Player Discussion Mitch Marner, Part 3758391849

[Gabriel426]

Here is what Rantanen did in game #7.



Here is what Rantanen did in pressure games #5-7 ... 5 goals 6 assists for 11 points in 3 games.

View attachment 1029169

Rantanen signed for 8 years at $12 mil per AAV.

Any Leaf fan on the planet still happy an Unwanted Mitch Marner blocked this trade with this NMC?

But if he is on the Leafs, he won’t be able to score 3 goals and an assist in Game 7 since the Leafs only played 6 games,

 

[nsleaf]

Any player should demand as much as they can get. Hometown discounts are a myth.

 

[The Shadow]

Marner against the Panthers

 

[francis246]

Update: 10 points in his last 3 games, including 3 today, to put Dallas up 3-2 against Colorado in Game 7.

Marner's PR team is going to have a tough time spinning this into an argument for Marner being better.

Anyone who think Marner is a better playoff performer than Rantanen ain’t thinking straight. Love Marner but it’s not even close.

I said it in this thread and the around the league thread since the Rantanen stuff happened. Colorado is dumb for getting rid of Rantanen. This series almost guarantees the leafs will do everything they can to sign Marner. You can get all the depth you want, it will never beat star power. Now, Marner has to prove that he can really elevate in the playoffs. But I think the Colorado experiment goes to show that star talent rules in the NHL and over relying on depth talent will not lead to wins. Devil you know is better than the ones you don’t.

 

[tuckerintensity]

I think he stays but we’ll see.
They’ll be some that won’t be happy at any number he signs.

Hey man, only an idiot would think this. Everyone in this thread is pulling for this team and there's no possible way that anyone here is rooting against him or any other Leaf. We'd never do that, it's a fallacy... no matter what you read in this thread.

 

[francis246]

He has done himself zero favors with the fans. His team has been atrocious. He picks fights with the media.

if he refused to get traded then leaves he will be JT x 10.

why not even exchange numbers. Home town. Wife is from here. Wife having a baby. All the supports are here, endorsements, his foundations (cough tax shelter).

Why not talk negotiations. Makes no sense.

I wouldn’t consider it the same as JT. Not even close. Marner didn’t lead the fans on and say he has no interest in leaving. All he said was he’s focused on this season. JT literally told the fans he’s not going anywhere. Also JT’s relationship was the islanders fans was not as volatile as Marner’s with the leafs.

Leafs fans perplex me, you have half the fanbase that want him gone or think he’s overrated and then you’re wondering why he’s not negotiating? Players aren’t stupid, they hear the noise, they have family members who read stuff, they have phones, they also read stuff, they are still human at the end of the day. Forget about everything else and think about it from a human level perspective. Seeing all the shit on socials, are you going to be quick to negotiate to stay here? Absolutely not. Whether we like it or not, it’s his contractual right to take up to June 30th to negotiate. I’m not sure why anyone would seriously consider returning to a place where you’re not necessarily wanted.

Right or wrong, what Brad did at the deadline with Carolina probably added to the feelings of not being wanted. Prior to that happening I feel like there was maybe a small chance Marner engages in contract conversation, can’t see it happening after that until after playoffs now.

 

[Legion34]

I wouldn’t consider it the same as JT. Not even close. Marner didn’t lead the fans on and say he has no interest in leaving. All he said was he’s focused on this season. JT literally told the fans he’s not going anywhere. Also JT’s relationship was the islanders fans was not as volatile as Marner’s with the leafs.

Leafs fans perplex me, you have half the fanbase that want him gone or think he’s overrated and then you’re wondering why he’s not negotiating? Players aren’t stupid, they hear the noise, they have family members who read stuff, they have phones, they also read stuff, they are still human at the end of the day. Forget about everything else and think about it from a human level perspective. Seeing all the shit on socials, are you going to be quick to negotiate to stay here? Absolutely not. Whether we like it or not, it’s his contractual right to take up to June 30th to negotiate. I’m not sure why anyone would seriously consider returning to a place where you’re not necessarily wanted.

Right or wrong, what Brad did at the deadline with Carolina probably added to the feelings of not being wanted. Prior to that happening I feel like there was maybe a small chance Marner engages in contract conversation, can’t see it happening after that until after playoffs now.

I discarded with all of this.

1.) Marner has made it clear he would not entertain any trades. He knows everything he needs to know about the market. What’s one more year going to tell you
2.) he knows whether he wants to go or stay.
But refused to talk contract. By all measures the team has Made numerous overtures to him and he refused to exchange any numbers
3.) the team not knowing if he wants to stay asked him if he wants to leave let us know and we will move you.
He refused, and still wouldn’t engage in any contract talks. Bennet has. Hall re signed. This isn’t a Ferris thing. It’s a Marner thing.

Imagine living with someone for 8 years. You have a rough patch, and the person says “I’m not moving out, I’m not breaking up, I refuse to talk about the relationship, I will let you know on July 1 if I want to get married.” Would you stay in it for a year with zero idea what the person wants?”

Blaming the leafs for asking him what he wants after like 8 months of zero talks makes no sense

 

[tuckerintensity]

The OMGzzz look at what Rantanen did in Game 7 is next level hilarious. Like it's very bad that we were up 3-0 and didn't need the full series to move on. Like this place wouldn't be burned to the ground if Mitch had one, count 'em, one single assist in the four games. Hell, if we needed Game 7 and Mitch had four points the narrative would be he's not good enough, we should've beat them quicker.

On top of that, Colorado refused to sign this guy, traded him so they could win in the playoffs with better depth... and then got beat by the very guy they thought wasn't good enough to pay. Worked out really well for them.

The majority of people in this thread not only want to see Marner fail, they also love to see literally anyone else play well. They actively root for these things because they don't care about winning as much as being right. They don't want the Leafs to win with these guys, they want to be right. And if they don't, when it takes too long to win after any sort of rebuild/retool, they'll do the same to the next group.

It'll touch a few nerves with people, but it's a tale as old as time with Leafs Nation and the trolls that pretend to be part of it, but it's true... supposed fans actively root for the outcome that proves their stance, not the Leafs.

 

[Hellcat]

Do you really think 'boosters' is an insult?

I would say it's a compliment, whereas 'haters' is not.

Your use of the word childish was intended to be a compliment?

 

[Hellcat]

9:00 mins mark, this is great.... I love it. I've said this many times, Marner isnt too small to play physical. Despite Marner only fans repeatedly saying hes not built for it.

The problem, as I've stated 100's of times, is Marner doesnt WANT to do it and he rarely does. Lets examine:

Vs Sens Marner had more hits in one game than the first 3 combined. Hmm contract year, pressure mounting and he turns it on? Hmm contract year?

Two postseasons before that? ALOT of 0's in hits.

What happens next year? Back to no physical Marner?

Other most physical game ? Two playoffs ago, the elimination game vs Florida. Hmm that was the offseason he could be traded. Interesting.

Boston last year? Nope... no physicality, not even the elimination games. Hmm he had his NMC and couldn't be moved.

Vs Sens
View attachment 1028977

Vs Boston
View attachment 1028978

Vs Tampa and Florida
View attachment 1028979

Why do you continually want Marner to be someone who he is not? Nylander, Matthews, JT are not known as physical players, yet you give them a pass. Dude you've been beating this nonsensical drum for what a year and have yet to make a congruent point. At a certain point dont you just have to admit you don't have a point and move on?

 

[Da Mash]

Concerning Marner

He loves it here and honoured his contract. He deserved the NMC in contract and Tre gave out the same NMC to Nylander and Mathews.

He was never going to waive. Never as he mentioned. Fans complained and thought they could “force” him but that’s not reality.

Hopefully he resigns here but if he doesn’t then it’s his right and I will wish him the best as he has been a great leaf while here.

 

[Nineteen67]

17% of 12 million dollars is over 2 million dollars. how much property tax do you think he is paying?

It’s not the same bar. It has never been the same bar.

NY, California TOR always end up paying higher prices. It’s just not the same.
It never has been.

The Leafs have to pay a tax to get players to live there, but this 17% difference is not their problem. Considering Rantanen is a much more effective player Marner’s salary should be starting lower and work the tax cost and not start higher and go from there.
Also, you have to consider that Marner is fine living in Ontario and all added benefits.

 

[francis246]

I discarded with all of this.

1.) Marner has made it clear he would not entertain any trades. He knows everything he needs to know about the market. What’s one more year going to tell you
2.) he knows whether he wants to go or stay.
But refused to talk contract. By all measures the team has Made numerous overtures to him and he refused to exchange any numbers
3.) the team not knowing if he wants to stay asked him if he wants to leave let us know and we will move you.
He refused, and still wouldn’t engage in any contract talks. Bennet has. Hall re signed. This isn’t a Ferris thing. It’s a Marner thing.

Imagine living with someone for 8 years. You have a rough patch, and the person says “I’m not moving out, I’m not breaking up, I refuse to talk about the relationship, I will let you know on July 1 if I want to get married.” Would you stay in it for a year with zero idea what the person wants?”

Blaming the leafs for asking him what he wants after like 8 months of zero talks makes no sense

I said it probably didn’t help the situation. Also Marner negotiated the NMC in good faith. The organization gave it to him. So anyone mad that he didn’t waive can screw off. Don’t give players a tool and then get mad that they used it. So the leafs have no one but themselves to blame for Marner not waiving.

And no, the world isn’t black or white. Marner can actually be unsure of what he wants. He still has two months to decide. Additionally there’s new factors in his life, does he want to raise a child here? People just automatically assume that’s what both he and his wife want. Maybe it’s not what they want or they are still figuring it out. Either way this situation is not like JT at all and I don’t even think Marner would get a lot of hate for leaving. It would be the opposite, people would be happy. So not sure what you’re going on about.

 

[Confucius]

Rantanen with the hat trick (and 4 point game) to eliminate the Avs

11 points in his last 3 games. Colorado messed up.

Marner blocked this trade for us.

He must be on cloud nine, and the Avs mgmt must be in turmoil. Good for him

 

[Confucius]

Not true. He doesn’t have to pay state income tax which averages about 4.5 %, but tgey have other taxes in Texas as well as federal taxes.
Not even worth considering

ETA: States and Provinces with high tax rates obviously have many public benefits that non income tax states have, so that has to be worth something.

Selling your home in Ontario tax free on any capital gain, in Marners case that’s probably at least a 5 million dollar home that will at least double in value over 8 years. So there is that

 

[IPS]

The OMGzzz look at what Rantanen did in Game 7 is next level hilarious. Like it's very bad that we were up 3-0 and didn't need the full series to move on. Like this place wouldn't be burned to the ground if Mitch had one, count 'em, one single assist in the four games. Hell, if we needed Game 7 and Mitch had four points the narrative would be he's not good enough, we should've beat them quicker.

On top of that, Colorado refused to sign this guy, traded him so they could win in the playoffs with better depth... and then got beat by the very guy they thought wasn't good enough to pay. Worked out really well for them.

The majority of people in this thread not only want to see Marner fail, they also love to see literally anyone else play well. They actively root for these things because they don't care about winning as much as being right. They don't want the Leafs to win with these guys, they want to be right. And if they don't, when it takes too long to win after any sort of rebuild/retool, they'll do the same to the next group.

It'll touch a few nerves with people, but it's a tale as old as time with Leafs Nation and the trolls that pretend to be part of it, but it's true... supposed fans actively root for the outcome that proves their stance, not the Leafs.

What is un-fan-like about cheering for comparable players to your star player so you can get said star player at a better price to help the team more?

 

[IPS]

Sure, but it didn't help the Leafs, so who cares?

Sure it did. It's showing that Mitch's demands are way out to f***ing lunch when you see a direct comparable doing shit in the postseason he's not capable of.

I'll cheer for anything that drives that number down and helps the Leafs get a better deal.

 

[francis246]

What is un-fan-like about cheering for comparable players to your star player so you can get said star player at a better price to help the team more?

We’re talking about a cost savings of about $500,000 to a million give or take. Not even enough for a true depth player. Nothing significant, it’s not going to be a 3 million difference between them.

Saving that small amount of $ isn’t going to be the difference between the leafs winning and not winning.

 

[Leaf Fans]

Sure it did. It's showing that Mitch's demands are way out to f***ing lunch when you see a direct comparable doing shit in the postseason he's not capable of.

I'll cheer for anything that drives that number down and helps the Leafs get a better deal.

We only have speculation of what Mitch's demands are and people thought it was unreasonable regardless.

 

[IPS]

We’re talking about a cost savings of about $500,000 to a million give or take. Not even enough for a true depth player. Nothing significant, it’s not going to be a 3 million difference between them.

Saving that small amount of $ isn’t going to be the difference between the leafs winning and not winning.

Absolutely not.

500K can be the difference between having enough cap space to sign a big ticket free agent or settling down for a discount bin scrub.

 

[Legion34]

I said it probably didn’t help the situation. Also Marner negotiated the NMC in good faith. The organization gave it to him. So anyone mad that he didn’t waive can screw off. Don’t give players a tool and then get mad that they used it. So the leafs have no one but themselves to blame for Marner not waiving.

And no, the world isn’t black or white. Marner can actually be unsure of what he wants. He still has two months to decide. Additionally there’s new factors in his life, does he want to raise a child here? People just automatically assume that’s what both he and his wife want. Maybe it’s not what they want or they are still figuring it out. Either way this situation is not like JT at all and I don’t even think Marner would get a lot of hate for leaving. It would be the opposite, people would be happy. So not sure what you’re going on about.

???? This is not different at all. The islanders chose not to trade JT. He may or may not have said he wanted to stay, but he could not in any way refuse all trades.

He also may have had no idea what he wanted.

Marner was approached about trades and refused. That’s not at all the same.

 

[francis246]

We only have speculation of what Mitch's demands are and people thought it was unreasonable regardless.

Anyone who has bought in to those rage-bait reports is out to lunch. That is the intent of those insiders reporting those numbers. To enrage the fanbase and get more clicks and conversations.

Chris Johnston already said Marner doesn’t want to be the highest paid leaf, so his number will be in between Matthews and Nylander. Probably 12.5 to 12.75. I don’t think we are seeing Marner above 13.

 

[Legion34]

Sure it did. It's showing that Mitch's demands are way out to f***ing lunch when you see a direct comparable doing shit in the postseason he's not capable of.

I'll cheer for anything that drives that number down and helps the Leafs get a better deal.

Marner apparent has made zero demands so we don’t know

 

[IPS]

Marner apparent has made zero demands so we don’t know

Dreger and co. were very accurate during the last negotiation with the bits they put out so I'm just assuming they're accurate again.

 

[francis246]

Absolutely not.

500K can be the difference between having enough cap space to sign a big ticket free agent or settling down for a discount bin scrub.

Lol, if a free agent wants to be here and the leafs are 500,000 short, that UFA will sign here. They aren’t going to let $500,000 stop them from being a leaf.

Just like Rantanen turned down more money from Carolina to be a Dallas Star and JT turned down more money from both New York and San Jose to be a leaf.

Additionally, how about the Leafs take some ownership and start drafting well so they aren’t relying on UFA to build their team. Look at Washington, Carolina, Dallas, a ton of home grown talent from different rounds in the draft.