My greater theory about Kent Hughes & 'CULTURE'

[GrandBison]

I think they also want guys that will come train in Montreal in the summer, to stay close to the group. There was an cohesion problem from Gauthier, and you see that in other teams that are supposedly ready for playoff push...

 

[NotProkofievian]

That's why I said better version. That forward core was booty but made a finals just because of the D core and G essentially. That's how important those two positions are to playoff hockey. Same with Habs 2021. They had a top 4 D and a superstar goalie and made a finals. Now I do agree with your general point, you do need clutch forwards with skill to finish the job. I just think they're the least important ingredient.

Can you remind which forward core they lost to?

 

[NORiculous]

All you need to win a cup is a hot goalie,

There is a reason a couple of teams have won multiple cups in the last 15 years.

 

[NotProkofievian]

Oh we do need more firepower. I wanted Michkov but I understand. Will he burn us? Very possible.
I got my eyes on how good Dach, Slaf, Roy, Beck will be and what we do in the next 3+ years. Those still will be rebuild/transition years.

I wonder about our ability to move out guys like Dvorak, Hoffman, Eddy, Armia and play younger guys. If we can accomplish this, we might be looking at another pick around 5

My answer to the question of how much firepower do we need is ''more.'' More until we have too much.

 

[Habs Halifax]

My answer to the question of how much firepower do we need is ''more.'' More until we have too much.

I'm assuming you are talking about Michkov fire power and not Dubois? The thing with me is I wanted both. I'm greedy. I wanted both the physical center and the dynamic offensive threat.

D looks to be in very good shape. How are we going to add a star 100 pts forward? Not sure.

 

[CaptainKirk]

My theory is that HuGo wants to copy the Bruins culture, heavy on D and a good top 9 while not necessarily have a superstar « pre Pastrnak era » and guys that wants to win and not only think about themselves

Team players, willing to take a discount to maintain a winning team over the Mitch "I want $11M" Marner types that score 100pts in the regular season but don't show up in the playoffs.

 

[HuGo Burner Acc]

Can you remind which forward core they lost to?

There's a reason I never bring up those penguin teams when discussing this stuff. They're the biggest exception to the rule I've ever seen. In that respect, your point is absolutely correct but the exception doesn't prove the rule. They even won without their no. 1 D and a crap D core and a new goalie that's pretty trash. That team defies logic but I'll give that one to you

 

[blueberry]

You know hockey is entertainment. I don't mind losing as long as we're entertained. Thats what its all about really. Theres nothing worse than a boring defensive team. We want to see offense with talented guys pulling us out of our seats. Then if we lose we still go to sleep happy. You want to see talented guys getting better and have at least hope for the future. Just show me talent. After the painful last couple of years (decades actually) , then to come out of the draft with the guys we did in the strongest draft in a long time its just so disappointing. All the while when we were getting smoked at least we could dream about getting a great player in the draft. Now it seems we suffered with no reward. No whiz kid to watch at training camp...boring. Like I said losing is not so bad as long as there is hope and we're being entertained. I don't really have any hope left and I was so hoping this management team finally saw the light, but no, more of the same as the last decade. Bergevin did more good than these guys in the last few years. Now we've blown 2 potential great drafts. I feel sick.

 

[digmor crusher]

I'm ok with the Reinbacher pick, skill alone does not win a cup, ask the Leafs. A big, mean, mobile d core does.

 

[CristianoRonaldo]

We became a star-up, we put everything in marketing, come up with cute buzzwords, to fool the fans, but we don't care about the on-ice product...

Karakter, Rispekt, Kulture and Safti, are all the same B.S.

 

[Nico Cauzuki]

Kucherov seems like a dick but i would take him on my team anyday and im sure our captain would love to have a superstar like him on hes team

 

[Toene]

Kucherov seems like a dick but i would take him on my team anyday and im sure our captain would love to have a superstar like him on hes team

Patrick Roy is an asshole. Lafleur was a party boy who drank all the time. Who cares? They won cups.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

With Bergevin it was called character.

With HuGo its called culture.

We can pretend its two different things but it isn't.

 

[First Line]

This might be a stretch - and it could be the biggest cope I have ever typed in my entire life because we just passed on a potentially generational goal scorer to reach for a defenseman - BUT - hear me out.

With Bergevin, it was all about the CHaracter. With Hughes - it's CULTURE.

Inspired by wherein which Bobrov uses a specific word quite a few times - CULTURE.

Dach, Newhook, Slafkovsky, Beck and now seemingly Reinbacher (henceforth referred to as Dr/The Doctor) - all of these guys were acquired by Hughes - and they all have something in common. They're all charismatic, well spoken, mature players. They all seem like good kids - good teammates.

When you consider some of the other guys from Hughes past on our team - Farrell and Harris. It's the same thing. It's what Cole oozes in every interview. Guhle, despite being soft spoken - the same. It seems to be a recurring theme. I don't think Newhook was picked up at that price just because of his on-ice capabilities.

To really highlight where this comes from - after watching interviews with Reinbacher, there is a humbleness and eagerness to join the team. I think this pick is not just about addressing a serious need (RD) but about continuing to develop around a general philosophy; an almost Ted Lasso-ian focus on team building. I think Slaf fell into this same mold; just so much character and an eagerness to improve and be a good teammate.

Wright and Michkov will both be excellent players - hyper-competitive, skilled players who will excel in their own rights - but I think that the belief here might be that one well-oiled core is much more important than a single superstar cog.

Now - who knows if this will work out in the end - it will be interesting to see. Maybe this will all work in the end, and our doomsaying will be for nothing as we excitedly watch our team lift a cup.

Or, our team will be a perpetual bottom feeder and Michkov will become a perpetual threat to win the Rocket.

For what it's worth - agree with it or not - there is a plan here. Bergevin never really seemed to have a plan, so I will take a plan I disagree with over random over-corrections.

Good luck trying to convince people on the internet that character and intangibles have any impact.

 

[salbutera]

With Bergevin it was called character.

With HuGo its called culture.

We can pretend its two different things but it isn't.

The reality is for a market unique such as Mtl - character/culture however you want to qualify it, is a massive need.

Selke made it a priority as did Pollock as did Serge Savard as did Gainey.

 

[Bring Bak Damphousse]

Two drafts now with Gorton/Hughes and after several trades. Lets take a look at what was left from Bergevin vs what we have added.

Young pieces that is part of our future (From Bergevin): Suzuki, Caufield, Guhle, Xhekaj, Harris, Roy, Mailloux, Kidney, Dobes, RHP, Farrell. Others like Mysak, Struble, Tuch, Kapanen.
* Most of these guys come from the 19-21 draft years.

Young pieces that is part of our future (From Gorton/Hughes): Slafkovsky, Reinbacher, Newhook, Beck, Hutson, Engstrom, Mesar. Others like Rohrer, Fowler.
* Most of these guys come from the 22-23 draft years.

Hughes gets credit for brining in Dach, Matheson, Barron, Heineman, but he used Bergevin parts to get them. Romanov, Petry, Toffoli, Lehkonen.

Hughes also gets credit for the Monahan & Flames 1st trade.

Bergevin gets credit for Anderson & Monty, but gets a negative grade for contracts like Gallagher, Hoffman, Dvorak, Armia.

I’d point out if Bergevin gets credit for moves Hughes made because he used Bergevin era players, than Gainey gets some credit for Suzuki.

When Hughes took over Caufield was struggling badly, Hughes gets some credit for bringing in a coach who allowed those young Bergevin draft picks to develop. We know what Bergevins development record was, seems strange new management comes in and all of a sudden Caufield, Harris, Guhle, Xhekaj look like nhlers.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

I’d point out if Bergevin gets credit for moves Hughes made because he used Bergevin era players, than Gainey gets some credit for Suzuki.

When Hughes took over Caufield was struggling badly, Hughes gets some credit for bringing in a coach who allowed those young Bergevin draft picks to develop. We know what Bergevins development record was, seems strange new management comes in and all of a sudden Caufield, Harris, Guhle, Xhekaj look like nhlers.

Well to be fair Caulfield looked like an NHLer when MB was around, he was in our playoff run.

The other 3 players you mentioned were only in the NHL under MSL and Hughes. They've never had a different NHL coach or GM. In fact, they've never even played for our AHL coach either. If you felt they didn't look good on their other teams this is a product of their college or CHL coach.

 

[The Great Weal]

Kucherov seems like a dick but i would take him on my team anyday and im sure our captain would love to have a superstar like him on hes team

The guy might be the biggest douche in the league and doesn't care defensively

 

[Bombshell11]

I have zero issues with establishing a great culture in a hockey room but ARE THE FOOKING COACHES GOING TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE TO IT AS WELL?????

Last time we tried the "No excuse" culture it lasted exactly 1 year and right after that it became a shit show of excuses

 

[JoelWarlord]

It's clearly something they value, but I'm not ready to lump it in with the character buzzword from the Bergevin years just yet given we're not seeing Prust/Shaw type of stuff from them and Slafkovsky was very much a talent & upside pick even if you disagreed with it. The way I see it is that to win in the NHL, you need a market efficiency somewhere, and it needs to materialize in 2-3 guys on your roster that piss off other team's fans because it's bullshit you got X guy for Y price/pick. For Tampa that was HOFers in the 2nd/3rd round. For Vegas, it was acquiring Mark Stone and Jack Eichel for Jack Shit. You need bullshit like that on your roster to win in a hard cap league with a negative feedback loop baked in to the draft format.

I think what they're doing here is trying to get that roster bullshit by going all-in on their development system, and "culture". They clearly think St. Louis is a pretty unique/special development coach, and they're trying to give him a bunch of athletic, skilled, and hard-working canvases to work with and build a tenacious, fast, and skilled team with depth and some nastiness. I think they believe in Nicholas and St. Louis to get some bullshit development out of a guy or two, and if they can't pull that off, the trade market should be pretty damn efficient for us if we can build every trade package around a big toolsy defence prospect, a surplus middle six winger, and magic beans.

I would just be very wary about drawing major overarching conclusions about "culture" and going into Bergevin talk from this draft and the Michkov decision specifically. It's a really unique situation, and I think it's a stretch to just call it "passing on skill" in a vacuum. A week ago they gave Cole Caufield 8 years and over 60 million, traded for Newhook, and a year ago traded a gritty fan favourite with character in spades for a then-underwhelming Dach (and added Matheson). They like to make bold trades for skilled players, and maybe it's copium, but I'm confident they'll be similarly aggressive at trading for star talent once we're out of the Dach/Newhook trade phase of the rebuild.

 

[calder candidate]

The best way create culture draft the best player than trade the odd man out…

 

[HabbyGuy]

This might be a stretch - and it could be the biggest cope I have ever typed in my entire life because we just passed on a potentially generational goal scorer to reach for a defenseman - BUT - hear me out.

With Bergevin, it was all about the CHaracter. With Hughes - it's CULTURE.

Inspired by wherein which Bobrov uses a specific word quite a few times - CULTURE.

Dach, Newhook, Slafkovsky, Beck and now seemingly Reinbacher (henceforth referred to as Dr/The Doctor) - all of these guys were acquired by Hughes - and they all have something in common. They're all charismatic, well spoken, mature players. They all seem like good kids - good teammates.

When you consider some of the other guys from Hughes past on our team - Farrell and Harris. It's the same thing. It's what Cole oozes in every interview. Guhle, despite being soft spoken - the same. It seems to be a recurring theme. I don't think Newhook was picked up at that price just because of his on-ice capabilities.

To really highlight where this comes from - after watching interviews with Reinbacher, there is a humbleness and eagerness to join the team. I think this pick is not just about addressing a serious need (RD) but about continuing to develop around a general philosophy; an almost Ted Lasso-ian focus on team building. I think Slaf fell into this same mold; just so much character and an eagerness to improve and be a good teammate.

Wright and Michkov will both be excellent players - hyper-competitive, skilled players who will excel in their own rights - but I think that the belief here might be that one well-oiled core is much more important than a single superstar cog.

Now - who knows if this will work out in the end - it will be interesting to see. Maybe this will all work in the end, and our doomsaying will be for nothing as we excitedly watch our team lift a cup.

Or, our team will be a perpetual bottom feeder and Michkov will become a perpetual threat to win the Rocket.

For what it's worth - agree with it or not - there is a plan here. Bergevin never really seemed to have a plan, so I will take a plan I disagree with over random over-corrections.

This is a well thought out post and I believe you're probably right. I just don't understand how adding a player the like of Michkov goes against the culture theme. The culture and character is what could absorb the perceived attitude issues. If Michkov is indeed destined to be a star, that would be like saying Michael Jordan or Kobe Bryant hurt the culture of their respective teams, when both were well known to have "attitude" issues.

When in actuality it was they who advanced that culture to greater heights. Some would say in the end, they were the ones who imprinted that culture.

 

[Kennerback]

The guy might be the biggest douche in the league and doesn't care defensively

He could very well be. Looks to me like a bona fide douche. But this douche that doesn’t care about defence has 2 Cups and all our solid character teammates for 25 years have none. In fact, he’s above a point per game in the playoffs.

One of the greatest playoff performers in NHL history, Claude Lemieuxa is a 4x Cup winner, also playoff MVP. He also was driven out of Montreal for being such a douche and is a first ballot inductee in the douche Hall of Fame.

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

With Bergevin it was called character.

With HuGo its called culture.

We can pretend its two different things but it isn't.

Character and team players is important but MB/Therrien had no clue what character was or really tried to assemble a character team. Hughes is. They don't want another Jets fiasco.

With Bergevin it was called character.

With HuGo its called culture.

We can pretend its two different things but it isn't.

Character and team players is important but MB/Therrien had no clue what character was or really tried to assemble a character team. Hughes is. They don't want another Jets fiasco.

 

[blueberry]

This is a well thought out post and I believe you're probably right. I just don't understand how adding a player the like of Michkov goes against the culture theme. The culture and character is what could absorb the perceived attitude issues. If Michkov is indeed destined to be a star, that would be like saying Michael Jordan or Kobe Bryant hurt the culture of their respective teams, when both were well known to have "attitude" issues.

When in actuality it was they who advanced that culture to greater heights. Some would say in the end, they were the ones who imprinted that culture.

And win or lose we would have more fun watching Michkov and we'd be happy.