Player Discussion Mitch Marner, Part 3758391849

[SoupNazi]

Resume.

And don’t troll each other or your may never get to type the word “Marner” again. My good friend Big Louie may come break your fingers.

Fair warning.

 

[thewave]

Suspended my criticism until after round 1. Good regular season as far as points go. Not 12m+ level play but let's see how it goes.

I take it back if he is awful in the playoffs the beatings will continue until morale improves.

 

[Hellcat]

Suspended my criticism until after round 1. Good regular season as far as points go. Not 12m+ level play but let's see how it goes.

I take it back if he is awful in the playoffs the beatings will continue until morale improves.

This assessment is based on what criteria?

 

[tuckerintensity]

@Aashir Marner shouldn’t be near draisaitl in AAV nor cap %. Marner should be very close to pastrnak as he isn’t the better player, so 13.47% or 12.5 on a 92.5 million dollar deal. That’s his ceiling IMO and anything more is a clear overpayment similar to nylander, and matthews.

The cap is set to be 95.5. If Pastrnak was 13.47%, I didn't look it up but I assume you are correct, and you think Marner should get that contract, it's 12.9 million per year. Which is currently more McDavid. Which, you know, proves exactly what I had said in my previous comment in the closed Marner thread. AAV ain't it anymore, Leon will be passed by a lot of guys in the near future in AAV even if he remains second highest in percent of cap (which he won't, at least one other will pass him and likely more over the life of the contract).

 

[ULF_55]

How about we have a swap.

Rielly moves to forward and marner moves to defense.

marner can't win the Rocket, maybe he joins the Makar, Hughes smaller defenders ranks and goes for the Norris?

He said he likes it back there.

 

[Superstar]

The cap is set to be 95.5. If Pastrnak was 13.47%, I didn't look it up but I assume you are correct, and you think Marner should get that contract, it's 12.9 million per year. Which is currently more McDavid. Which, you know, proves exactly what I had said in my previous comment in the closed Marner thread. AAV ain't it anymore, Leon will be passed by a lot of guys in the near future in AAV even if he remains second highest in percent of cap (which he won't, at least one other will pass him and likely more over the life of the contract).

These arguments are flawed...shouldn't a cap increase also benefit the team, giving the team more room and flexibility to sign other players? Why should the player get the full percentage benefit of a cap increase? It should be somewhere in between. Seems like the only players ripping off their team are the Leaf players.

 

[Commander Clueless]

How about we have a swap.

Rielly moves to forward and marner moves to defense.

marner can't win the Rocket, maybe he joins the Makar, Hughes smaller defenders ranks and goes for the Norris?

He said he likes it back there.

Let Marner walk and sign a $13M defender instead.

Named Mitch Marner.

 

[thewave]

This assessment is based on what criteria?

Marner is not as good as Rantanen period. Not even close as far as body of work goes and playoff success.

I am glad you are so worried about Marner making more money though. Lol. You know it's more telling than you think.

 

[Dekes For Days]

shouldn't a cap increase also benefit the team, giving the team more room and flexibility to sign other players? Why should the player get the full percentage benefit of a cap increase? It should be somewhere in between.

A cap increase does benefit both player and team. The player only gets a small percentage of the cap and increase.

 

[Zybalto]

Marner is not as good as Rantanen period. Not even close as far as body of work goes and playoff success.

I am glad you are so worried about Marner making more money though. Lol. You know it's more telling than you think.

Im fine with ignoring defensive play on this and you certainly have a point on body of work but Rantanen away from MacKinnon is worse Marner and in the playoffs, its even more glaring.

The Avs took a gamble that Rantanen was replaceable and they look more or less correct as Rantanen absolutely blew his Canes audition and has been merely "OK" with the Stars so far. Away from MacKinnon overall, Rantanen is, at best, a 5 million dollar player. This is not a good look. The fancy stats say Rantanen is better than he has produced but if I had to choose between the 2, its Marner all the way right now. Rantanen seems a huge gamble but lets see how both do in the playoffs.

That Stars/Avs series going to be must watch for the storyline.

 

[ToneDog]

Im fine with ignoring defensive play on this and you certainly have a point on body of work but Rantanen away from MacKinnon is worse Marner and in the playoffs, its even more glaring.

The Avs took a gamble that Rantanen was replaceable and they look more or less correct as Rantanen absolutely blew his Canes audition and has been merely "OK" with the Stars so far. Away from MacKinnon overall, Rantanen is, at best, a 5 million dollar player. This is not a good look. The fancy stats say Rantanen is better than he has produced but if I had to choose between the 2, its Marner all the way right now. Rantanen seems a huge gamble but lets see how both do in the playoffs.

That Stars/Avs series going to be must watch for the storyline.

Ranta vs MacKinnon might be the best series of the playoffs. I'd ignore his stint in Carolina. He is looking better in Dallas who have the best forward depth in the NHL IMO. Too bad Hieskanen is out for the first round.

 

[Antropovsky]

How about we have a swap.

Rielly moves to forward and marner moves to defense.

marner can't win the Rocket, maybe he joins the Makar, Hughes smaller defenders ranks and goes for the Norris?

He said he likes it back there.

Come on.. this guy can barely take a hit and is afraid of dirty areas. Defense take the most punishment.

Playing defense on a PP is not even close to playing D 5v5.

 

[Zybalto]

Ranta vs MacKinnon might be the best series of the playoffs. I'd ignore his 12 games in Carolina. He is looking better in Dallas who have the best forward depth in the NHL IMO. Too bad Hieskanen is out for the first round.

View attachment 1013050

Yea, for all the struggles, he ended up in the right place for him. Crazy forward depth and low taxes to get the best bang for his 12 million.

Still only 2 5v5 goals in 31 games since the trade from the Avs is whats setting off the alarms though.

 

[Antropovsky]

Ranta vs MacKinnon might be the best series of the playoffs. I'd ignore his 12 games in Carolina. He is looking better in Dallas who have the best forward depth in the NHL IMO. Too bad Hieskanen is out for the first round.

View attachment 1013050

Its early but I wonder if Dallas value him as much as a 25 goal, point per game player, rather than a 40-50 goal 105 point player he was in Colorado?

Its early, but it is interesting to see that since leaving Mackinnon, Rantanen is on a 22 goal 60 point pace in 31 games. His stats with Carolina (a less skilled lineup) being considerably worse than Dallas or Colorado.

Looks like Tulsky was onto something when he indicated linemates matter the most.

Of course it could be that he just needs to settle in. But there are many players who dont skip a beat after being traded.

 

[ToneDog]

Its early but I wonder if Dallas value him as much as a 25 goal, point per game player, rather than a 40-50 goal 105 point player he was in Colorado?

Its early, but it is interesting to see that since leaving Mackinnon, Rantanen is on a 22 goal 60 point pace in 31 games. His stats with Carolina (a less skilled lineup) being considerably worse than Dallas or Colorado.

Looks like Tulsky was onto something when he indicated linemates matter the most.

Of course it could be that he just needs to settle in. But there are many players who dont skip a beat after being traded.

One week to go before final exams start. Leafs have the easier path to round #2. I just can't see a soft, small, weak and scared winger being able to make it through the grind of 2 rounds let alone 3 or 4. Give me the playoff proven 6'4" goal scorer every day of the week. IMO this Leafs team could do serious damage in the playoffs if they replace Marner with Ranta or Pasta. I think Tre knows this as well and why he was willing to trade Marner for Ranta.

I wonder what Marner and his BFF are thinking having to potentially face a Tkachuk in each of the first two rounds.

 

[Craig Button]

Marner is not as good as Rantanen period. Not even close as far as body of work goes and playoff success.

I am glad you are so worried about Marner making more money though. Lol. You know it's more telling than you think.

List all the teams they played against in the playoffs please

 

[IPS]

Yea, for all the struggles, he ended up in the right place for him. Crazy forward depth and low taxes to get the best bang for his 12 million.

Still only 2 5v5 goals in 31 games since the trade from the Avs is whats setting off the alarms though.

He's certainly been fighting it since leaving Colorado but I'm pretty sure he'll bounce back next year.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Im fine with ignoring defensive play on this and you certainly have a point on body of work but Rantanen away from MacKinnon is worse Marner and in the playoffs, its even more glaring.

The Avs took a gamble that Rantanen was replaceable and they look more or less correct as Rantanen absolutely blew his Canes audition and has been merely "OK" with the Stars so far. Away from MacKinnon overall, Rantanen is, at best, a 5 million dollar player. This is not a good look. The fancy stats say Rantanen is better than he has produced but if I had to choose between the 2, its Marner all the way right now. Rantanen seems a huge gamble but lets see how both do in the playoffs.

That Stars/Avs series going to be must watch for the storyline.

Hmm, yeah I don't know about that.

 

[therealkoho]

These arguments are flawed...shouldn't a cap increase also benefit the team, giving the team more room and flexibility to sign other players? Why should the player get the full percentage benefit of a cap increase? It should be somewhere in between. Seems like the only players ripping off their team are the Leaf players.

because I've heard a lot of players say it "they're just trying to feed their families" or something like it!

 

[Zybalto]

Hmm, yeah I don't know about that.

Rantanen isnt great defensively and isnt much of a line driver.

With the right guys hes absolutely lethal though, one of the best scoring wingers in the league. Dallas has so many forward options, probably just have to set him up with the right guys and he'll come through.

As it stands though, he's been overall pretty rough away from Mac, both on the Avs and off.

 

[Maple Leaf]

I was here in this historic thread

 

[Darcy Tucker]

Now at 99 points again.

 

[Superstar]

A cap increase does benefit both player and team. The player only gets a small percentage of the cap and increase.

You'd think that's the case, but based on some of these arguments, it doesn't seem to be...ie. cap is up to $95.5 mil...Marner should get x% of the cap, therefore, he should be paid $13 mil, etc...which is ridiculous...he should be around where Rantanen got paid, that's probably his closest comparable...which is $12 mil....all this talk about him wanting $14 mil is crazy on his part...he's not negotiating in good faith, he knows the cap is up, and wants to take a huge chunk off it and get paid more than he's worth...I don't think any team is paying him $14 mil in the open market this summer.

 

[BraveCanadian]

Now at 99 points again.

Hoping he finally gets there, we haven’t had many. From memory Sittler, Gilmour, and Matthews are it so far.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Rantanen isnt great defensively and isnt much of a line driver.

With the right guys hes absolutely lethal though, one of the best scoring wingers in the league. Dallas has so many forward options, probably just have to set him up with the right guys and he'll come through.

As it stands though, he's been overall pretty rough away from Mac, both on the Avs and off.

Yeah whatever, saying he's worth 5 million tops is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay off.