Player Discussion Mitch Marner, Yet Again

[Legion34]

There was no realistic scenario where they could force a trade.
He wanted to be here this season and has a full NMC.
Now the guy you didn’t want to sign won’t sign at least till after the playoffs.


They really couldn’t. The team wants to win. He has been the best offensive and defensive forward this season with Matthews hurt.
You couldn’t reduce his minutes without hurting the team in the process

Then why does he want to leave next year.

You absolutely can.

“We have tried to engage in extensions. He refused to answer any calls. We asked to facilitate a trade if he doesn’t want to be here, he doesn’t want to stay”

Public pressure would probably be enough. Ultimately you can.

You can stop pp you can do whatever there definitely always are options.

I doubt it

The fan base has been in revolt about him before and he rode it out, eventually he becomes lovable old hometown boy Mitch again

He has all the power right now

Because he wasn’t leaving before.

 

[thewave]

Then why does he want to leave next year.

You absolutely can.

“We have tried to engage in extensions. He refused to answer any calls. We asked to facilitate a trade if he doesn’t want to be here, he doesn’t want to stay”

Public pressure would probably be enough. Ultimately you can.

You can stop pp you can do whatever there definitely always are options.



Because he wasn’t leaving before.

Let him drive his own line is the obvious one.

 

[Stephen]

Leafs management shit the bed again. They are a comedy of errors. Everyone knows the team with the biggest budget, most local home grown superstars can't win for almost 60 years, it's because the ownership groups are or have been incompetent. It's not because harsh fans. It's gross incompetence.

No professional sports team has been managed worse..6 decades of failure.

Not sure I agree with the Leafs management screwing up. Marner and his camp just seem to be mercurial business partners who have a non financial chip on their shoulders that you have to work around.

Sounds like he wants to stay, but he want to take a peek outside at the market to use that info against Toronto. Okay, I get it but can't you also just arrive at a number you can build a lifestyle around and not go after the final $750K? But he might just be sick of it and wants to do something different also?

It feels like a business negotiation and a high school breakup simultaneously... it's annoying.

 

[cyris]

Then why does he want to leave next year.

You absolutely can.

“We have tried to engage in extensions. He refused to answer any calls. We asked to facilitate a trade if he doesn’t want to be here, he doesn’t want to stay”

Public pressure would probably be enough. Ultimately you can.

You can stop pp you can do whatever there definitely always are options.



Because he wasn’t leaving before.

At what point did he say he wants to leave next year?
He has been the teams best forward this season. At both ends of the ice. You can’t reduce his minutes without hurting the team that is trying to win the division.
You are living in a fantasy world. If you wanted to trade him it had to be done before his trade protection kicked in.

 

[BraveCanadian]

I do love how among the many posters who didn’t want the leafs to negotiate with Marner till after the playoffs there a few of them who are now mad Marner won’t negotiate till after the season

lol so true, no matter what he does or doesn’t do they will find a way to hate him for it

 

[thewave]

Not sure I agree with the Leafs management screwing up. Marner and his camp just seem to be mercurial business partners who have a non financial chip on their shoulders that you have to work around.

Sounds like he wants to stay, but he want to take a peek outside at the market to use that info against Toronto. Okay, I get it but can't you also just arrive at a number you can build a lifestyle around and not go after the final $750K? But he might just be sick of it and wants to do something different also?

It feels like a business negotiation and a high school breakup simultaneously... it's annoying.

It's very annoying but I was sort of saying this team gets itself into tons of these high school business breakups and unions and reunions all the time.

They are all over the map...

Someone old, someone new, someone fast, someone slow, someone soft, someone hard. --- what I mean by this is they can't just formulate a team template. We will be a fast team that does not take on old contracts without very good reason. We will make sure our selections are hard nosed, team oriented and protective of each other. If the players do not confirm they will be shown the door.

Sort of like Boston was doing..Seguin a good example.

 

[Stephen]

It's very annoying but I was sort of saying this team gets itself into tons of these high school business breakups and unions and reunions all the time.

They are all over the map...

Someone old, someone new, someone fast, someone slow, someone soft, someone hard. --- what I mean by this is they can't just formulate a team template. We will be a fast team that does not take on old contracts without very good reason. We will make sure our selections are hard nosed, team oriented and protective of each other. If the players do not confirm they will be shown the door.

Sort of like Boston was doing..Seguin a good example.

As a Leafs fan watching the process unfold it's annoying.

If he wants to be in Toronto on a team like the Leafs, and I'm not saying that's the only factor, but there's a dollar amount attached to that. You can't just extrapolate what X team in Y market can give you, use that as the escalator and come back to the only team that can offer you a GTA life. And by the sound of things Toronto isn't even being particularly cheap with their offers.

So you either do your business proper, or you move on. No one needs to psycho drama.

 

[DarkKnight]

This sounds like they haven't negotiated at all. What a saga.

 

[thewave]

As a Leafs fan watching the process unfold it's annoying.

If he wants to be in Toronto on a team like the Leafs, and I'm not saying that's the only factor, but there's a dollar amount attached to that. You can't just extrapolate what X team in Y market can give you, use that as the escalator and come back to the only team that can offer you a GTA life. And by the sound of things Toronto isn't even being particularly cheap with their offers.

So you either do your business proper, or you move on. No one needs to psycho drama.

No I agree with all of that 100% The organization hurts itself by getting into all these positions though. That's the basketcase part. If it's not contract fussing, it's play style changes mid rebuild or anything else you can imagine. They need to be more cut throat and less nice. Morning business and less worried about public perception. That is if winning is priority 1

 

[Stephen]

No I agree with all of that 100% The organization hurts itself by getting into all these positions though. That's the basketcase part. If it's not contract fussing, it's play style changes mid rebuild or anything else you can imagine. They need to be more cut throat and less nice. Morning business and less worried about public perception. That is if winning is priority 1

They should have dumped him after the Montreal series, the era was still salvageable then and a lot of stars would go on to hit the market around then, including Eichel, M. Tkachuk, Pietrangelo and others. The offramps were more obvious then. He may be a great player but there's just too much ambient drama.

 

[Kiwi]

Then why does he want to leave next year.

You absolutely can.

“We have tried to engage in extensions. He refused to answer any calls. We asked to facilitate a trade if he doesn’t want to be here, he doesn’t want to stay”

Public pressure would probably be enough. Ultimately you can.

You can stop pp you can do whatever there definitely always are options.



Because he wasn’t leaving before.

I actually think he doesn't want to leave now either, he just wants to force the Leafs to give him what he wants

If he only wanted money he could have gotten 13-14M×8 out of the Hurricanes but he wouldn't waive to go there

My bet would be he wants 14-15M×8 out of the Leafs and he thinks they will cave like they always do when push comes to shove

 

[Gabriel426]

This is what I think.

After seeing how the medias, and fans kept saying just sign Willie throughout the beginning of last season which peaked with Madison Gere asking for Willie and how Willie literally became the It guy for hockey at least for a week.

MM and his camp probably started off the season thinking, we can do that too as MM is a better player and usually get more points.
Leafs started off the season winning, still winning. MM having a great season, his best season, despite AM struggling.
Yet it is crickets regarding medias and fans reaction as you rarely see anyone says, need to resign him, just give him the amount…like Willie last season. Willie been rumored to sign in the 11mil ranger while his market number is closer to 9.5mil.
what’s make matters worse is MM with the we played well comment after losing one of the worst game at that point of the season. The medias were all over him. But when Willie was asked about it a day or two later, Willie gave a comment even worse but medias just laughed it off.
With the 4Nations and MM played well. Seemed like MM is gaining positive traction. And his camp probably thought leaking out that MM said No to waive a trade will show he wants to be a Leaf forever….but that backfired.

Or MM and his camp just don’t care and wants the highest amount possible.

 

[Azail]

Frank full of it. CJ said earlier today Marner has refused to negotiate with the Leafs. Like the Leafs don't even know what his ask is.

Yea CJ said the Leafs have no idea what his ask is or if he even wants to play in Toronto anymore. This was why they were interested in Rantanen because it was their understanding that Rant would sign for 8 years with Toronto where Marner they have no idea.

I believe CJ more then Seravalli nowadays.

 

[thewave]

I actually think he doesn't want to leave now either, he just wants to force the Leafs to give him what he wants

If he only wanted money he could have gotten 13-14M×8 out of the Hurricanes but he wouldn't waive to go there

My bet would be he wants 14-15M×8 out of the Leafs and he thinks they will cave like they always do when push comes to shove

And if they cave the Leafs will not win a cup for a decade. Everyone we come into that's good will want the Mitch Marner special contract rate

 

[Gabriel426]

I actually think he doesn't want to leave now either, he just wants to force the Leafs to give him what he wants

If he only wanted money he could have gotten 13-14M×8 out of the Hurricanes but he wouldn't waive to go there

My bet would be he wants 14-15M×8 out of the Leafs and he thinks they will cave like they always do when push comes to shove

If the team asked you to waive, kind of show the team doesn’t want you.

Yea CJ said the Leafs have no idea what his ask is or if he even wants to play in Toronto anymore. This was why they were interested in Rantanen because it was their understanding that Rant would sign for 8 years with Toronto where Marner they have no idea.

I believe CJ more then Seravalli nowadays.

And thats the problem.

How can the team not know what MM wants. And usually when that happens, it means the player wants to leave.

 

[thewave]

If the team asked you to waive, kind of show the team doesn’t want you.


And thats the problem.

How can the team not know what MM wants. And usually when that happens, it means the player wants to leave.

Maybe the player wants to both leave and screw the Leafs because he feels that the team screwed him.

 

[Gabriel426]

Maybe the player wants to both leave and screw the Leafs because he feels that the team screwed him.

Pretty much.

 

[Legion34]

Let him drive his own line is the obvious one.

At what point did he say he wants to leave next year?
He has been the teams best forward this season. At both ends of the ice. You can’t reduce his minutes without hurting the team that is trying to win the division.
You are living in a fantasy world. If you wanted to trade him it had to be done before his trade protection kicked in.

Plenty of players have been moved with NMC

I actually think he doesn't want to leave now either, he just wants to force the Leafs to give him what he wants

If he only wanted money he could have gotten 13-14M×8 out of the Hurricanes but he wouldn't waive to go there

My bet would be he wants 14-15M×8 out of the Leafs and he thinks they will cave like they always do when push comes to shove

I would have agreed with you. But if Toronto was going to trade 4 assets for his replacement. It’s definitely leaning to him going.

If Carolina took Torontos offer then what?

You don’t try to trade for a replacement if you think he is staying. Maybe he will but that’s not the way it’s trending

 

[Azail]

Maybe the player wants to both leave and screw the Leafs because he feels that the team screwed him.

Meh, I don't think he is screwing the Leafs. He has a contract and is playing as well as he ever has. If he refuses to waive his NMC that he earned/negotiated and leaves at the end of the year. That is his right. Tavares did the same to NYI, I didn't think he was screwing them either, it was his contractual right.

 

[Legion34]

Maybe the player wants to both leave and screw the Leafs because he feels that the team screwed him.

Yes I definitely think there is paranoia in his camp. His dad and agent complaining

He is going to be JT if he leaves. No statue. No rafters

Why not set the all time leaf point record

 

[Azail]

Yes I definitely think there is paranoia in his camp. His dad and agent complaining

He is going to be JT if he leaves. No statue. No rafters

Why not set the all time leaf point record

I think we overestimate how much that matters to him because as such fanatics ourselves we think he should feel this way as a hometown kid.

If he really felt like that, he would have already signed a team friendly or at least fair contract.

 

[francis246]

This sounds like they haven't negotiated at all. What a saga.

lol, so I guess everyone can relax now. He did say he wasn’t going to negotiate during the season. So maybe after playoffs it gets settled

 

[Stephen]

Maybe the player wants to both leave and screw the Leafs because he feels that the team screwed him.

Like I said, Marner's camp does not appear to be a rational business partner and you can't really do business in a pure dollars and cents kind of way when they simultaneously want many things.

There's an emotional component where he feels aggrieved by a part of the Toronto market, but the market is also not the Toronto Maple Leafs organization. The team has supported him for the past decade. You might want to stick it to Toronto, but the Leafs have treated you well. So who are you trying to hurt?

Asking Marner to waive might be deeply insulting or shocking, but you have reportedly not provided concrete signals as to what you want to do, so due diligence needs to be pursued.

Finally, what is the number that you want? More than Auston? Match the highest dollar amount on the open market? Makes me think there isn't a real number here, but something pegged to feelings.

But that doesn't change the fact that the market has valued Auston more over the past decade than you and given him the golden child treatment and not you. That can't be fixed and I don't think Leafs Nation is sorry. Holding the team hostage makes the market dislike you more.

If Marner wants to leave, just buzz off when time comes and don't make any qualifications about how you love Toronto.

 

[francis246]

I think we overestimate how much that matters to him because as such fanatics ourselves we think he should feel this way as a hometown kid.

If he really felt like that, he would have already signed a team friendly or at least fair contract.

Thank YOU! I’ve been saying this for days. These guys don’t give a shit about that like we think we do. They will go elsewhere and be fine. As you said, if that mattered so deeply he would have signed. Hes dreamed of being a leaf, he’s gotten 9 years of that dream. If it ends Marner isn’t going to regret it. Kadri loved it here, but he eventually found the resolve to move on. Kessel loved it here but he found the resolve to move on. Hyman loved it here but he found the resolve to move on. Same with Bunting, and the list goes on and on and on and on. They all love the leafs yes, but hockey is also their career and the city doesn’t matter that much so long as they can extend their playing career.

 

[Stephen]

Yea CJ said the Leafs have no idea what his ask is or if he even wants to play in Toronto anymore. This was why they were interested in Rantanen because it was their understanding that Rant would sign for 8 years with Toronto where Marner they have no idea.

I believe CJ more then Seravalli nowadays.

If he wants $15 million you gladly let him eff off to Chicago. You could have 3 forwards of middle six quality there. He's not Connor McDavid.