Confirmed Trade: [MTL/NSH] Alexandre Carrier for Justin Barron

[TheNumber4]

lol he just called him a top 10 dman. Hab fans are almost as delusional as Leaf fans.

Lol. Yeh he's not that right now, not even close. It's still early days, for all we know he could be the next Gostisbehere.

 

[Treb]

Like and agreed.

But also, the Habs paraded Petry around for years and years.

I guess the only classy fanbase are the Oil. We don’t bring up Kulak. Even though he’s been a complete beast for us at a bargain price.

I have no clue how you can consider Kulak a "complete beast" or 2nd+7th a "bargain price".

He's a 3rd pair D that went for 3rd pair premium price.

TOI/GP since he was traded to EDM:
2021-2022: 6th
2022-2023: 6th (5th if you don't count Ekholm 21 games)
2023-2024: 7th (6th if you don't count Stetcher 7 games)
2024-2025: 4th

His competition this year was Emberson (claimed from SJ as a depth D), Stecher (who's been around the league as a depth D), Dermott (who got claimed then waived after a few games) and Joshua Brown (who is an AHL/NHL tweener).

This is similar to when EDM valued Kassian because they couldn't get anyone else to play the role.

 

[TheNumber4]

I have no clue how you can consider Kulak a "complete beast" or 2nd+7th a "bargain price".

He's a 3rd pair D that went for 3rd pair premium price.

TOI/GP since he was traded to EDM:
2021-2022: 6th
2022-2023: 6th (5th if you don't count Ekholm 21 games)
2023-2024: 7th (6th if you don't count Stetcher 7 games)
2024-2025: 4th

His competition this year was Emberson (claimed from SJ as a depth D), Stecher (who's been around the league as a depth D), Dermott (who got claimed then waived after a few games) and Joshua Brown (who is an AHL/NHL tweener).

This is similar to when EDM valued Kassian because they couldn't get anyone else to play the role.

Well maybe you should watch some games and understand his role in Edmonton to better understand.

Here’s not “competing” with any of the guys you mentioned. He’s way ahead of them and is probably the reason those guys can even stay afloat.

In Edmonton, he’s played 3rd pair cause Nurse and Ekholm are ahead. But hes proved his worth being able to play up the line up, for example when Nurse was suspended in the playoffs, he came up huge. He’s also stepped into a 1st pair role and done well when Ekholm had injury. He can also play top 4 Right hand side on his off side in a pinch and does well in that role. Check his numbers with Nurse this year. In his normal role on the 3rd pair, paired with Desharnais he made up one half of one of the better 3rd pairs in the League by analytics. Essentially every role we throw at this guy, he’s game for it and handles it well. Not a bad review has ever been had of this player for those that watch him in this market. The “beast” nickname he’s earned in Edmonton is the result of his playoffs play, more accurately he’s been called a “playoffs beast” cause his game goes up a notch in the most important games.

He was also better than Broberg in every single year Broberg was around. Probably still better than him to this day if given similar usage. And look how people fawn over Broberg these days after his hot start to the season. There’s a reason Broberg never stole the job from Kulak.

He was acquired as a rental but signed a 4 year extension at a more than fair AAV. So we are getting 4 1/2 years of Kulak for that 2nd plus 7th. A deal no one in Edmonton regrets for a player that’s now squarely part of the solution and core.

 

[HabsQC]

lol he just called him a top 10 dman. Hab fans are almost as delusional as Leaf fans.

He probably meant strictly in points. (He is 9th right now).

I just love how you include 2 whole fanbases in your second sentence after one guy's statement.

 

[Reality Czech]

How does this thread have 15 pages lol

 

[ReHabs]

The Hutson, Kulak talk is irrelevant

Carrier for Barron was a cap dump for a rushed prospect. NSH believes they can fix Barron (given his toolkit) and MTL were content to take on Carrier's (overpaid) cap-hit.

So far it's worked great for the Habs and we'll see how it works out for the Preds but I reckon they're happy to get out from under Carrier's contract no matter what.

 

[Habs Halifax]

The Hutson, Kulak talk is irrelevant

Carrier for Barron was a cap dump for a rushed prospect. NSH believes they can fix Barron (given his toolkit) and MTL were content to take on Carrier's (overpaid) cap-hit.

So far it's worked great for the Habs and we'll see how it works out for the Preds but I reckon they're happy to get out from under Carrier's contract no matter what.

Carrier was not a cap dump.

 

[ReHabs]

Carrier was not a cap dump.

Carrier signed a 3.75m yearly contract last summer and performed like dog poo for NSH this year, look up his stats if you don't believe me. Trotz saw an opportunity to get rid of that commitment before it got worse and took it. That's a cap dump. Nashville has a budget and they cannot afford to waste nearly 4m on a player delivering maybe 2m worth of hockey. Monahan was a cap dump too, it doesn't have much to do with the player's inherent quality.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Carrier signed a 3.75m yearly contract last summer and performed like dog poo for NSH this year, look up his stats if you don't believe me. Trotz saw an opportunity to get rid of that commitment before it got worse and took it. That's a cap dump. Nashville has a budget and they cannot afford to waste nearly 4m on a player delivering maybe 2m worth of hockey. Monahan was a cap dump too, it doesn't have much to do with the player's inherent quality.

The entire Preds roster was not performing to the level expected. That's not just on Carrier.

Not a cap dump. It was a hockey trade. Habs needed someone who could play RD now and the Preds were open to having Barron mature on their roster.

Yeah, the Habs traded Barron for a cap dump. Come on man

 

[ReHabs]

The entire Preds roster was not performing to the level expected. That's not just on Carrier.

Not a cap dump. It was a hockey trade. Habs needed someone who could play RD now and the Preds were open to having Barron mature on their roster.

Yeah, the Habs traded Barron for a cap dump. Come on man

You're welcome to disagree with my argument but I don't see any argument on your side.

Look at Carrier's performance for NSH and tell me they weren't ecstatic to get out from his contract.

 

[Habs Halifax]

You're welcome to disagree with my argument but I don't see any argument on your side.

Look at Carrier's performance for NSH and tell me they weren't ecstatic to get out from his contract.

A cap dump doesn't go to another team and play top 4D minutes. It was a hockey trade where one player was making more than other and you think that means cap dump.

The glass doesn't have to be half empty all the time.

 

[Andy]

Was it Friedman or Trotz himself saying that the habs were trying to get Carrier for over a year? Or am I misremembering

 

[ReHabs]

A cap dump doesn't go to another team and play top 4D minutes. It was a hockey trade where one player was making more than other and you think that means cap dump.

The glass doesn't have to be half empty all the time.

Monahan played a lot of minutes for the Habs and was a cap dump. From the perspective of the Preds, they 100% wanted to dump his contract because he was underperforming. There is no doubt.

Was it Friedman or Trotz himself saying that the habs were trying to get Carrier for over a year? Or am I misremembering

Trotz said the Preds have been chasing Barron for some time.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Monahan played a lot of minutes for the Habs and was a cap dump. From the perspective of the Preds, they 100% wanted to dump his contract because he was underperforming. There is no doubt.


Trotz said the Preds have been chasing Barron for some time.

Monahan had injury issues. Not the same situation. Monahan being traded was a cap dump at a much higher cap hit and it not even close to the Carrier/Barron trade. Monahan narrative was a reach bud.

 

[ReHabs]

Monahan had injury issues. Not the same situation. Monahan being traded was a cap dump at a much higher cap hit and it not even close to the Carrier/Barron trade. Monahan narrative was a reach bud.

Monahan was healthy when he was moved (he couldn't have been moved if he was injured). He was dealt because his cap hit was higher than his value to the team. Carrier is the same thing. He was a dog's breakfast for the Preds this year.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

Carrier signed a 3.75m yearly contract last summer and performed like dog poo for NSH this year, look up his stats if you don't believe me. Trotz saw an opportunity to get rid of that commitment before it got worse and took it. That's a cap dump. Nashville has a budget and they cannot afford to waste nearly 4m on a player delivering maybe 2m worth of hockey. Monahan was a cap dump too, it doesn't have much to do with the player's inherent quality.

This is correct. Many of us in Nashville didn't want to see Carrier re-signed at all, and were somewhat aghast when he got the $3.75M. The way we look at it, getting a reclamation prospect who may or may not ever become a regular player for us in Barron does indeed represent Cap dumping Carrier. Which we don't mind, because we had been wishing the team never signed him in the first place.

I don't think there is any huge hope pinned on Barron. We saw the team say nice things about Philip Myers and Cal Foote when they came along as reclamation projects in trades, but end of the day there was no salvaging them. Of course they are going to say nice things about a guy they trade for. If by some miracle they do salvage him, then of course Trotz will also say they knew all along. If - which is more likely - they don't salvage him, we'll all shrug and say it didn't hurt to try, but all along the real win was in dumping off a contract we didn't want.

I'm glad Carrier is doing well for the Habs, though. He always tried hard for the Preds, even if he couldn't seem to understand his role or stay on his feet. I don't think he's a top-4 defender on any team with a good defense corps, but he tries hard enough and has enough skill that he can fill in there while a team tries to find better options, which is basically what he has been doing for the last few years with the Preds. Eventually you need somebody better if you want to compete. The Preds were clearly hoping to sign somebody better on the UFA market last summer, but once they knew that they couldn't line up a proper RD upgrade on July 1st, they fell back on keeping Carrier around. The team is clearly planning to try again this coming July 1st, but realized that they're just as well off with a cheaper fallback like Blankenburg as they were wasting money on Carrier.

 

[ReHabs]

This is correct. Many of us in Nashville didn't want to see Carrier re-signed at all, and were somewhat aghast when he got the $3.75M. The way we look at it, getting a reclamation prospect who may or may not ever become a regular player for us in Barron does indeed represent Cap dumping Carrier. Which we don't mind, because we had been wishing the team never signed him in the first place.

I don't think there is any huge hope pinned on Barron. We saw the team say nice things about Philip Myers and Cal Foote when they came along as reclamation projects in trades, but end of the day there was no salvaging them. Of course they are going to say nice things about a guy they trade for. If by some miracle they do salvage him, then of course Trotz will also say they knew all along. If - which is more likely - they don't salvage him, we'll all shrug and say it didn't hurt to try, but all along the real win was in dumping off a contract we didn't want.

I'm glad Carrier is doing well for the Habs, though. He always tried hard for the Preds, even if he couldn't seem to understand his role or stay on his feet. I don't think he's a top-4 defender on any team with a good defense corps, but he tries hard enough and has enough skill that he can fill in there while a team tries to find better options, which is basically what he has been doing for the last few years with the Preds. Eventually you need somebody better if you want to compete. The Preds were clearly hoping to sign somebody better on the UFA market last summer, but once they knew that they couldn't line up a proper RD upgrade on July 1st, they fell back on keeping Carrier around. The team is clearly planning to try again this coming July 1st, but realized that they're just as well off with a cheaper fallback like Blankenburg as they were wasting money on Carrier.

Most Habs fans would rather run into a brick wall head first than accept they didn't unilaterally "win" a trade. It's because of how pathetic the team was during the Bergevin decade, fans adapted to take "wins" wherever they could.

Some players do step up with their new teams (eg Petry from EDM to MTL) so maybe there is hope for Carrier yet but his cap hit, right now, is far too high for a bottom-pairing d-man. That said, so far he's been playing as a middle-pairing d-man and the Habs have had no cap pressure and a greatly improved pt% so it's working out.

When the time comes to shift pieces around and optimise the cap structure, fans will learn to accept that Carrier will be on the trade list.

 

[Andy]

Most Habs fans would rather run into a brick wall head first than accept they didn't unilaterally "win" a trade. It's because of how pathetic the team was during the Bergevin decade, fans adapted to take "wins" wherever they could.

If a "cap dump" is playing like a legit top 4 d-man, earning his cap hit and has stabilized the entire d-core, isn't that the definition of win?

 

[ReHabs]

If a "cap dump" is playing like a legit top 4 d-man, earning his cap hit and has stabilized the entire d-core, isn't that the definition of win?

I invite you to read the paragraph immediately following the one you quoted in the same post. Good luck, I believe you can do it.

 

[FrankMTL]

How does this thread have 15 pages lol

Agreed....and somehow it became and argument between Oilers fans and Habs fans regarding Kulak and Hutson.

 

[Andy]

I invite you to read the paragraph immediately following the one you quoted in the same post. Good luck, I believe you can do it.

Well, maybe you shouldn't do your daily analysis schtick and actually wait for some significant time to pass before offering judgment? If we don't know if Carrier will be one of those players that step up on their new team, maybe we should wait? I know that is tough for you to do since you are so obsessed with making in the moment projections.

Also, the cap is expected to rise. So Carrier's cap % will decrease over time make it possible to absorb his cap hit. Again, something we won't know for a while.

Right now, Nashville's "cap dump" is looking great.

 

[ReHabs]

Well, maybe you shouldn't do your daily analysis schtick and actually wait for some significant time to pass before offering judgment? If we don't know if Carrier will be one of those players that step up on their new team, maybe we should wait? I know that is tough for you to do since you are so obsessed with making in the moment projections.

Also, the cap is expected to rise. So Carrier's cap % will decrease over time make it possible to absorb his cap hit. Again, something we won't know for a while.

Right now, Nashville's "cap dump" is looking great.

You're literally performing the "How Would You Have Felt If You Hadn't Eaten Breakfast?" meme right now.

From NSH's perspective it was a cap dump, a NSH fan confirmed it just above. From the Habs' perspective it was a roster upgrade from Barron to Carrier. I'll quote myself below:

Some players do step up with their new teams (eg Petry from EDM to MTL) so maybe there is hope for Carrier yet but his cap hit, right now, is far too high for a bottom-pairing d-man. That said, so far he's been playing as a middle-pairing d-man and the Habs have had no cap pressure and a greatly improved pt% so it's working out.

For your talk of "Schtick" "judgement" "obsessed" you have the exact same position as me. Likely copying my take, though I can't know for sure. Very strange.

 

[Reality Czech]

Agreed....and somehow it became and argument between Oilers fans and Habs fans regarding Kulak and Hutson.

I can see that

 

[SpezDispenser]

Trotz is actively trying to be the worst GM in the league - and now that Dorion is gone, he has a fair chance. What a terrifically bad trade. Shame!

 

[Habs Halifax]

If a "cap dump" is playing like a legit top 4 d-man, earning his cap hit and has stabilized the entire d-core, isn't that the definition of win?

It was a hockey trade mostly. There is no way someone who plays top 4RD is a cap dump. This was about the Preds not needing Carrier and taking the younger, cheaper player with upside.

Trotz is actively trying to be the worst GM in the league - and now that Dorion is gone, he has a fair chance. What a terrifically bad trade. Shame!

I think Barron will be good but I think it takes him a while like it did with Petry and Matheson types. The problem is how long you got to wait.