015 is depressing. Im sure those names sounded good back then too...
Prospect Info: My Top 20 Hab Prospects List (Updated #538)
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This list looks great and im excited about a lot of the top end names. But looking at your op from 2015 is depressing. Im sure those names sounded good back then too...
montreal
Go Habs Go
- Mar 21, 2002
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I've been watching the system for over 20 years and while each year you feel that there are good ones that are going to help us out, I have never seen this many look with NHL upside. Doesn't really mean much if you can't develop them and the biggest part is how they continue to progress or not. It goes in stages and so far we are clearly headed in the right direction but things must continue to progress and staying healthy would help as I have never seen this many season ending injuries among the system.
26Mats
Registered User
- Jun 23, 2018
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We have depth of good prospects on D ( Romanov, Brook, Mete, Juulsen, Fleury, Harris, Norlinder, Struble), so it's nice to have D prospects with high ceilings, even if they're boom or bust
Yes, they are wildcards but they just completed their D+1 season so it is early in the curve. What is really encouraging in both cases is that they have moved to a much higher level and did very well. A guy that I was very high on, Brook , has struggled until later in the season in his transition to a higher level.
montreal
Go Habs Go
- Mar 21, 2002
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yes very early although for Norlinder he's a bit behind since he's only 3 months younger then Romanov so the fact that he was in Allsvenskan in his age 19 season is a bit troubling but the good news is that he's produced well when in Allsvenskan though in just 48 games overall. But that's what makes him such a wild card, we just don't have much data on him outside the J-20. I've been very impressed with him, so much so that I was considering him for the #1 spot before he got injured. So I don't want to get too carried away on him just yet until we see how he holds up in the SHL.
Brook was a huge disappointment, him and Poehling struggling like that was highly troubling though he did show improvement after a really poor start and later in the season when he was moved to the top pairing he was by far playing his best which was a great sign but still very concerning that the offense wasn't there and that he wasn't playing his kind of game. He's at his best rushing the puck up ice and while I saw flashes of it, it was just way too few and far in between. Hopefully he can add mass and strength with improved confidence and has a breakout year as I'm still really high on him but he's got to find a way to put up a lot of points.
montreal
Go Habs Go
- Mar 21, 2002
- 59,431
- 46,118
agreed, it's so deep that we have a really solid prospect in Fairbrother that many don't even talk about (granted the injury didn't help) I can't wait to see how they pan out.
dackelljuneaubulis02
Registered User
- Oct 13, 2012
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Nice top 20. Did Poehling, Brook and Fleury really underwhelm enough in the beginning of the year to have Ylonen ahead of them? Or are you just fairly high on Ylonen? For whatever reason, I've cooled on Ylonen a lot. The package is great but I do think there's something missing. I definitely haven't seen enough to say. Not saying you're wrong but I'm shocked to see Ylonen that high. It's kind of exciting though hahaha.
dackelljuneaubulis02
Registered User
- Oct 13, 2012
- 12,295
- 8,320
Agreed. Nothing can come of this pool as per usual but I'd be pretty shocked. This is the best I've seen it. Which might not be saying much but I do think it's a really solid list. There's REAL upside in there for a chance.
I do get why some are meh on it. There's no slam dunks. They all have question marks so it's fair to be critical. But all in all we got a few guys who can definitely improve this team in a substantial way. If only KK, Suzuki, Caufield, Romanov and Norlinder reach their ceilings or come anywhere close; we could be in damn good shape. Don't get me wrong, we need a bonafide blue chipper one way or another but just because we don't necessarily have one doesn't mean we don't have ourselves a nice pool. To have guys like Poehling, Brook, Fleury and Ylonen not even in our top 5 and some out of the top 10 means you have QUALITY depth.
montreal
Go Habs Go
- Mar 21, 2002
- 59,431
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yes it was really troubling to see how all 3 played in Laval, at times just brutal. Brook was really coming on though but the big problem was the offense just wasn't there and that's what his game is based on. That said the improvements he made from start to end of season were impressive, he really took off once moved to the top pairing so I have hope that he will break out next year.
Fleury was just terrible when sent down but seemed to find his game a bit at the end. I really question his defensive decision making but still think he can be a solid 3rd pairing D for us although I don't get why they put him in the NHL this year and hope he gets more time in the AHL next year.
Poehling was the worst of the bunch, as a late 1st rounder I expected so much more, but like Brook the offense just wasn't there at all. To be so invisible at times was really concerning but then again I hate how he was handled. I've never been really high on his upside but still think he will be at worst a solid 4th liner.
Ylonen it's tougher since I didn't get to see as much of him as I would have liked so next season I should get a much better idea of what he brings. But with his combo of speed, skating, shot, there's a good bit to like. I still think he could turn into a solid 2nd line winger for us but like I said I'll have a better feel for him this time next year.
The big things are they need Caufield and Kotka to hit and hit big as they need Caufield to be a 30-40 goal scorer, Kotka to be at least a 2nd line center on a contending team. Doesn't have to be in say 2 years but at some point they will need both along with Suzuki to really hit their ceiling.
The defense is stacked but they must have someone breakout and turn into a #1 D at some point down the road. I don't care who, Norlinder, Brook, Struble, Romanov, Harris, etc... but we really need someone to step up. I think Norlinder could be that guy but I also thought Brook could and while he easily still could that has clearly become much more unlikely. The good news is that we are knee deep in very solid D prospects so hopefully there is a lot of assets there for us.
Primeau is legit, he's certainly one of the best goalie prospects around as he's showed it at every level since being drafted but he'll need to be little more consistent as he was great then struggled and then was great again and imo he was going to carry the team into the playoffs had the season not ended.
26Mats
Registered User
- Jun 23, 2018
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Would real disappointing use of a 3rd overall pick if Caufield ends up being better than Kotkaniemi - unless Caufield is lights out.
The way I see it, unless you find rare gems like the Kucherov's and Point's in later rounds, nailing your top 10 picks is the most important thing in drafting. Hopefully Kotkaniemi isn't another Galchenyuk. That we were looking for centers doesn't cut it as an excuse.
Habs Icing
Formerly Onice
That top twenty doesn't leave me with a warm fuzzy feeling. I don't see the making of a future powerhouse with those players.
Having said that, it's more than obvious that our prospect pool is in dire need of top 6 forwards. The only prospects on that list that we can see fitting into that slot are Caufield, KK and Ylonen. I have serious doubts about KK becoming a top 6 player and we still have to see how Ylonen adapts to major North American pro hockey. But putting those reservations aside that still only leaves us with three prospects who may fit into a top 6 role. Four if TT doesn't screw the pooch this coming draft.
True MB can make some spectacular trade or signing to remedy that problem but as it stands right now that prospect pool is symptomatic of terrible drafting for 12 years.
Steve Shutt
Don't Poke the Bear
- May 31, 2007
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- 1,092
Seems a little too low for a guy that got some NHL games under his belt this season
- Aug 21, 2016
- 10,331
- 13,765
At some point, you have to take in consideration the age factor and Vejdemo's stats and developing curve arent impressive at all, kid is 24 yrs old...
- Aug 21, 2016
- 10,331
- 13,765
Thats a pretty good ranking, I will try one only for fun:
1-Kotkaniemi
2-Caufield
3-Primeau
4-Romanov
5-Ylonen
6-Poehling
7-Norlinder
8-Brook
9-Fleury
10-Struble
11-Olofsson
12-Harris
13-Hillis
13-Fairbrother
14-Evans
15-Khisamutdinov
16-Pitlick
17-Stapley
18-Teasdale
19-Ikonen
20-Leguerrier
26Mats
Registered User
- Jun 23, 2018
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Poehling, KK, and Brook lost a lot of luster this year. Plus Juulsen, Mete, and Fleury didn't exactly excel. That had a big impact on the quality of our prospect pool. Hopefully all 6 can shoot up.
26Mats
Registered User
- Jun 23, 2018
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Top Line potential
1 - Caufield
2 - Primeau
3 - Norlinder
Top 6 potential
4 - Romanov
5 - Kotkaniemi
6 - Struble
7 - Ylonen
8 - Brook
Top 9 potential
9 - Harris
10 - Poehling
11 - Fleury
12 - Hillis
Bottom pairing potential
13 - Pitlick
14 - Evans
15 - Vejdemo
16 - Leskinen
17 - Fairbrother
18 - Khisamutdinov
19 - Olofsson
20 - Teasdale
1 - Caufield
2 - Primeau
3 - Norlinder
Top 6 potential
4 - Romanov
5 - Kotkaniemi
6 - Struble
7 - Ylonen
8 - Brook
Top 9 potential
9 - Harris
10 - Poehling
11 - Fleury
12 - Hillis
Bottom pairing potential
13 - Pitlick
14 - Evans
15 - Vejdemo
16 - Leskinen
17 - Fairbrother
18 - Khisamutdinov
19 - Olofsson
20 - Teasdale
DramaticGloveSave
Voice of Reason
- Apr 17, 2017
- 14,819
- 13,751
Romanov is our clear #1 prospect. The guy is just an ice tilter who makes his team better than the opponent when he's on the ice. He's going to be a minute muncher who can play in all situations. He may not be a 50 point type ever, but he's on track to be a top pairing defender who is better than his production.
Caulfield is probably our #2 due to his upside. There's no doubting there's potential to be a 40+ goal type player. That said, I think we should have taken Newhook, and Caufield is going to end up a 30 goal guy who is also a liability when on the ice. Still useful, but he's probably going to be more of a compliment than a star.
Kotkaniemi comes in at #3 but even that might be rich. My draft time evaluation remains the same- middle 6 center- and he's trending more towards being bottom 6 than top 6. I'm still waiting for him to get strong like Bull or skate like Bure like so many of you promised he would. As of now he is unable to create space for himself with speed or strength, and doesn't have the skills to make plays in limited space. His ceiling right now is a defensive center who can produce on the PP unless his body blossoms into something better. This could go down as one of our worst picks of the last 20 years- it was a clear reach for position- a position we ended up solving just months later with the Suzuki trade.
Primeau projects as a solid starting Goaltender. He comes in here depending on how you value that.
After that it really gets murky. The three LDs are our most exciting prospects, though not sure how to rank them. Alot of development ahead of each.
Caulfield is probably our #2 due to his upside. There's no doubting there's potential to be a 40+ goal type player. That said, I think we should have taken Newhook, and Caufield is going to end up a 30 goal guy who is also a liability when on the ice. Still useful, but he's probably going to be more of a compliment than a star.
Kotkaniemi comes in at #3 but even that might be rich. My draft time evaluation remains the same- middle 6 center- and he's trending more towards being bottom 6 than top 6. I'm still waiting for him to get strong like Bull or skate like Bure like so many of you promised he would. As of now he is unable to create space for himself with speed or strength, and doesn't have the skills to make plays in limited space. His ceiling right now is a defensive center who can produce on the PP unless his body blossoms into something better. This could go down as one of our worst picks of the last 20 years- it was a clear reach for position- a position we ended up solving just months later with the Suzuki trade.
Primeau projects as a solid starting Goaltender. He comes in here depending on how you value that.
After that it really gets murky. The three LDs are our most exciting prospects, though not sure how to rank them. Alot of development ahead of each.
Habs Icing
Formerly Onice
What you're saying is true but it doesn't really contradict my point.
Look at the big team and then examine those prospects. Can you tell me who will fill in at #1 center, right and left-wing? The only answer I have is maybe Caufield. Tatar is our #1 left winger but there's really no one in the system to take over and Tomas is really a #2. As a #1 center we will have to rely on Suzuki and I don't think he is a #1 center on a cup contender. A #2 certainly. Danault is not a #1 center on a contender.
So now go to the second line. We have a center there, Suzuki. If KK somehow lives to expectations that means we have 2 #2 centers. That's a best case scenario. Who do we play on the wings? When Caufield is ready to step into the #1 right wing position, if he ever makes it, Gallagher will no longer be a top 6 player. Who do we play on left? Drouin? You don't win cups with Drouin in the top 6. Domi? If this year's rumour is true he won't be a happy camper playing on the wing.
Looking at the top 6 in our pool of veterans and prospects, we won't compete for anything but lottery picks for the next 4-5 years.
- Aug 21, 2016
- 10,331
- 13,765
I like Olofsson more than most, he was doing very well this year before his injury... I like his mix of speed\size and IQ, still believe he can become a valuable bottom line player... Harris is a nice prospect too, incredibly smart but I dont see high end skills, his shot is weak, he is undersized and needs to get alot stronger... I prefer my bottom pairing defensemen to be big, physical and tough to play against like Fleury and Juulsen...
Canadienna
Registered User
- Jan 27, 2015
- 13,316
- 18,986
Great list. My top 10 just for fun.
Romanov
Kotkaniemi
Primeau
Caufield
Norlinder
Poehling
Fleury
Ylonen
Harris
Evans
HM: Brook, Struble
I think that's a pretty deep top 10 prospect group.
BehindTheTimes
Registered User
- Jun 24, 2018
- 7,574
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26Mats
Registered User
- Jun 23, 2018
- 33,649
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I wasn't contradicting your point, I was actually trying to provide evidence to support it.
montreal
Go Habs Go
- Mar 21, 2002
- 59,431
- 46,118
I don't see it that way, there's no need to compare what Caufield does vs Kotka, it's just what each brings. So maybe Kotka was picked too high and Caufield too low (many thought he would go top 10ish) But Caufield just had a great season despite his poor effort in his own end at times, to put up a ppg at 18 on a very young and bad team is impressive. Kotka could easily end up being much better as I fully expect him to bounce back but with the season he just had, which let's not mince words, was just flat out terrible, I felt I had to drop him down a spot for now.
If Caufield continues to progress I see him as a 1st line forward that puts up 30-40 goals. Kotka it's tougher to say as he's got to improve his skating, but I wouldn't be surprised if he turns into a consistent 70 pt player or close to it. If both end up around that level, it's a huge win for us, Timmins and his staff.
On the other hand we see just how terrible Bergevin has been at developing talent, they poorly handled Galchenyuk, it was a joke to see and they did the same with Kotka. Since Kotka is a much smarter player and better all round, I don't think he fails ala Galchenyuk especially if the nightlife doesn't get to him and his dad isn't a problem.
The hope is that MB is learning as leaving Caufield in the NCAA and not rushing him is just flat out shocking.
I've never been a big fan, there's things to like in his game for sure but he just never has been able to put them all together consistently. He has several NHL tools so I do think he can be a 4th liner but I'm not sure he would be even DLR level and at this point I don't think he is. That said maybe we will see him breakout next year. I would be surprised as I see him as more of a tweener to 13th/14th forward. That said he did have a very good start to the season but then was back to his usual inconsistent offense at the end of the season when we needed him most (after being sent down, where have I seen that before,
)
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