Player Discussion Mitch Marner Part Infinity

[sunstersun]

The thing is, not all points are created the same.

Even this year, I wasn't happy with how little Marner was driving the line to get his assists. He was the healthy superstar supposed to carry over injured Matthews and instead Knies is carrying the line.

I think the line of Knies, Matthews, and Domi will be very telling.

That's why I'm fine if we bridge Knies for 4 years. Let him really prove it.

 

[Leaf Fans]

Chris Johnston

Report: Leafs’ core four players believe they’re going to be back together after calls from Shanahan

The Toronto Maple Leafs' core four players don't think they're going a...

theleafsnation.com

So the new GM didn't have a different perspective. If he did one, two or all of them could have been traded.

 

[Leaf Fans]

Yeah, I think Team Canada picked whom they believed where their best players available.

Do you think they choose just 6 random players and hoping to add betters ones at a later date?

Auston Mathews for USA and Willy Nylander of Sweden were named to their countries, and that wasn't pure luck on their parts, as I also believe those countries intended to pick their top 6 countrymen as well.

Marner is not consider the best in the World, because he wasn't even considered the best among Canadians only,

That all seems like perfectly reasonable logic to me.

Some of them. They didn't pick a goal keeper. They only made the one change from the top six from the 4 nations.

 

[Mess]

Ooh No .. No All-star Team for Marner either.

NHL Announces 2024-25 All-Star Teams​

First Team​

LW Kyle Connor (Jets)
C Nathan MacKinnon (Avalanche)
RW Nikita Kucherov (Lightning)
D Cale Makar (Avalanche)
D Zach Werenski (Blue Jackets)
G Connor Hellebuyck (Jets)

Second Team​

LW Brandon Hagel (Lightning)
C Leon Draisaitl (Oilers)
RW David Pastrňák (Bruins)
D Victor Hedman (Lightning)
D Quinn Hughes (Canucks)
G Andrei Vasilevskiy (Lightning)

Poor Mitch not even as regular season performers is he considered among the best.

This is not going go over well with Mitch,

 

[Leaf Fans]

Yeah, I think Team Canada picked whom they believed where their best players available.

Do you think they choose just 6 random players and hoping to add betters ones at a later date?

Auston Mathews for USA and Willy Nylander of Sweden were named to their countries, and that wasn't pure luck on their parts, as I also believe those countries intended to pick their top 6 countrymen as well.

Marner is not consider the best in the World, because he wasn't even considered the best among Canadians only,

That all seems like perfectly reasonable logic to me.

I didn't say he should have been picked. I only noted the one change from the first six from the 4 nations. Status quo for Marner. He wasn't picked either time.

 

[Apex Predator]

So the new GM didn't have a different perspective. If he did one, two or all of them could have been traded.

Or Shanny would block any trade or not allow.

 

[Fogelhund]

Ooh No .. No All-star Team for Marner either.

NHL Announces 2024-25 All-Star Teams​

First Team​

LW Kyle Connor (Jets)
C Nathan MacKinnon (Avalanche)
RW Nikita Kucherov (Lightning)
D Cale Makar (Avalanche)
D Zach Werenski (Blue Jackets)
G Connor Hellebuyck (Jets)

Second Team​

LW Brandon Hagel (Lightning)
C Leon Draisaitl (Oilers)
RW David Pastrňák (Bruins)
D Victor Hedman (Lightning)
D Quinn Hughes (Canucks)
G Andrei Vasilevskiy (Lightning)

Poor Mitch not even as regular season performers is he considered among the best.

This is not going go over well with Mitch,

View attachment 1051089

It's kind of crazy that McDavid isn't a first, or second team all-star though.

 

[ACC1224]

Ooh No .. No All-star Team for Marner either.

NHL Announces 2024-25 All-Star Teams​

First Team​

LW Kyle Connor (Jets)
C Nathan MacKinnon (Avalanche)
RW Nikita Kucherov (Lightning)
D Cale Makar (Avalanche)
D Zach Werenski (Blue Jackets)
G Connor Hellebuyck (Jets)

Second Team​

LW Brandon Hagel (Lightning)
C Leon Draisaitl (Oilers)
RW David Pastrňák (Bruins)
D Victor Hedman (Lightning)
D Quinn Hughes (Canucks)
G Andrei Vasilevskiy (Lightning)

Poor Mitch not even as regular season performers is he considered among the best.

This is not going go over well with Mitch,

View attachment 1051089

Is he on the 3rd team with McDavid?

 

[Leaf Fans]

Or Shanny would block any trade or not allow.

Doubtful, but possible.

 

[Mess]

It's kind of crazy that McDavid isn't a first, or second team all-star though.

Connor's teammate Draisaitl has been better in regular season and playoffs. McDavid only played 67 games and still managed 100 points but his missed time likely the main reason he is not on either all-star team.

The selection committee commented on their decision process.

"In the closest vote, MacKinnon nearly beat out Draisaitl as the league’s top center from the 2024-25 season, with Draisaitl receiving more First Team votes than MacKinnon. Still, the 2023-24 Most Valuable Player scored 10 more points than Draisaitl this year, while arguably being a larger part of his team’s success without having Connor McDavid as a teammate.

As previously mentioned, the vote between Draisaitl and MacKinnon came down to the wire. Draisaitl finished with an equally impressive season, scoring 52 goals and 106 points in 71 games, securing the Maurice Richard Trophy as the league’s top goal-scorer. Furthermore, in a solid argument for Draisaitl, he finished sixth in Selke Trophy voting,"

Under as similar logic pattern Marner's stats are artificially inflated and reliant on his goal scoring teammates Matthews, Nylander and Tavares that he is surrounded with.

Going to be interesting to see how Marner's stats are impacted in the future on his new team without all the offensive support. When you have 3 other teammates among the top 10 highest paid in the NHL, then its the environment more then the player that is the the difference maker.

 

[Trapper]

Besides you can’t seperated his regular season performance from his playoffs. They have to be taken together to assign legitimate value

Had Matthews and Marner been paid properly the last round (the RFA round), I would have no problem paying:
Matthews: 13.5
Marner: 12.5
Nylander: 11.5
But Matthews/Marner went from RFA to the Tavares contract signed as a 9 year UFA.

Matthews should have made the Eichel contract, around 10/10.5, Marner 8, Nylander 7. That would have been a 5 mil saving, allowing us to keep Marleau and not trade a 1st and re-sign Hyman at the 5 range.

Those RFA contracts killed the structure, then the players themselves made the salaries paid (and themselves) unlikable.

 

[ACC1224]

It's kind of crazy that McDavid isn't a first, or second team all-star though.

.......or Matthews or Nylander. I'm sure @Mess is very concerned with their omission.

 

[29Potvin]

So the new GM didn't have a different perspective. If he did one, two or all of them could have been traded.

He tried looked into trading both Willy and Mitch. Almost traded Mitch and from the sounds of it just believed the offers for Willy didn't match what he was looking for.
Could you imagine if he traded Willy in a Hall for Larsson type deal or straight futures?
The Leafs weren't winning a Willy trade but Mitch on the other hand we had the opportunity to improve the team.
Now his agent is saying he may take until mid July to sign and wants to visit each city and that they haven't told the Leafs he won't return.

 

[Fogelhund]

Had Matthews and Marner been paid properly the last round (the RFA round), I would have no problem paying:
Matthews: 13.5
Marner: 12.5
Nylander: 11.5
But Matthews/Marner went from RFA to the Tavares contract signed as a 9 year UFA.

Matthews should have made the Eichel contract, around 10/10.5, Marner 8, Nylander 7. That would have been a 5 mil saving, allowing us to keep Marleau and not trade a 1st and re-sign Hyman at the 5 range.

Those RFA contracts killed the structure, then the players themselves made the salaries paid (and themselves) unlikable.

The math, just doesn't math to build a winning group.

For THIS round of contracts, it should be something like 12/10/10... for the prior... 10/8/7 is about right.

I had spoken about Matthews needing to take a bit of a discount.... like $12.. to be a "leader" and take a little less, in a statement about wanting to win, and be able to build a better team around them. I appreciate that this is an overall environment that makes that difficult, but it's clear building a winning team, and having success isn't the primary goal of these athletes.

 

[notDatsyuk]

He can help a Bubble team get in.
He can sell some tickets as well for a team that doesn't have many fans.
He provides great value for a team if your goal is ticket sales in the regular season.

He won't bring your team the Stanley Cup. Or more specifically his 13AAV is a NET negative for you to win a cup.

Many Owners would welcome him on their team.

I think that's really the bottom line: he can help a bubble team maybe make the playoffs, and he can sell tickets.

Leafs aren't a bubble team and they don't need help selling tickets.

 

[Trapper]

The math, just doesn't math to build a winning group.

For THIS round of contracts, it should be something like 12/10/10... for the prior... 10/8/7 is about right.

I had spoken about Matthews needing to take a bit of a discount.... like $12.. to be a "leader" and take a little less, in a statement about wanting to win, and be able to build a better team around them. I appreciate that this is an overall environment that makes that difficult, but it's clear building a winning team, and having success isn't the primary goal of these athletes.

I would have no problem paying them a little more this time as veteran UFA guys (and the Cap is rising so that’s how you reward in a family style environment) had they been reasonable to take better deals last time to have the resources to build a stronger winning environment.
Instead their greed and combined issues led to a playoff failing environment and high animosity among the fan base.
It’s time for 1 to move on.

 

[29Potvin]

Had Matthews and Marner been paid properly the last round (the RFA round), I would have no problem paying:
Matthews: 13.5
Marner: 12.5
Nylander: 11.5
But Matthews/Marner went from RFA to the Tavares contract signed as a 9 year UFA.

Matthews should have made the Eichel contract, around 10/10.5, Marner 8, Nylander 7. That would have been a 5 mil saving, allowing us to keep Marleau and not trade a 1st and re-sign Hyman at the 5 range.

Those RFA contracts killed the structure, then the players themselves made the salaries paid (and themselves) unlikable.

Matthews had better statistical numbers in each of his first three season was better defensively and helped his team get to the playoffs.
Eichel was the starting point not the comparable and even if it was the JT signing reset the internal cap structure as JT was quickly the 3rd best player on the team.

 

[Mess]

Not sure if this has been posted yet in this thread but it should convince most that Marner is moving on.

Mitch Marner Further Tarnishes His Legacy with the Leafs After Latest Announcement. Marner Makes Unfortunate Announcement About His Annual Charity Event in Toronto​

​

As Marner appears to be ghosting the Maple Leafs ahead of free agency, appearing destined to find a new home, the foundation announced that this summer's event, which was scheduled for July 10th and 11th, has been cancelled.

"After thoughtful consideration, we have made the difficult decision to cancel this year's event, scheduled for July 10th and 11th. The uncertainty around Mitch's summer schedule makes it challenging to plan responsibly. Out of respect for the time and commitment of our partners and supporters, we feel it's best to make this decision now. While we are disappointed not to come together this year, the Foundation will continue to honour all its commitments to charitable partners," read the post shared by Jonah Sigel of YYZ Sports Media

​

 

[Nineteen67]

Not sure if this has been posted yet in this thread but it should convince most that Marner is moving on.

Mitch Marner Further Tarnishes His Legacy with the Leafs After Latest Announcement. Marner Makes Unfortunate Announcement About His Annual Charity Event in Toronto​

​

As Marner appears to be ghosting the Maple Leafs ahead of free agency, appearing destined to find a new home, the foundation announced that this summer's event, which was scheduled for July 10th and 11th, has been cancelled.

"After thoughtful consideration, we have made the difficult decision to cancel this year's event, scheduled for July 10th and 11th. The uncertainty around Mitch's summer schedule makes it challenging to plan responsibly. Out of respect for the time and commitment of our partners and supporters, we feel it's best to make this decision now. While we are disappointed not to come together this year, the Foundation will continue to honour all its commitments to charitable partners," read the post shared by Jonah Sigel of YYZ Sports Media

​

The guy is really named Jonah Sigel?

 

[hockeywiz542]

Countdown to Free Agent Frenzy: Marner decision could extend to mid-July | TSN

TSN Hockey Insider Darren Dreger told TSN Radio 1050's First Up on Tuesday that he believes Mitch Marner's camp is expected to review their offers and visit cities with the hope of inking a new contract by the middle of July.

www.tsn.ca

 

[Fogelhund]

Mitch Marner News: The Marner Sweepstakes Set to Drag Into Mid-July, Holding a Franchise Hostage - NHL Trade Rumors

NHL insider Darren Dreger reveals Mitch Marner will meet with teams after July 1st, delaying his decision until mid-July. Get the latest Mitch Marner news now.

www.nhltraderumor.com

Excerpts

NHL insider Darren Dreger on TSN Radio 1050,

Dreger laid out a timeline that will have general managers across the league holding their breath. Marner and his camp are planning to entertain a select group of suitors after the free agency bell rings on July 1st. This won’t be a series of quick phone calls; we’re talking about a full-blown tour. Marner, along with his family, intends to visit a handful of chosen cities, meet with management, and get a feel for the organization before making a final commitment. The target date for a decision, as Dreger indicated, is around July 15th.

Hopefully everyone commits their cap elsewhere, and Marner is busy playing Musical chairs on his own, without a chair left to sit on.

 

[Kazparov]

Everyday I come in to watch you animals rip this guy to pieces in new and creative ways.

Keep up the good work all.

 

[Mess]

Maple Leafs Confirmed to Have a Meeting Set with Mitch Marner . Amid a very public and messy separation, Marner has reportedly set a meeting with the Maple Leafs to give them one final chance to re-sign him post July 1st.​

In sharing the news that Marner had been avoiding the Leafs, Friedman noted that his decision may not be made until well after July 1st as the former first-round pick has the intention of setting up meetings with potential suitors and then visiting those that are deemed 'finalists'. One of those meetings is reportedly being given to the Leafs, according to Friedman, which garnered a laugh from co-host Kyle Bukauskas.

At this point, fans and pundits are wondering what the point of the meeting is, given Marner's lack of willingness to negotiation or help facilitate a sign-and-trade.​

 

[Burnie97]

That Miami core made it to the finals 4 years in a row and won 2 of them.

I wouldn’t exactly compare Matthews and Marner to that era. Lol.

Fair .. I just meant down the road I could see them both signing with another team at the same time.

 

[MCR74]

Maple Leafs Confirmed to Have a Meeting Set with Mitch Marner . Amid a very public and messy separation, Marner has reportedly set a meeting with the Maple Leafs to give them one final chance to re-sign him post July 1st.​

​

In sharing the news that Marner had been avoiding the Leafs, Friedman noted that his decision may not be made until well after July 1st as the former first-round pick has the intention of setting up meetings with potential suitors and then visiting those that are deemed 'finalists'. One of those meetings is reportedly being given to the Leafs, according to Friedman, which garnered a laugh from co-host Kyle Bukauskas.

At this point, fans and pundits are wondering what the point of the meeting is, given Marner's lack of willingness to negotiation or help facilitate a sign-and-trade.​

Mitch / Paul - "I'm looking for $13M".

MLSE - "Awesome. We hope you find it".