Player Discussion Mitch Marner Part Infinity

[Puckstuff]

Ok, you do raise a fair challenge. Subtract Marner and his cap hit, and how do you make this team equal or better than what it is today?

I'll bite lol. Below is my proposal with a few assumptions:

• Rielly agrees to waive his NMC/NTC and is dealt for picks and prospects (HUGE assumption)
• No tampering has occurred and that the Leafs are going to shoot their shot at McDavid knowing that he could re-sign from July 1, 2025 onwards
• The goal is still to win the Stanley Cup next season and beyond. Not just contend, but actually show up and try to win the damn thing.
• Cowan makes the roster and plays like a Top 9 RW (e.g. 3rd line, PP2)

Here's what I would do.

• Let Marner and Tavares walk
• Sign Gavrikov to $6.5M x 6 years (with Rielly gone, that's $24M of capspace left)
• Sign Jake Allen to $1.5M x 1 year ($22.5M left)
• Sign Mikael Granlund to $4.5M x 3 years ($18M left)
• Sign Brad Marchand to $3.5M x 1 year ($14.5M left)
• Sign Brendan Saad to $2M x 2 years ($12.5M left)
• Trade Anthony Stolarz (!!) and Nicholas Robertson to Buffalo for Alex Tuch ($10.5M left). This would be my big gamble for next season, that Joseph Woll is both healthy and able to become a true #1 with Allen and Murray as backups with Hildeby in the wings.

This leaves the Leafs with roughly $35M in capspace for the 2026 Summer.

2025 - 2026 Roster

Knies Matthews Tuch
Marchand Granlund Nylander
Saad Domi Cowan
McMann Laughton Jarnkrok

McCabe Tanev
OEL Gavrikov
Benoit Carlo

Woll
Allen

I'm not sure if this team tips them over the scales against the likes of Florida, Colorado, etc., but it definitely makes them a grittier, tougher team to play against in the playoffs. Guys like Tuch and Gavrikov will block shots, use the stick to break up traffic, and proven winners like Marchand and Saad will play a complete game. Overall, there's still three solid lines of scoring and a good well-rounded Top 6 unless the wheels fall off of Tanev next year.

Goaltending goes from very high net positive to a positive with some question marks. But Woll's 27, had a good season with some solid playoff performances, so I'm banking on him to find that extra gear next year.

Not bad but some points:

• I highly doubt Buffalo is giving up Alex Tuch for Stolarz, who's already an older veteran goalie, and Robertson. Nor can we afford to give up Stolarz. Stolarz a good option for a win now team, not a team like Buffalo imo.
• I don't know how you conveniently just took Rielly off the roster without a buyout or cap retention.
• Domi is not a 3C imo. They would be better to get him on the wing.
• Marchand and Granlund are older players, and Marchand might regress next season. He'll be 38 by next playoffs. We saw how betting on older players turned out for Nashville this year.
• Granlund is a decent bet, though—I don't mind it, but I think he would cost more.
• I like Gavrikov. I'd easily swap out Rielly for Gavrikov.

So assuming we don't get Tuch, I'm not sure Granlund and Marchand are better than Tavares and Marner. Grittier, in my opinion, but definitely not better. Marchand works on Florida as he's the 5th or 6th best player on Florida. If a 38-year-old Marchand is the 4th or 5th best player on Toronto, that could be an issue.

Some good ideas, but mostly impractical—especially with Tuch and getting Rielly off this roster without a cost. Just don't think we're better with Marchand and Granlund than with Marner and J.T.

 

[PromisedLand]

I think we just gotta find a way to fill holes

Knies-Matthews-XXX
Cowan-XXX-Nylander
McMann-Domi-XXX/Robertson
Lorentz(re-sign)-Laughton-XXX

McCabe-Tanev
OEL/XXX (Rielly) - Carlo
Benoit - OEL/XXX

Stolarz
Woll

Issue is that Dubas in the past and treliving this season has already emptied the cupboards so we cannot even make a big play.

That said: Marner+Tavares+Kampf+Jarnkrok -> OUT PLUS cap increase gives us a lot of money to play with.

We need a 2C, and some wingers

if we can somehow spin the UFA market to grab and ice the following roster it might be a different look

Knies-Matthews-Boeser
Ehlers-XXX/Domi-Nylander
Cowan-Granlund/Nelson-McMann
Lorentz-Laughton-XXX

I wonder what it would take to get EP from Nucks he may need a change of scenery we just don't have the picks . Worse comes to wrose you re-sign Tavares (b/c we need 2C unless you wanna run Domi at 2C); and then figure out the rest.

if Rielly waves then we could do something like below get some picks/prospects which we could flip at around TDL next year

McCabe-Tanev
OEL-Ekblad
Benoit-Carlo
XXX

All in all am trying to say is that this is an opportunity for Treliving to give Leafs a new look with some sand/paper forwards who can chip in offensively. Goal is to make the playoffs even if it is as a wildcard; its what happens after in the playoffs that matters. Because playoffs is a different BEAST compared to regular season. And it starts with no marner on the team IMO

As much as I would like McJesus to come to Toronto; i really don't think he is leaving Edmonton. Draisaitl contract all but sealed the deal for McDavid. They hangout together every summer too. McJesus to Toronto is a pipe dream

 

[WilliamInLondon]

Not bad but some points:

• I highly doubt Buffalo is giving up Alex Tuch for Stolarz, who's already an older veteran goalie, and Robertson. Nor can we afford to give up Stolarz. Stolarz a good option for a win now team, not a team like Buffalo imo.
• I don't know how you conveniently just took Rielly off the roster without a buyout or cap retention.
• Domi is not a 3C imo. They would be better to get him on the wing.
• Marchand and Granlund are older players, and Marchand might regress next season. He'll be 38 by next playoffs. We saw how betting on older players turned out for Nashville this year.
• Granlund is a decent bet, though—I don't mind it, but I think he would cost more.
• I like Gavrikov. I'd easily swap out Rielly for Gavrikov.

So assuming we don't get Tuch, I'm not sure Granlund and Marchand are better than Tavares and Marner. Grittier, in my opinion, but definitely not better. Marchand works on Florida as he's the 5th or 6th best player on Florida. If a 38-year-old Marchand is the 4th or 5th best player on Toronto, that could be an issue.

Some good ideas, but mostly impractical—especially with Tuch and getting Rielly off this roster without a cost. Just don't think we're better with Marchand and Granlund than with Marner and J.T.

Buffalo desperately needs to make the playoffs, and to do so, they need a new goalie as I don't see UPL getting them to that next level. Who else would be a realistic target for them, if not Stolarz? He's $2.5M on an expiring deal that the Sabres would have 12 months to negotiate a new deal with. Or wait until 2026 to take a run at Markstrom or Demko.

But unless they upgrade their goaltending next season, it's another lost year for the Sabres. At least the team would be dealing from a position of strength with their wingers and young D. Unless they can re-sign Tuch this offseason (also a UFA), they'd probably want to deal him to address other gaps within their roster (e.g. goaltending).

RE: I don't know how you conveniently just took Rielly off the roster without a buyout or cap retention.

I said it was part of my assumption (and a huge one at that). Put differently, what's your proposal on the rebuild inclusive of Marner and Tavares? Feel free to link a different post if you've already shared it. I just don't see how running it back with Marner at $13M+ would yield a better outcome (I'd argue worse) than what I shared.

 

[ToneDog]

I think we just gotta find a way to fill holes

Knies-Matthews-XXX
Cowan-XXX-Nylander
McMann-Domi-XXX/Robertson
Lorentz(re-sign)-Laughton-XXX

McCabe-Tanev
OEL/XXX (Rielly) - Carlo
Benoit - OEL/XXX

Stolarz
Woll

Issue is that Dubas in the past and treliving this season has already emptied the cupboards so we cannot even make a big play.

That said: Marner+Tavares+Kampf+Jarnkrok -> OUT PLUS cap increase gives us a lot of money to play with.

We need a 2C, and some wingers

if we can somehow spin the UFA market to grab and ice the following roster it might be a different look

Knies-Matthews-Boeser
Ehlers-XXX/Domi-Nylander
Cowan-Granlund/Nelson-McMann
Lorentz-Laughton-XXX

I wonder what it would take to get EP from Nucks he may need a change of scenery we just don't have the picks . Worse comes to wrose you re-sign Tavares (b/c we need 2C unless you wanna run Domi at 2C); and then figure out the rest.

if Rielly waves then we could do something like below get some picks/prospects which we could flip at around TDL next year

McCabe-Tanev
OEL-Carlo
Benoit-XXX
XXX

All in all am trying to say is that this is an opportunity for Treliving to give Leafs a new look with some sand/paper forwards who can chip in offensively. Goal is to make the playoffs even if it is as a wildcard; its what happens after in the playoffs that matters. Because playoffs is a different BEAST compared to regular season. And it starts with no marner on the team IMO

May not cost much if Canucks want to dump him and his salary. Although he is as soft as Marner in the playoffs. Could be a huge win or crippling loss.

 

[PromisedLand]

May not cost much if Canucks want to dump him and his salary. Although he is as soft as Marner in the playoffs. Could be a huge win or crippling loss.

EP is soft but not as soft as marner . I've seen EP lay some hits in the playoffs that said we gotta fill in the 2C hole. options right now are 1) Domi, 2) re-sign Tavares, 3) UFA market i just don't see any 2C out there. Too late to convert Nylander to 2C now....

 

[Nineteen67]

I think we just gotta find a way to fill holes

Knies-Matthews-XXX
Cowan-XXX-Nylander
McMann-Domi-XXX/Robertson
Lorentz(re-sign)-Laughton-XXX

McCabe-Tanev
OEL/XXX (Rielly) - Carlo
Benoit - OEL/XXX

Stolarz
Woll

Issue is that Dubas in the past and treliving this season has already emptied the cupboards so we cannot even make a big play.

That said: Marner+Tavares+Kampf+Jarnkrok -> OUT PLUS cap increase gives us a lot of money to play with.

We need a 2C, and some wingers

if we can somehow spin the UFA market to grab and ice the following roster it might be a different look

Knies-Matthews-Boeser
Ehlers-XXX/Domi-Nylander
Cowan-Granlund/Nelson-McMann
Lorentz-Laughton-XXX

I wonder what it would take to get EP from Nucks he may need a change of scenery we just don't have the picks . Worse comes to wrose you re-sign Tavares (b/c we need 2C unless you wanna run Domi at 2C); and then figure out the rest.

if Rielly waves then we could do something like below get some picks/prospects which we could flip at around TDL next year

McCabe-Tanev
OEL-Ekblad
Benoit-Carlo
XXX

All in all am trying to say is that this is an opportunity for Treliving to give Leafs a new look with some sand/paper forwards who can chip in offensively. Goal is to make the playoffs even if it is as a wildcard; its what happens after in the playoffs that matters. Because playoffs is a different BEAST compared to regular season. And it starts with no marner on the team IMO

May as well keep Marner if you’re looking at EP. At least Marner can attend meetings and doesn’t need to be baby sat all day.

 

[WilliamInLondon]

May not cost much if Canucks want to dump him and his salary. Although he is as soft as Marner in the playoffs. Could be a huge win or crippling loss.

Haha, would you do it? Problem for problem.

Pettersson for Rielly, Robertson, and a mid-level pick.

- Rielly goes home. Canucks get a lower AAV and termed albatross and $4M in cap space.
- Leafs get a proper #2 center, PP1, and potential headcase. Best 1-2 C in the NHL if Pettersson regains form. Ballard year pains if not.

 

[thewave]

Haha, would you do it? Problem for problem.

Pettersson for Rielly, Robertson, and a mid-level pick.

- Rielly goes home. Canucks get a lower AAV and termed albatross and $4M in cap space.
- Leafs get a proper #2 center, PP1, and potential headcase. Best 1-2 C in the NHL if Pettersson regains form. Ballard year pains if not.

Not sure what EP would fetch

 

[PromisedLand]

May as well keep Marner if you’re looking at EP. At least Marner can attend meetings and doesn’t need to be baby sat all day.

fair enough... no EP

still gotta find a 2C though. Tavares is too slow, if we re-sign tavares then he gotta play on the LW something like...

Knies-Matthews-Boeser
Ehlers-Domi-Nylander
Cowan-Granlund/Nelson-Tavares
Lorentz-Laughton-McMann

that would be fine too . The 2C is still weak unless Domi re-invents himself

 

[Trapper]

Hopefully his rights are traded in June and then we will have a good idea of what is going down.

 

[Nineteen67]

fair enough... no EP

still gotta find a 2C though. Tavares is too slow, if we re-sign tavares then he gotta play on the LW something like...

Knies-Matthews-Boeser
Ehlers-Domi-Nylander
Cowan-Granlund/Nelson-Tavares
Lorentz-Laughton-McMann

that would be fine too . The 2C is still weak unless Domi re-invents himself

Don’t spend next year’s UFA money this year and play Domi at 2C if needed.

I would find out if Marner is interested in San Jose and I would pitch them on taking both Matthews and Marner.

 

[PromisedLand]

Don’t spend next year’s UFA money this year and play Domi at 2C if needed.

I would find out if Marner is interested in San Jose and I would pitch them on taking both Matthews and Marner.

McDavid ain't coming to Toronto.

Also I have more faith in Matthews. Matthews is not an issue IMO its Marner. I'd rather keep Matthews, worst comes to worst he is a UFA in 3 years; so Leafs could do some deal 2 years down the road if needed and then go the rebuild route.

IMO Matthews away from Marner would be dangerous and would be the player that we all expect him to be

 

[hullsy47]

Knies is becoming so overrated on this board...

A 0.53 PPG by any of the stars would get them run out of town.

People always post Marner's game 5-7 stats, here are Knies' from this year.

5 GP
0 G
0 A
0 P
-10

I wouldnt have minded the chicago trade for fluery and hagel

 

[Nineteen67]

McDavid ain't coming to Toronto.

Also I have more faith in Matthews. Matthews is not an issue IMO its Marner. I'd rather keep Matthews, worst comes to worst he is a UFA in 3 years; so Leafs could do some deal 2 years down the road if needed and then go the rebuild route.

IMO Matthews away from Marner would be dangerous and would be the player that we all expect him to be

Maybe, maybe not, but there are several other potential UFA next year - Makar, Eichel, Kaprizov - and not too much his year.

 

[TheGreenTBer]

This is precisely the same logic why this team has ran it back and failed for the last 9 years

Some people are really slow learners.

Are you saying they haven't learned their lessons? We've already established that you need to learn your lessons and pass the tests before you become sneaky elite, otherwise you're just a passenger.

 

[PromisedLand]

Maybe, maybe not, but there are several other potential UFA next year - Makar, Eichel, Kaprizov - and not too much his year.

Avs traded Rantanen so they will keep Makar
Eichel will re-up with VGK IMO
Kaprizov too will re-sign Wild IMO

We have 3 more years of Matthews Leafs gotta make use of those 3 years after that its rebuild time anyway...

 

[Ulysses31]

tavares wants to stay on a discounted contract. imo leafs would be unwise to push him out considering the value.

 

[BTP]

The cap f***ing sucks. Allow us to build a super team goddamit

 

[Superstar]

He is a Toronto Boy who wants to to see the Leafs win... if he goes to Florida he will be doing that. Unfortunately for us, Zito is much to smart of a GM. He wont touch Marner with a 13.5 foot pole.

According to Marner, pole measures 15.5 foot...

 

[TheGreenTBer]

EP is soft but not as soft as marner . I've seen EP lay some hits in the playoffs that said we gotta fill in the 2C hole. options right now are 1) Domi, 2) re-sign Tavares, 3) UFA market i just don't see any 2C out there. Too late to convert Nylander to 2C now....

Mentally EP is even softer than Marner.

 

[Aashir]

Well with Carolina getting dominated by Florida it's looking like Toronto is the 2nd best team in the East. And they might be the 2nd best team in the entire NHL. If that's true (and it looks like it) when Florida loses Marchand because they won't be able to circumvent the cap again, the Leafs are a lot closer. The difference is 1 game between us and the best team in the NHL, and they are going to lose Marchand, which should narrow the gap.

Your argument would hold maybe if we didn’t get completely dominated games 5 and 7.

We stood no chance those games, we looked like the canes maybe worse.

We’ve topped out with this group, and it wasn’t good enough. Time for something new

 

[Superstar]

This makes the most sense to me. No sane contender will sign him to more than Rantanen money just by virtue of the fact that Rantanen is playing like a Hart candidate on a contending team for $12M AAV.

BUT - bubble teams that are looking to finally make a splash in the playoffs will be happy to overpay by $3M in cap money per year at a chance to improve the team in the short term and recoup that money in playoff revenue. It'd also generate a lot of splash for the organisation to land the most coveted UFA.

Utah makes the most sense in terms of being able to absorb Marner at $14M while still having money leftover to give Cooley and Doan sizeable raises. Chicago and Anaheim have over $100M in capspace next season and could throw $15M at Marner if they wanted to lol. So it's up to where Marner wants to go. If he wants to contend though, I'm highly skeptical that any of these three teams will be Cup contenders for the bulk of the 7 years if they throw $14M+ at him.

GM's have to be careful what they pay Marner...if they pay him too much, every player on the team and FAs in the future will want more money.

 

[Superstar]

tavares wants to stay on a discounted contract. imo leafs would be unwise to push him out considering the value.

Leafs will re-sign him at a discount...he scored 38 goals this season and still plays centre, and plays the PP1 unit...Leafs don't have a replacement for that.

 

[Superstar]

It was reported last week on the Fan 590 morning show by the hosts and then Seravalli. Starting to believe he does not want to be in Toronto because he feels he gets most of the blame for their playoff failures. If he and Matthews were not so unlikeable, maybe the fans cut them some slack. Not breaking them up in the playoffs showed me the tail is wagging the dog and he needs to go.

Marner built his own bed with his last contract negotiation...holding the Leafs hostage for a massive overpayment by Dumbass, and then goes invisible in the playoffs...and being a local kid too...the media and fans really turned on Marner after that...as unlikable as Matthews is, he didn't make a big deal out of his contract negotiations.

 

[thewave]

Mentally EP is even softer than Marner.

I am not so sure. I am not a big fan of his but I am open to getting good player and there may be something there for Willy.