Mitch Marner discussion

[Zybalto]

Keefe on Marner:

“Of anybody on our team on forward, he’s the guy that does it all for us,” Keefe said. “Both sides of special teams, power play, penalty kill, five on five, key defensive situations, playmaking ability, energy, positivity on the bench and in the room.
“He’s a big loss for us. We’ve been a little out of sorts since losing him. Our team is sort of adjusting to life without Mitch, but it’s been a difficult transition because he does so much for our team.”

Simmonds on Marner:

“Mitch is an unbelievable offensive player, but I think he’s extremely underrated defensively,” Simmonds said. “The things that he brings to our team, whether it be penalty killing, or his anticipation, playing without the puck on the defensive side of it, I think he’s one of the best in the league at that.”

 

[ACC1224]

Keefe on Marner:

“Of anybody on our team on forward, he’s the guy that does it all for us,” Keefe said. “Both sides of special teams, power play, penalty kill, five on five, key defensive situations, playmaking ability, energy, positivity on the bench and in the room.
“He’s a big loss for us. We’ve been a little out of sorts since losing him. Our team is sort of adjusting to life without Mitch, but it’s been a difficult transition because he does so much for our team.”

Simmonds on Marner:

“Mitch is an unbelievable offensive player, but I think he’s extremely underrated defensively,” Simmonds said. “The things that he brings to our team, whether it be penalty killing, or his anticipation, playing without the puck on the defensive side of it, I think he’s one of the best in the league at that.”

That's how you appreciate a player.

Thanks for attempting to get the thread back on track.

 

[PromisedLand]

What's Mitch's status? is he recovering well? No news on him anywhere

 

[francis246]

You may want to wait to see what the team does in the playoffs.

i personally don’t care tbh. Whether they win or lose, I know where I’ll be. Back on my couch watching them the next season. That’s sports in a nutshell

 

[Notsince67]

 

[francis246]

It was a rhetorical question - I figured based on the conversation that someone on my ignore list had said it, that's why IIRC I mentioned my ignore list in my post.



Too easy. I didn't have to think about this for more than about 2 seconds which probably means we'd have to make a better offer than that.



That's true. It's also true that everyone wants to win the cup so whenever the discussion turns to what kind of a cap hit a player is worth from a fans point of view, playoff performance is obviously a huge part of the discussion. Players don't get paid for the playoffs because if they did, nobody would be willing to play for bad teams that are sure to miss the playoffs. The owners care about making money but for fans of the game, everyone knows that playoffs are what really matters.

I've heard so many players say that they grew up dreaming of winning the Stanley cup. I've yet to hear anyone say that they grew up dreaming of winning the presidents trophy and I'm pretty sure I never will.

Exactly, I agree with your entire post. It sucks because players really want to win. It’s not their fault they play in an era where contracts are steadily increasing. I get that fans also want a championship. But it’s becoming more clear how valuable Marner is and really the team is going to break through, it’s going to happen. It’s just sad that all the hate will stop once they win one round. Not even the Stanley cup. Just goes to show the Marner hate is unnecessary

 

[francis246]

It was a rhetorical question - I figured based on the conversation that someone on my ignore list had said it, that's why IIRC I mentioned my ignore list in my post.



Too easy. I didn't have to think about this for more than about 2 seconds which probably means we'd have to make a better offer than that.



That's true. It's also true that everyone wants to win the cup so whenever the discussion turns to what kind of a cap hit a player is worth from a fans point of view, playoff performance is obviously a huge part of the discussion. Players don't get paid for the playoffs because if they did, nobody would be willing to play for bad teams that are sure to miss the playoffs. The owners care about making money but for fans of the game, everyone knows that playoffs are what really matters.

I've heard so many players say that they grew up dreaming of winning the Stanley cup. I've yet to hear anyone say that they grew up dreaming of winning the presidents trophy and I'm pretty sure I never will.

Exactly, I agree with your entire post. It sucks because players really want to win. It’s not their fault they play in an era where contracts are steadily increasing. I get that fans also want a championship. But it’s becoming more clear how valuable Marner is and really the team is going to break through, it’s going to happen. It’s just sad that all the hate will stop once they win one round. Not even the Stanley cup. Just goes to show the Marner hate is unnecessary

 

[Gary Nylund]

IIRC that interview was from a few years ago. Wasn't he also voted the smartest player when he was playing junior hockey, perhaps we should dig that up as well?

Marner is a really smart player, no doubt about it but when the talk of how smart Marner is begins, I can't help but remember that more recently (and also paradoxically), he was the player that took the dumbest penalty in Maple Leafs history at a crucial time in the last playoffs. Hopefully that was a once in a lifetime brain fart, it never happens again (at least not in the playoffs) and he shows the world how smart a hockey player he is in the next playoffs.

We saw in November how good this team can play and our big 4 are all a big part of that, now they need to show they can win in the playoffs when the going gets tougher. I believe Marner can be a playoff superstar but if he wants to do it with this core, he better do it soon because there's only so many consecutive 1st round losses that any management group can stomach before making changes and I'm afraid we're treading very close to that breaking point.

 

[Menzinger]

Knowing the team can play well without him is great, but what's even better is going to be watching them destroy other teams when he's back

 

[Gary Nylund]

Knowing the team can play well without him is great, but what's even better is going to be watching them destroy other teams when he's back

It'll be 1000 times better if they start destroying teams in the playoffs and not just for a game here and there, they need to put together enough games to win one series to start with. And let's not pretend that this team with Marner is perfect either, there were some bad habits creeping into our game before Marner got hurt and the early season games are the easiest to win anyway. Later in the season the games get tighter, scoring goes down across the league as teams get ready to play playoff hockey (which is very different from the hockey played in November) and of course the real test is when the playoffs actually start, that's when as the saying goes, we separate the men from the boys.

 

[Willchel Marlynder]

Seeing the way Matthews is playing with Bunting and Kase I honestly think it might be cool to try Marner on the third line. If Marner can make our third line look anything like Matthews is doing with the first line we are a legit three line team. Or you could swap Mik and Nylander as JT had shown he can get it done with players like Kerfoot and Mik and Nylander-Marner has the potential to be really good.

Obviously none of that will happen, but would be interesting to see how it played out.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Seeing the way Matthews is playing with Bunting and Kase I honestly think it might be cool to try Marner on the third line. If Marner can make our third line look anything like Matthews is doing with the first line we are a legit three line team. Or you could swap Mik and Nylander as JT had shown he can get it done with players like Kerfoot and Mik and Nylander-Marner has the potential to be really good.

Obviously none of that will happen, but would be interesting to see how it played out.

I like that idea a lot because why not? The season is for the most part an 82 game warmup for the playoffs so why not try different things? That's why I'd even like to try Matthews and JT together and have Marner play with Nylander - those guys are all so good they should be great no matter how they're played and the more different looks you can give opponents, the harder you are to prepare for.

Get used to playing in all kinds of different situations, that way we can keep coming at teams in different ways in the playoffs. I remember the legendary Scotty Bowman using over 100 different line combos in the playoffs, if your players are good enough I see no reason that approach can't be effective once again.

And what better way to give Mitch a chance to shine then to give him a chance to show what he can do driving a line without elite talent by his side? Mitch fans should love it, I know because I'm one of them and I love it!

 

[studebaker17]

Seeing the way Matthews is playing with Bunting and Kase I honestly think it might be cool to try Marner on the third line. If Marner can make our third line look anything like Matthews is doing with the first line we are a legit three line team. Or you could swap Mik and Nylander as JT had shown he can get it done with players like Kerfoot and Mik and Nylander-Marner has the potential to be really good.

Obviously none of that will happen, but would be interesting to see how it played out.

Pretty tough having enough mins for 3 lines to play like that even if you don't play the 4th line at all hardly . That isn't fair to our 4th line who have been great or to the other 3 lines either . Was a big reason Kadri wasn't realizing his potential when we stuck him on the 3rd line .

 

[Niagara Bill]

Rick Nash cap adj salary 11.3MM x 5
Thomas Vanek cap adj salary 11.6mm x 7
Ilya Kovalchuk cap adj salary 13.4MM x 5

They were also mistakes. Not one lived up to the value.

Certainly Marner appears to have a better chance but, with this cap and paying Reilly, AM, WN, JT the burden on the team is onerous.

 

[ACC1224]

Yeah the constant weeping about the playoffs has become so tiresome. It's December, playoffs aren't for a few months.

 

[Menzinger]

It'll be 1000 times better if they start destroying teams in the playoffs and not just for a game here and there, they need to put together enough games to win one series to start with. And let's not pretend that this team with Marner is perfect either, there were some bad habits creeping into our game before Marner got hurt and the early season games are the easiest to win anyway. Later in the season the games get tighter, scoring goes down across the league as teams get ready to play playoff hockey (which is very different from the hockey played in November) and of course the real test is when the playoffs actually start, that's when as the saying goes, we separate the men from the boys.

I don't think anyone here is claiming the team is perfect with Marner. And while yes what will matter is this team doing well in the playoffs, I don't think its fair to dismiss regular season play as meaningless. Teams that do well in the playoffs tend to be among the top teams in the season. A couple flukes aside, teams don't just start playing like contenders in April, they've been building toward that level of play all season.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Yeah the constant weeping about the playoffs has become so tiresome. It's December, playoffs aren't for a few months.
EMO's have invaded this place.

Coming from you that's pretty funny considering you're crying more than everyone else put together. And you've been here long enough to know better - these has never been one "appreciation" thread ever where there hasn't been at least some talk about a players negative points so if it upsets you so much, do something else with your time for crissakes.

Despite our ups and downs we're 5th overall, Rielly is killing it and despite not having Mitchy on his wing Matthews is still lighting it up. Marner will back before you know it, life as a Leaf fan is good at the moment, why not be happy?

 

[Gary Nylund]

I don't think anyone here is claiming the team is perfect with Marner. And while yes what will matter is this team doing well in the playoffs, I don't think its fair to dismiss regular season play as meaningless. Teams that do well in the playoffs tend to be among the top teams in the season. A couple flukes aside, teams don't just start playing like contenders in April, they've been building toward that level of play all season.

Every game has some meaning, I think we can all agree on that. That being said, IIRC I've seen analysis showing that a better indicator of how a team is likely to do in the playoffs is how they are playing in the last month or so before the playoffs start, November games not so much. It makes sense too since the games tighten up late in the season and look more like playoff hockey.

We're tied for 5th overall, that is right around where we've been in the standings for a number of years now. Maybe this is the year we finally play up to our potential in the playoffs and maybe it isn't but the fact that we're 5th overall as of today isn't really much of an indicator either way unless I'm missing something.

 

[Notsince67]

Yeah the constant weeping about the playoffs has become so tiresome. It's December, playoffs aren't for a few months.
EMO's have invaded this place.

 

[Gary Nylund]

I don't think anyone here is claiming the team is perfect with Marner. And while yes what will matter is this team doing well in the playoffs, I don't think its fair to dismiss regular season play as meaningless. Teams that do well in the playoffs tend to be among the top teams in the season. A couple flukes aside, teams don't just start playing like contenders in April, they've been building toward that level of play all season.

Edit - have a look at our schedule over the last month or so. That will be a much tougher test and how we fare during that time will be a much better indicator of how we might do in the playoffs. Though no matter what happens during the regular season you still never know, hard to forget how massive favourite TB got swept in the 1st round a few years ago (if us getting dummied by MTL isn't enough of a reminder that is).

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

The PP might be hot without him but the PK has been awful since he went down. 70% efficiency since he was injured, that number would have us third last in the NHL overall.

 

[ACC1224]

The PP might be hot without him but the PK has been awful since he went down. 70% efficiency since he was injured, that number would have us third last in the NHL overall.

IMO, the PP would be running pretty much the same if he was there.
What would he have done to prevent last nights goal?

 

[ShaneFalco]

Please go watch agent provocateur on SDPN. That will literally shut 90% of this fan base up. It’s all the agent. The players do not get involved in negotiation, except for minor details NTC, structure of the contract (bonuses vs base salaey). Agents bring them the number, players usually says yes or no. Most of the time it’s a yes. The players input usually comes when it’s time to pick a location. Otherwise they leave the numbers to their agent.

Never once have you heard a number figure come out of Marners mouth. Yet people continue to blame him for most likely saying yes to an offer that the LEAFS GAVE HIM. Anyone that says they would say no, when the team is offering you 10.93 million is actually bold face lying.

at the end of the day, regardless of what you think. All players are paid based on regular season performance and their future potential. No one is really paid for playoffs and they never have been. It’s a dumb narrative that this fanbase has made up because they don’t like the contract. Well too bad. He’s here and he’s here to stay.

The players may not get involved normally, but this was all over the media with Dreger being a shill. He wanted Matthews money, threats about offer sheets, playing overseas etc. You'd have to be living under a rock to be oblivious to it. He let it happen.
As for the playoffs, make 11 mill and not produce - you're going to hear about it.
Make 11 mill and not have a single pp goal in over a year.....
He may or may not be here to stay if they keep losing and he looks like a boy playing against men in the playoffs

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

IMO, the PP would be running pretty much the same if he was there.
What would he have done to prevent last nights goal?

Forgive me if I misinterpret it you mean our PP goal that Matthews scored? I doubt Mitch would’ve interfered. I agree that the PP would still be good with him here, the fact that it’s been hot with him injured (50% efficiency I believe since his injury) is more of a fluke than an indictment on his abilities. I suppose one could argue that the PK is a fluke too, but to me it's far more likely to see a huge jump in PP percentage over a small stretch than it would be to see a large drop in PK numbers.

 

[ACC1224]

Forgive me if I misinterpret it you mean our PP goal that Matthews scored? I doubt Mitch would’ve interfered. I agree that the PP would still be good with him here, the fact that it’s been hot with him injured (50% efficiency I believe since his injury) is more of a fluke than an indictment on his abilities. I suppose one could argue that the PK is a fluke too, but to me it's far more likely to see a huge jump in PP percentage over a small stretch than it would be to see a large drop in PK numbers.

Yes the Matthews PP goal.
Agree with everything you've said here.