Player Discussion Mitch Marner Part Infinity

[Tak7]

Show me. I've already provided multiple links stating a team can trade their negotiating rights to a player with a full NMC.

You haven't shown a single example of a team trading away a player's negotiating rights without having that player waive his trade / movement protection.

For 3 days you've argued steadfastly against a point that has been established as being wrong.

 

[The Hanging Jowl]

For the 95th time:

There is no difference between "negotiating rights", "exclusive team negotiating rights", and "player contract" - they are all the same thing within the context of this discussion.

The Toronto Maple Leafs Professional Hockey Club, competing in the National Hockey League, cannot receive any form of compensation in exchange for the ability of another Professional Hockey Club from the National Hockey League, granting that other team the ability to speak/negotiate a contract with Mitchell Marner, without Mitchell Marner waiving his No Movement Clause.

And for the 450th time:

"Yes, if an NHL player has a full no-movement clause (NMC), they do not need to waive it to have only their negotiating rights traded before they become a UFA. A NMC means the player must approve any trade, not just whether they can be traded, and an NMC is in effect until the end of a player's contract. "

Google Search

 

[The Hanging Jowl]

You haven't shown a single example of a team trading away a player's negotiating rights without having that player waive his trade / movement protection.

For 3 days you've argued steadfastly against a point that has been established as being wrong.

"Yes, it's possible for an NHL team to trade the rights to negotiate with a player about to become an Unrestricted Free Agent (UFA), even if the player doesn't waive their no-movement clause. In this scenario, the acquiring team gains an exclusive window to negotiate with the player before they become a UFA and other teams can offer contracts. "

Numerous examples listed in the Sportsnet article.

"Example: Sportsnet.ca reported that the Florida Panthers traded the rights to negotiate with Jay Bouwmeester to the Calgary Flames in 2009. Calgary then had a few days to negotiate with Bouwmeester before he became a UFA, and they were able to agree on a contract."

"Google Search"

 

[JKG33]

And for the 450th time:

"Yes, if an NHL player has a full no-movement clause (NMC), they do not need to waive it to have only their negotiating rights traded before they become a UFA. A NMC means the player must approve any trade, not just whether they can be traded, and an NMC is in effect until the end of a player's contract. "

Google Search

Bro you just cooked yourself

 

[Tak7]

And for the 450th time:

"Yes, if an NHL player has a full no-movement clause (NMC), they do not need to waive it to have only their negotiating rights traded before they become a UFA. A NMC means the player must approve any trade, not just whether they can be traded, and an NMC is in effect until the end of a player's contract. "

Google Search

Are you really going to cite "GOOGLE SEARCH", and share said GOOGLE SEARCH, without actually checking that the answer you are receiving from your GOOGLE SEARCH is from AI which is drawing it's answers from two articles that.... don't actually discuss no movement clauses in relation to negotiating rights?

Nowhere, in any of those links cited, does it state anywhere that negotiating rights are excluded from the NMC.

Want to know why?

Because negotiating rights are not excluded from trade protection clauses.

 

[thewave]

For the 95th time:

There is no difference between "negotiating rights", "exclusive team negotiating rights", and "player contract" - they are all the same thing within the context of this discussion.

The Toronto Maple Leafs Professional Hockey Club, competing in the National Hockey League, cannot receive any form of compensation in exchange for the ability of another Professional Hockey Club from the National Hockey League, granting that other team the ability to speak/negotiate a contract with Mitchell Marner, without Mitchell Marner waiving his No Movement Clause.

I swear they are allowed to let other teams talk to him and his agent. You're saying he has to waive a no movement clause to talk to another team through his agent?

 

[Tak7]

"Yes, it's possible for an NHL team to trade the rights to negotiate with a player about to become an Unrestricted Free Agent (UFA), even if the player doesn't waive their no-movement clause. In this scenario, the acquiring team gains an exclusive window to negotiate with the player before they become a UFA and other teams can offer contracts. "

Numerous examples listed in the Sportsnet article.

"Example: Sportsnet.ca reported that the Florida Panthers traded the rights to negotiate with Jay Bouwmeester to the Calgary Flames in 2009. Calgary then had a few days to negotiate with Bouwmeester before he became a UFA, and they were able to agree on a contract."

"Google Search"

JAY BOUWMEESTER WAIVED HIS NO TRADE CLAUSE in order to have his negotiating rights traded from Florida to Calgary.

GoOoOoGle SeArCh

Mic Drop. End of Conversation. Game Over. Enough of this topic.

 

[LeafGrief]

Which “reality will reveal itself shortly” ?
If it’s Mess always being wrong that was revealed years ago.

Well, the claim that "reality" is that almost, if not every GM in the league would give him 14m is putting a big bet behind a pretty hot take. Bold move, we'll see what true reality reflects, much the same as we argued all year to see what happened in the playoffs.

 

[JKG33]

I swear they are allowed to let other teams talk to him and his agent. You're saying he has to waive a no movement clause to talk to another team through his agent?

The Leafs can allow teams to talk to Marner, as that would not involve a trade

 

[Tak7]

I swear they are allowed to let other teams talk to him and his agent. You're saying he has to waive a no movement clause to talk to another team through his agent?

Officially? Yes.

But with tampering etc., we know that doesn't happen.

However, if for example, (extremely dumb hypothetical scenario) the Sabres offered the Leafs five 1st round picks in exchange for Marner's negotiating rights (a few days of exclusive negotiating window with Marner before free agency opened), Marner would have to waive his NMC in order for that transaction to occur.

 

[thewave]

Officially? Yes.

But with tampering etc., we know that doesn't happen.

However, if for example, (extremely dumb hypothetical scenario) the Sabres offered the Leafs five 1st round picks in exchange for Marner's negotiating rights (a few days of exclusive negotiating window with Marner before free agency opened), Marner would have to waive his NMC in order for that transaction to occur.

I think I know the issue here.

You are allowed to permiss conversation where a team may approach the players agent and have a conversation without numbers (lol) or negotiations.

It's where they put a number on a napkin pretty much. You know the old. 7 12.5

Then the obvious, what if a bitcoin fell off the digital wagon in Tokyo and you virtually accept it.

Yes sir 7 15.5 Paul

You know, A Dubasian type of deal

 

[Tak7]

Bro you just cooked yourself

"Just" ?

It's been 3 days - he's been cooked for so long he's about to get sent back to the kitchen for being burnt.

 

[The Hanging Jowl]

Are you really going to cite "GOOGLE SEARCH", and share said GOOGLE SEARCH, without actually checking that the answer you are receiving from your GOOGLE SEARCH is from AI which is drawing it's answers from two articles that.... don't actually discuss no movement clauses in relation to negotiating rights?

Nowhere, in any of those links cited, does it state anywhere that negotiating rights are excluded from the NMC.

Want to know why?

Because negotiating rights are not excluded from trade protection clauses.

Incorrect. The first link clearly stated from the Google search a team's negotiating rights can be traded even if a pending Ufa doesn't waive their NMC.

 

[JKG33]

Incorrect. The first link clearly stated from the Google search a team's negotiating rights can be traded even if a pending Ufa doesn't waive their NMC.

I.. uh...

 

[thewave]

"Just" ?

It's been 3 days - he's been cooked for so long he's about to get sent back to the kitchen for being burnt.

So over cooked you could consume the carbon to treat the Ethanol you accidentally drank and were subsequently poisoned by.

Whew that felt good. I am free!

 

[PromisedLand]

I would love for Brad to replace Tavares with Bennett and Marner with Ehlers and Granlund.

Imo we are a better team with Ehlers, Bennett and Granlund. Would also love to trade Rielly and use that money to sign Provorov. Would be a miracle but if we could recoop a first in a Rielly deal would be some tidy business.

Knies-Matthews-Boeser
Ehlers-Bennet-Nylander
Cowan-Granland-Domi/Robertson
Lorentz-Laughton-McMann/Tanev/Reavo*

Gotta play Reaves in regular season as a face puncher a bit

McCabe Tanev
OEL Ekblad
Benoit Carlo


LFG!

 

[Tak7]

Incorrect. The first link clearly stated from the Google search a team's negotiating rights can be traded even if a pending Ufa doesn't waive their NMC.

The first link you provided:

LMFAO!!

Read it very slowly. Read it very carefully.

 

[Mess]

Much like Marner's performance in the playoffs, "reality" will reveal itself shortly.

But I do suppose this answer's Mess's question that there's at least a few.

Sadly there will always be some desperate or incompetent GM that destroys the salary cap comparables for others.

Teams like San Jose or Columbus or Anaheim teams with lots of cap and desperate to improve in the regular season are perfect to overpay Marner often to save the butt of the GM, because their goal is improvement and making the playoffs not winning a Championship.

Good teams with Cup hopes either don't have the Cap space and also witness how useless a player like Marner is come playoff time that wouldn't spend foolishly.

With Rantanen just resigning for $12 mil and how dominate he is in the playoffs that makes Marner's current $10.9 mil contract a over-payment for how poor his playoff play is. If salary Cap wasn't expected to massive +$5 mil or more inceases annually, then GM would have spend smarter and not harder.

 

[Aashir]

ain't no way this marner NMC has been the topic for 3 days

 

[Stephen]

And for the 450th time:

"Yes, if an NHL player has a full no-movement clause (NMC), they do not need to waive it to have only their negotiating rights traded before they become a UFA. A NMC means the player must approve any trade, not just whether they can be traded, and an NMC is in effect until the end of a player's contract. "

Google Search

I’m sure AI generated this but those are two somewhat contractory statements in and of themselves in isolation. One speaks to no approval being required to trade negotiating rights but then states the level of player control on approvals until the end of the contract.

 

[Stephen]

ain't no way this marner NMC has been the topic for 3 days

FFS the compensation we get back is $10.93161616 million in cap space. Time to move on with life.

 

[thewave]

I’m sure AI generated this but those are two somewhat contractory statements in and of themselves in isolation. One speaks to no approval being required to trade negotiating rights but then states the level of player control on approvals until the end of the contract.

Pretty sure it's. Permission to talk - Yes
Permission to negotiate - No

 

[Stephen]

Pretty sure it's. Permission to talk - Yes
Permission to negotiate - No

Yeah there’d be some grey area there. The tricky part is compensation. Do you get a 6th round pick for future considerations type thing.

 

[AvroArrow]

Maple Leafs twitter posted pics "Combine throwbacks" pretty much everyones pic is posted except Marner

He's gooooooooooone

 

[AvroArrow]

Doubtful but most if not all GMs will pay it.
Welcome to reality.

And it will be a bad contract, he probably gets it. But he doesn't deserve it. Both things are true.