Player Discussion Mitch Marner, Yet Again

[Antropovsky]

[

I assume that when Cooler said MM is unique in his ability to make good plays in traffic he meant to say that MM is incapable and afraid of making good plays in traffic and can only make good plays when he has time and space, it's an honest mistake, even guys who are in love with the sound of their own voice sometimes misspeak like this

Yet... he demoted Marner to the checking line and also gave him the least 5v5 mins of all players and 2nd least total minutes of all forwards? Also...again, Mcdavid immediately noted Marner plays high in O zone and was subsequently shown on camera in a heated discussion with Marner during game 1.

Want to speak to this stuff? Or just waste everyone's time with your constant sarcastic useless posts?

 

[Stephen]

[
Yet... he demoted Marner to the checking line and also gave him the least 5v5 mins of all players and 2nd least total minutes of all forwards? Also...again, Mcdavid immediately noted Marner plays high in O zone and was subsequently shown on camera in a heated discussion with Marner during game 1.

Want to speak to this stuff? Or just waste everyone's time with your constant sarcastic useless posts?

The key here is timing man.

Marner scored a game winner and Cooper was basically saying despite this and that Marner was finding ways to execute plays in tight. I’ll leave it up to others to decide how much of this was accurate and how much was praise and encouragement.

But since then his effectiveness went down in the USA game and by the Finland match he was demoted and Marner hasn’t been good.

 

[ToneDog]

Cooper was asked about the game opening fights vs USA. "Nothing tops that... you know why, because it wasn't planned, that wasn't two coaches throwing guys over and sayng this is happening..none of that happened, this was as organic as it gets..that was probably 10 years of no international hockey exhaled in a minute and a half.

Meanwhile the reporter later tells him the Tkatchuk brothers planned the fights before the game in a group chat lol.

Hard to believe they did not insure themselves against the Tkachuk brothers. Matthew is chicken shit so he picks on Hagel. If Tom Wilson were there Matthew would have tucked his tail between his legs and kept his distance. I like their chances if a few USA players are not 100% but this management team was unprepared.

 

[leafs in five]

[
Yet... he demoted Marner to the checking line and also gave him the least 5v5 mins of all players and 2nd least total minutes of all forwards? Also...again, Mcdavid immediately noted Marner plays high in O zone and was subsequently shown on camera in a heated discussion with Marner during game 1.

Want to speak to this stuff? Or just waste everyone's time with your constant sarcastic useless posts?

Sure: I don't think playing high in the zone is some damning criticism and I think marner's comfort with trying to make plays in that area when time and space are in fact scarce is what results in turnovers. But we best leave it there before we get in any more trouble

 

[rumman]

Nothing wrong with being a 3rd. liner on this team.

He's lining up behind the best Canadian forwards.

Hope the line up is relivent when he wants to resign, his ask had better be in line with hus peers, he’s nowhere near the players ahead of him and his contract should reflect this imo, but you just know the idiots running MLSE will open the vault for underwhelming Mitch……..

 

[Stephen]

Hard to believe they did not insure themselves against the Tkachuk brothers. Matthew is chicken shit so he picks on Hagel. If Tom Wilson were there Matthew would have tucked his tail between his legs and kept his distance. I like their chances if a few USA players are not 100% but this management team was unprepared.

Matthew Tkachuk is a showman and a circus but he puts himself out there for his club. Brady is just special, like he grew up beside a power plant and is imbued with something normal people aren’t.

 

[Antropovsky]

Hard to believe they did not insure themselves against the Tkachuk brothers. Matthew is chicken shit so he picks on Hagel. If Tom Wilson were there Matthew would have tucked his tail between his legs and kept his distance. I like their chances if a few USA players are not 100% but this management team was unprepared.

They talked about this on Kyper show. They said that because it replaced the Allstar game, Canada wasn't sure if players were gonna play with effort. So they went with "skill" over grit and toughness. However, players came out like it was a playoff series.

At the very least it was fun watching Parayko beat up Miller.

 

[rumman]

Not happening. The Leafs would give him $13m today but he is too greedy and too stupid to take it.

He’s worth nowhere near 13mil, not now, not ever…….

 

[Funk21]

It’s not even fun to be on here anymore. It’s constant negativity. No constructive criticism, no reasonable takes. Just personal shots. It sucks, what a fall from grace this place used to be. A big part of me honestly hopes Marner walks or something. Cause I wanna see where the anger gets directed to next.

Bennett at 7 or 8 million is gonna be a treat lmao!’

Bennett should not get 7-8 and if he does that will be a mistake for any team looking to contend. Other than that one year he is more in line with a very solid 3C. Not elite but very good.

He is the type of player we need but I wouldn’t consider anything above 5-6 million per. Guy would provide some needed grit and would also allow Minten to start his NHL career on the wing with a lot less responsibility.

 

[rumman]

Sometimes the best deals you make in life are the ones you don't make.

JT at 7mil for 3 years is a boat anchor in the making, nothing changes without change, move forward without JT and Marner………

 

[thewave]

JT at 7mil for 3 years is a boat anchor in the making, nothing changes without change, move forward without JT and Marner………

I thinknits the only way. Ideally you get a return on Marner. Doubt it.

 

[Fogelhund]

JT at 7mil for 3 years is a boat anchor in the making, nothing changes without change, move forward without JT and Marner………

and overpay, for players who are worse.... Now, we might be able to overpay three players, instead of two...

 

[BraveCanadian]

Bennett should not get 7-8 and if he does that will be a mistake for any team looking to contend. Other than that one year he is more in line with a very solid 3C. Not elite but very good.

He is the type of player we need but I wouldn’t consider anything above 5-6 million per. Guy would provide some needed grit and would also allow Minten to start his NHL career on the wing with a lot less responsibility.

Agreed. I still don't get the hype around Bennett. He'd be in the box or suspended all the time if he played for Toronto. Even assuming he cleaned up his act, that takes away the only thing that stands out about him (injuring opponents intentionally) and then you have a 7-8 million dollar who tops out at < 50 points as a player.

 

[arso40]

Agreed. I still don't get the hype around Bennett. He'd be in the box or suspended all the time if he played for Toronto. Even assuming he cleaned up his act, that takes away the only thing that stands out about him (injuring opponents intentionally) and then you have a 7-8 million dollar who tops out at < 50 points as a player.

Probably just a way to write the kadri wrong cause every team needs a couple of those guys we don’t even have one In the forward group damn I miss komarov

 

[thewave]

Probably just a way to write the kadri wrong cause every team needs a couple of those guys we don’t even have one In the forward group damn I miss komarov

It's amazing how some guys just have that swagger about them that infects a team. Roberts Tucker Clark Dougie Komarov Kadri all had it to different degrees. Sundin wanted to have it, great player but didn't quite have it. Close.

When those guys called out the bench or showed up on the ice ready to go, everyone else on the team grew 5 inches and gained 30lbs.

 

[Aashir]

Bennett should not get 7-8 and if he does that will be a mistake for any team looking to contend. Other than that one year he is more in line with a very solid 3C. Not elite but very good.

He is the type of player we need but I wouldn’t consider anything above 5-6 million per. Guy would provide some needed grit and would also allow Minten to start his NHL career on the wing with a lot less responsibility.

not sure if this will make sense or not, but this is the problem, we are always going after Bennett, Wilson, Gourde, Tanev, Montour...

we needed to find them before they broke out i.e. Bennett from Calgary, Wilson pre-breakout, gourde from tampa, tanev from vancouver, Montour from anaheim. Those were the times to aqcuire these players, when they costed only draft picks but had multiple seasons at low cap hits

we need to find the next iteration of these players (good players in bad situations/on bad teams making less) and nab those guys. Not the players who have won, sacrificed their body and added tough injuries and games played onto it

We will end up overpaying for players who have a ton of mileage on them and will be less effective and breakdown.

McMann is one of those type of players, because he is on a great deal as we signed him when he was on the uptick, but still not doing much.

 

[arso40]

Leafs morning take

 

[Ports]

Just saying let him go and all you're left with is a handful of pixie dust and a wishlist. It could be that all those UFAs may want to play in Toronto ONLY IF the Leafs are paying big time coin, and outbidding the others, and isn't that the exact reason they're in the spot they're in? That is paying guys a lot more than their worth?

Lets face it, our Bud's are between a rock and a hard place and they(Dubas mostly) did it to themselves.

The only way out IMO is by offloading 1 or 2 of those contracts and hope that what comes back in trade is better than what would maybe come back to the team in UFA. Seriously is letting Marner walk for nothing really going to help, or does it just decrease our assets further.

Who are you going to trade who is of any value to another team and doesn’t have a full NMC ? Knies or McMann ?

 

[Niagara Bill]

It is clear that Mitchy will not resign with Leafs. He expects too much, the press and fans are too tough on him. There is a big divide, he and dad believe he is elite, Leafs and Leaf fans believe his is very very good. That amounts to 3m per yr.
He will accept a better tax situation to max his small 12m per, and an admiring crowd like Carolina, or Florida, or Vegas.
He sure can play some skilled hockey, hockey that is fun to watch, but too many shy plays to be the #1 or# 2 on a winning team.

 

[Ports]

That's the beauty of being the coach of a player who doesn't answer to the owners, doesn't need to play nice, whisper sweet nothings in the ears of media or the fanbase. Coaching a nation means one thing: do whatever you believe is right in order to win.

When down 4-3, he has Crosby, McKinnon and Toews on the ice. Veteran winners who have risen to the occasion time and again.

Crosby sacrifices the body and gets the EN. Which Leaf would have taken that hit that takes the wind out of you in order to stop the bleeding?

Matthew Knies. Future captain.

Cooper has buttered him up to the media repeatedly though

Hopes to sign him as a UFA this summer for $9M in Florida (no state tax but lots of sunshine) Florida dollars.

 

[Ports]

Marner's a high ceiling, low floor player who can look like a magician one night and a finger painter the next. I'm not surprised but Cooper's big adjustment just tells you things are not going well with him.

If you look at Canada’s best players over the three games they’re guys who’ve won cups or gone on deep playoff runs something Marner, Matthews and Nylander haven’t done. The pace and intensity of these games is similar to a cup final. It’s a chicken and egg thing. Marner has never been able to elevate his game and compete physically in most first round playoff games and because of his place in the Leafs pecking order the team can’t get out of the first round either so this all new to him and his play shows it. Not surprising.

Let’s stop beating around the bush. Marner is not a big game player…Full stop. He isn’t worth 12.5 or 13 million his team is looking for. Dubas really screwed us on him and Tre and the Brass didn’t do enough to find a trade partner when we could have dealt him. If he walks away for nothing I think that’s a fireable offence.

Shrinking violets.

You think “Run it Back” Shanny would have let Tre trade him a month into the job ?

 

[Ports]

Let’s stop beating around the bush. Marner is not a big game player…Full stop. He isn’t worth 12.5 or 13 million his team is looking for. Dubas really screwed us on him and Tre and the Brass didn’t do enough to find a trade partner when we could have dealt him. If he walks away for nothing I think that’s a fireable offence.

Shrinking violets.

You think “Run it Back” Shanny would have let Tre trade him a month into the job ?

It’s a frustrated fan base that has turned on Marner. I think Matthews up till this year has been getting away with murder. He should be getting a lot more heat than he receives.

He does get heat though because he isn’t the Alpha Dog the team needs from its number one centre and captain. When he’s on he’s the best goal scorer in the league but doesn’t excel once the ice is more contested in the playoffs. Their core five are all what they are and we can’t wish they were something else. Collectively they don’t have what it takes to lead the team on a cup run. If Leafs management could take that $50M or at least a big part of it and start over 9 years ago I think they would do it.

 

[Leaf Fans]

Cooper admits that Marner is a tiny/weak, average skilled player with exception to being able to make little plays on tight. Essentially the very same thing I've been saying for year about Marner.

Cooper is 100% right about Marners lack of high end skill and lack of size... but he is off about Marners ability to make little plays in tight. Marner hangs around the perimeter because that's where he can buy time to create offense (because he cant make plays in tight!).

Mcdavid very quickly identified this with Marner after practice 1 where he said "(Marner) plays high in the zone".

He didmention size and speed but didn't mention weakness (that was you spinning) he emphasised how well he thinks and processes the game and follows with his personal experience coaching against in the playoffs.





His conclusion: "There are not too many guys who can excel as a power play player, a penalty killer, a 5-on-5 guy, and at 3-on-3. Mitch can do it all.”

 

[Antropovsky]

He didmention size and speed but didn't mention weakness (that was you spinning) he emphasised how well he thinks and processes the game and follows with his personal experience coaching against in the playoffs.





His conclusion: "There are not too many guys who can excel as a power play player, a penalty killer, a 5-on-5 guy, and at 3-on-3. Mitch can do it all.”

What do you mean he didn't mention weak? He said "when your that size"...

Marner is listed as 6' and Crosby is listed as 5'11 on the NHL website.

The difference is Crosby is strong and Marner isn't.

 

[Leaf Fans]

What do you mean he didn't mention weak? He said "when your that size"...

Marner is listed as 6' and Crosby is listed as 5'11 on the NHL website.

The difference is Crosby is strong and Marner isn't.

Read it "when your that size"... Where does he mention weak? You are inferring weakness by assuming Cooper implied it.
In summary, he did not mention it.