Player Discussion Mitch Marner, Part 3758391849

[Zybalto]

If Marner makes it to UFA you can bet Cooper will try and get Tampa to make a strong push for him, he's a huge fan.

They are so top heavy already, I'm not sure they could make it work. Multiple big names would have to go out of the 9 players with movement clauses.

 

[arso40]

That line is a mess and it has nothing to do with Marner. He has a center who is inexplicably taking 25 second shifts over and over again. He has a left winger who dumps the puck in about 95% of the time he has control of it in center ice (could somebody tell Knies that he can actually carry the puck into the zone). Marner looks frustrated and he should be.

So switch him off the line then

 

[Hellcat]

They are so top heavy already, I'm not sure they could make it work. Multiple big names would have to go out of the 9 players with movement clauses.

Their GM is pretty cut throat, if any one could find a way to cut salary, it's him.

 

[francis246]

Their GM is pretty cut throat, if any one could find a way to cut salary, it's him.

yup, didn't they tell McDonough waive or you will be waived or something like that a couple years ago? They did eventually bring him back lol

 

[Zybalto]

You really took this one around the block.

Deployment is important, zone percentages arn't very useful here though.

38 to 36, or 25 to 22 is the difference that was in question - offensive opportunity.

I'm sure it was an honest misstep, but saying Nylander had 86% OZ starts and Marner had 50% OZ starts to support 'I hope he would produce with that kind of usage' is Fox News level misleading, so the additional clarity is important imo.

...but I would hope he produces with that kind of usage. Its why hes getting paid the big bucks and he produced in the series. He's an 11.5 million dollar offensive weapon.

Marner on the other hand is a two way weapon who ranks as one of the best defensive wingers in the playoffs over the last half decade. The issue with Marner has been the offensive output in big games right?

Theres nothing wrong with what I said.

Are we done talking past each other or is this just more "foxnews"?

 

[sunstersun]

You talk about he is supposed to be playing like a player trying to earn a new contract? 8 points in 6 playoff games (109 point pace) is kinda good, no? 102 point regular season, is kinda good, no? Not sure how you can infer he is not playing at an elite level?

I get that some people have a dislike on for Mitch and have many coping mechanisms to deny what they see but selective Mitch blindness is a new one.

I've already posted like 3 advanced stats that show Marner was a good 5-6 mil ish player, yet the boomer scouts obsessed with HR, batting % are literally killing the team evaluation.

Do you understand box score doesn't mean much today? We already had a box score series from Marner against Tampa Bay, so you want to be reminded about how badly that translated to Florida?

 

[arso40]

Cant be using his linemates as a negative when I’m sure he wouldn’t look as good with linemates that weren’t doing all the grunt work my issue with Mitch is he needs to shoot more for years it’s been the same thing Hes become way too predictable

 

[francis246]

I've already posted like 3 advanced stats that show Marner was a good 5-6 mil ish player, yet the boomer scouts obsessed with HR, batting % are literally killing the team evaluation.

Do you understand box score doesn't mean much today? We already had a box score series from Marner against Tampa Bay, so you want to be reminded about how badly that translated to Florida?

I remember Nylander and Marner being the only core 4 members to score goals against Florida. I remember that veryyyyy clearly! Marner's was a 5v5 goal in a win as well. So even better for those keeping score.

 

[ACC1224]

You talk about he is supposed to be playing like a player trying to earn a new contract? 8 points in 6 playoff games (109 point pace) is kinda good, no? 102 point regular season, is kinda good, no? Not sure how you can infer he is not playing at an elite level?

I get that some people have a dislike on for Mitch and have many coping mechanisms to deny what they see but selective Mitch blindness is a new one.

No other 'fan'base would go so far out of their way to diminish the play of one of the 'favourite' teams top players after a playoff series win. It's so bizarre.
Really starting to pity them all, really quite sad.

 

[sunstersun]

I remember Nylander and Marner being the only core 4 members to score goals against Florida. I remember that veryyyyy clearly! Marner's was a 5v5 goal in a win as well. So even better for those keeping score.

Yeah, and Nylander being a beast, Marner being a limp wet noodle in that series.

You're not helping your case by continually citing box score stats mate. Show me some advanced stats or eye tests please.

 

[sunstersun]

No other 'fan'base would go so far out of their way to diminish the play of one of the 'favourite' teams top players after a playoff series win. It's so bizarre.
Really starting to pity them all, really quite sad.

His play is doing the diminishing, we're just calling it like it is. Sorry the advanced stat diminish Marner.

If you want, we could stop posting it, so it's easier for you to ignore.

We're also not every other fanbase. We're terminally ill in the postseason so the fans are naturally going to be more skeptic. We've seen this rodeo before. If we get past Florida and Marner plays well. I'll sing his anthem.

 

[ACC1224]

They are so top heavy already, I'm not sure they could make it work. Multiple big names would have to go out of the 9 players with movement clauses.

I'm not sure of their situation, I don't doubt they would figure it out if it came to it.

 

[Gary Nylund]

He is one of those people, certified!

You claim he said so, either you can show where he said it, or you can't.

 

[DarkKnight]

Most of the haters have zero points in life,
If we're keeping it real.

A fine series, some ups and downs, but did enough good things criticism is unwarranted imo.

 

[Gary Nylund]

His play is doing the diminishing, we're just calling it like it is. Sorry the advanced stat diminish Marner.

Calling it like it is seems to melt snowflakes like crazy, after all these years it's comical.

If you want, we could stop posting it, so it's easier for you to ignore.

We're also not every other fanbase. We're terminally ill in the postseason so the fans are naturally going to be more skeptic. We've seen this rodeo before. If we get past Florida and Marner plays well. I'll sing his anthem.

If he plays well, I'll sing his praises and if he doesn't, I refuse to paint that lipstick on a pig. Same goes for every player and I see no reason to make an exception for anyone, not even Marner. And if Marner plays well, I'll be more than happy to say so even if we don't get past Florida. GLG!!

 

[ACC1224]

Most of the haters have zero points in life,
If we're keeping it real.

A fine series, some ups and downs, but did enough good things criticism is unwarranted imo.

Wonder when the parade will be held to celebrate him not being nominated for the Selke?

 

[francis246]

Yeah, and Nylander being a beast, Marner being a limp wet noodle in that series.

You're not helping your case by continually citing box score stats mate.

as with anything in life, you need a balance. Post up expected stats and using those as the be all and end all isn't great.

Yes advanced stats help give insight to the teams play and their potential outcome, but teams are not awarded cups based on their expected goals. Raw numbers and box score stats also matter, thats truly what wins cups. Coaches weigh the balance of the two all the time, how many people were questioning Berube's choice to play Pacioretty? I'm sure advanced stats probably showed taking Pacioretty out was the right decision. BUT, a coach with experience uses gut feel and other factors not on spread sheets to make decisions.

you can rattle off marners advanced stats but the truth is hes still produced over ppg. diminishing the points is childish. I think many people have valid arguments against bringing him back at a large cap hit, but others just hate to hate. enjoy the series win my friend.

 

[sunstersun]

Ya don't pay 13 mil for good defence, solid pk. You pay it for game breaking offence.

It's a great step for Marner. Coming off last series, you'd wish he generated more offence in games 4 5 and 6.

 

[sunstersun]

as with anything in life, you need a balance. Post up expected stats and using those as the be all and end all isn't great.

Yes advanced stats help give insight to the teams play and their potential outcome, but teams are not awarded cups based on their expected goals. Raw numbers and box score stats also matter, thats truly what wins cups. Coaches weigh the balance of the two all the time, how many people were questioning Berube's choice to play Pacioretty? I'm sure advanced stats probably showed taking Pacioretty out was the right decision. BUT, a coach with experience uses gut feel and other factors not on spread sheets to make decisions.

you can rattle off marners advanced stats but the truth is hes still produced over ppg. diminishing the points is childish. I think many people have valid arguments against bringing him back at a large cap hit, but others just hate to hate. enjoy the series win my friend.

I'm not using advanced stats alone. People have pointed out many assists marner had this series were QB PP assists. Like the one to Tavares or yesterday passing to Matthews point D to point D. Not all points are the same.

Just like I'm much more impressed with Willy beating the goalie straight up versus a tip in goal.

 

[DarkKnight]

Lis

Wonder when the parade will be held to celebrate him not being nominated for the Selke?

Listened to the American broadcasts all series, couldn't get a local feed here. Was interesting all the gushing for him from different broadcasts. Hopefully some here can email them with their incredible hockey acumen and help them understand.

 

[sunstersun]

 

[francis246]

Calling it like it is seems to melt snowflakes like crazy, after all these years it's comical.

If he plays well, I'll sing his praises and if he doesn't, I refuse to paint that lipstick on a pig. Same goes for every player and I see no reason to make an exception for anyone, not even Marner. And if Marner plays well, I'll be more than happy to say so even if we don't get past Florida. GLG!!

amen brother, I think the most true thing for marner to focus on is that, if he produces all the noise goes away

 

[Antropovsky]

Guarantee the season hold up was term, Marner wants 3-4 years, so he can cash in one more time and be like Matthews and uncle Marleau. The hold up was term last time too. He found out nobody was gonna give him the short term deal Matthews got. So he signed Torontos offer.

Him being greedy is luck for us... because ownership and Tree apparently needed this reminder on how bad he is in playoffs.

This guy needs to take a hike.

 

[sunstersun]

Guarantee the season hold up was term, Marner wants 3-4 years, so he can cash in one more time and be like Matthews and uncle Marleau. The hold up was term last time too. He found out nobody was gonna give him the short term deal Matthews got. So he signed Torontos offer.

Him being greedy is luck for us... because ownership and Tree apparently needed this reminder on how bad he is in playoffs.

This guy needs to take a hike.

Naw, he wants that 8 year deal. Main reason I think he'll re-sign with the Leafs if we want to go that route.

 

[ACC1224]

amen brother, I think the most true thing for marner to focus on is that, if he produces all the noise goes away

You'd think but here we are.