Player Discussion Mitch Marner Part Infinity

[Peasy]

I don't ignore playoff performance. I just also don't ignore the other 99% of relevant information in order to focus exclusively on one specific stat without context in the tiny sample of games where that one stat is most skewed by external factors and the vastly different situations players experience, like you do to make claims opposite of what that other 99% of information clearly shows.

It's not unprecedented for a 4th overall to be sent back, but it's pretty unusual for a 4th overall in one of the best drafts of a generation that already put up 2+ P/GP in both the regular season and playoffs to be sent back.

The guy drafted ahead of him at 3 was sent back for 2 years. But yeah, its super common to throw a physically underdeveloped 18 year old into the grind of the NHL

Andrew Cristall is probably fuming at the Caps and is going to hold a grudge against them for sending him back in his D+2.

 

[Stephen]

It's not unprecedented for a 4th overall to be sent back, but it's pretty unusual for a 4th overall in one of the best drafts of a generation that already put up 2+ P/GP in both the regular season and playoffs to be sent back.

Seriously, stop inventing new gripes where there was none.

Same draft, Dylan Strome was selected third overall. He outscored Marner 129 to 126. And guess what. They sent his generational ass back the OHL back in 2015-16 too.

This dude was not making the NHL at 18 in a tank season.

 

[Gabriel426]

he didn't cost the Panthers much more than what we paid for Laughton

Different times, it was before tariffs where everything was cheaper, lol

 

[Gallagbi]

Seriously, stop inventing new gripes where there was none.

Same draft, Dylan Strome was selected third overall. He outscored Marner 129 to 126. And guess what. They sent his generational ass back the OHL back in 2015-16 too.

This dude was not making the NHL at 18 in a tank season.

They also traded Strome because he wasn't developing as hoped

 

[Gabriel426]

If memory serves, his 4 goals last night were more than Marner has ever scored in a full playoff year. Let that sink in.

He has also scored 5 of the 6 goals the Panthers have scored in their two SC clinching games. But hey, Marner had a great time on the lake yesterday,

I can say Reinhart is not a passenger and clutch

 

[The Shadow]

Hopefully soon we can just forget about this guy

He accomplished nothing in his 9 years here

 

[Caesium]

Hopefully soon we can just forget about this guy

He accomplished nothing in his 9 years here

There's nothing stopping you from just not looking at things related to Marner. If you're sick of seeing his name, stop reading it.

 

[Peasy]

Hopefully soon we can just forget about this guy

He accomplished nothing in his 9 years here

He accomplished acquiring some very dedicated fanboys

 

[The Shadow]

There's nothing stopping you from just not looking at things related to Marner. If you're sick of seeing his name, stop reading it.

Good another person to add to my ignore list. Thank you

 

[Stephen]

They also traded Strome because he wasn't developing as hoped

For sure, the past 9 years shows Marner was a big success relative to Strome 100%, but both guys started out in similar places and it was reasonable that both went back to the OHL without the implication of an insult in September 2015.

Marner’s own words. “Leafs took maybe a risky pick on a small kid…” that kid wouldn’t have been putting on airs that he had to go back to London and have a shot at the Mem Cup.

 

[Gallagbi]

For sure, the past 9 years shows Marner was a big success relative to Strome 100%, but both guys started out in similar places and it was reasonable that both went back to the OHL without the implication of an insult in September 2015.

Marner’s own words. “Leafs took maybe a risky pick on a small kid…” that kid wouldn’t have been putting on airs that he had to go back to London and have a shot at the Mem Cup.

I thought it was well known we kept Marner (and Nylander and Hyman) down an extra year to make us worse for the tank

I wouldn't hold it as a grudge and there's lots of things I wouldn't have done as Marner, but Strome as the standard when he struggled so much to adapt to NHL speeds is a bit of a different spot.

 

[Stephen]

I thought it was well known we kept Marner (and Nylander and Hyman) down an extra year to make us worse for the tank

I wouldn't hold it as a grudge and there's lots of things I wouldn't have done as Marner, but Strome as the standard when he struggled so much to adapt to NHL speeds is a bit of a different spot.

Will agree to disagree with the Strome thing and the motivations for sending Marner back to juniors. The original point of contention is 4th overall picks are rarely sent back to juniors for a D+1, but it’s really quite common.

 

[Peasy]

I thought it was well known we kept Marner (and Nylander and Hyman) down an extra year to make us worse for the tank

I wouldn't hold it as a grudge and there's lots of things I wouldn't have done as Marner, but Strome as the standard when he struggled so much to adapt to NHL speeds is a bit of a different spot.

A rebuilding team sending their most recent 4th overall pick back to juniors or where ever they were playing before is not crazy. Its literally standard procedure for rebuilding teams. It woulda been crazy and stupid not to send him back. He was a fresh, physically underdeveloped 18 year old that probably weighed 170lbs at most.

 

[Stringer Bell]

I think Game 6 FLA and the 4 Nations finals were instructive in what Marner can do in a big game. Find a small area exploit play on a turnover, put a puck on the tape of someone heading north with purpose and job well done.

Problem with that is it’s a sidekick job and he wants 40% more than a multiple cup winning warhorse like Barkov.

If little buddy wasn’t intent on squeezing every penny like he’s trying to invent copper wiring he would be a lot more comfortable.

It's also arguably not enough for 60 minutes of play. I really appreciated both of those plays - but he wasn't dangerous outside of them. That still matters.

 

[Punch Drunk Loov]

I'm glad he's not returning. It was still very clumsy of our management to try to both sign and trade him when neither was on the table

 

[IPS]

Seriously, stop inventing new gripes where there was none.

Same draft, Dylan Strome was selected third overall. He outscored Marner 129 to 126. And guess what. They sent his generational ass back the OHL back in 2015-16 too.

This dude was not making the NHL at 18 in a tank season.

It was widely agreed that another year of junior was the correct play with Marner and it turned out to be 100% correct. It really sounds like he's just bringing something up from 10 years ago and applying his hindsight bias to support his fantasy.

At what point do we call this a straight up PR campaign? My goodness we're scraping the bottom of the barrel now.

 

[Gaberd2608]

I mean I can't blame him I would take the highest contract and float for the rest of my life

If you could choose, which of the following companies would you want to work for?

Company 2 pays $37,500 more than company 1 so an argument can be made to take the money and run but imo a little less up front cash but a guaranteed pension/retirement + benefits, nice workplace, time to enjoy vacation with my family, security, etc is more important.

Company 1:
Base Salary $150,000
Pension
Great Benefits
Unlimited Vacation
Great culture
growth opportunities
Secured/safe in role
Prestigious Company

Company 2:
Base Salary $187,500
No pension or benefits
3 weeks vacation
limited growth potential
high turnover rate at company
regional/ local company.

In context of Marner, the Rantanen deal at $12 million x 7 years or $15 million x 3 years is the same difference in salary (25% more), but Marner wanted optically more money $15 million vs $12 million but less term means he is taking $45 million vs $84 million guaranteed.

Marner would be 31 years old and can probabaly sign another 4-5 year deal and maybe a 3 year deal but I think the league will be exhausted with him by that point. GMs and teams want some stability, not a revolving door. If I was a GM and was going to sign a player for $15 million that would represent a pretty big commitment on the organization's side. If the player only wanted to sign for 3-4 years I would run the other way personally. Other teams wont have the same history with him as the Leafs. Vegaas historically has been pretty cuthrought. Florida had no problem bouncing Huberdeau.

I think the teams that may be prepared to pay Marner $14-15 million would want a committment. It is unlikely a team like Chicago or San Jose will be competitive in 3 years and all that will happen is Marner gets paid but once again the team gets f*** all. Like I said, I think the schtick worked in Toronto because of history and Dubas/Shanny being idiots. I dont think a reaosnable GM/organization will play around like that. Marner's agent is also notoriously a so that probably wont help either.

 

[Stephen]

It was widely agreed that another year of junior was the correct play with Marner and it turned out to be 100% correct. It really sounds like he's just bringing something up from 10 years ago and applying his hindsight bias to support his fantasy.

At what point do we call this a straight up PR campaign? My goodness we're scraping the bottom of the barrel now.

The only rational thing left is a breakup. Not an angle to extract more favourable concessions.

 

[Punch Drunk Loov]

I bet Nick Robertson feels "disrespected" and nobody cares, nor should they. Obviously he's not a star, but being scratched or demoted is not a slight. It's extremely normal

 

[Caesium]

I wonder, does every player who chooses to go to UFA have their fans call it a "breakup", or do Leaf fans do that to feel better about themselves saying the most vile shit like defending death threats?

 

[Antropovsky]

Saw this summaty on reddit:

"Marner feels like he has taken too much of blame for the teams lack of success"

Marner, you fought tooth and nail for an 11 million dollar contract you didnt live up too! You have no major trophies and Team Canada picked Marchand, Reinhart and Point over you!

Dude take a hint that you arent as good as you think you are!

Marner doesnt get it... fans and former NHL player see him avoiding physical areas with their own eyes! They see the spinorama no look back hand pass - that leads to the critical goal against.

They see that he has just 7 assists in 20 game 5-6-7's, the lowest of the core 4 and substantially lower than Nylander and Matthews.

Rick Vaive, former leaf captain said he looks like a figure skater trying to avoid contact!

GTFO....

 

[Caesium]

Saw this summaty on reddit:

"Marner feels like he has takrn too much of blame for lack of success"

You fought tooth and nail for an 11 million dollar contract you didnt live up too! You have no major trophies and Team Canada picked Marchand, Reinhart and Point over you!

Dude take a hint that you arent as good as you think you are!

Marner doesnt get it... fans and former NHL player see him avoiding physical areas with their own eyes! They see the spinorama no look back hand pass - that leads to the critical goal against.

They see that he has just 7 assists in 20 game 5-6-7's, the lowest of the core 4 and substantially lower than Nylander and Matthews.

Rick Vaive, former leaf captain said he looks like a figure skater trying to avoid contact!

GTFO....

View attachment 1052076

This guy thinks that Team Canada will only have 6 players on it.

 

[Punch Drunk Loov]

I wonder, does every player who chooses to go to UFA have their fans call it a "breakup", or do Leaf fans do that to feel better about themselves saying the most vile shit like defending death threats?

Just the good ones. Tavares got it pretty bad. It's a real problem, but it'll be for every good athlete like them. Twitter in general is a nightmare. It means the player is relevant. Break up isn't really problematic but the vile stuff is

 

[Antropovsky]

This guy thinks that Team Canada will only have 6 players on it.

.....Marner will be (if he makes it) the highest paid player on it and didnt even make the first 6.

He was the least played player in game 3 at 4nations. Explain to everyone how being the least played player reflects on his play in games 1 and 2 for the coaching staff?

Do coaches usually drop their best players to 3rd lines and play them the least as a reward?

 

[Caesium]

.....Marner will be (if he makes it) the highest paid player on it and didnt even make the first 6. He was the least played player in game 3 at 4nations.

Tell us how being the least played player reflects on his play in games 1 and 2 for the coaching staff?

Do coaches usually drop their best players to 3rd lines and play them the least as a reward?

Take the bet, coward.