Player Discussion Mitch Marner, Continued

[thewave]

Doubt that even gets the conversation started. At minimum with would be equal to Willy.

Matching Nylander is the only logical choice. If he wants more the NMC does not exist.

And I would take it or leave it to him. If not see ya.

 

[HolyCrap]

It applied to AM, Willie, JT and even Reilly.

The difference is that, those four mentioned didn't have a group of diehard fans or security to defend them, thus the discussions didn't last long.

Bingo. This is the exact reason I can’t stand marnersites. Same way I despised the dubasites.

 

[Roo]

Matching Nylander is the only logical choice. If he wants more the NMC does not exist.

And I would take it or leave it to him. If not see ya.

I think the number starts with a 12. Not because I disagree with you, but because he is getting resigned one year later, and the argument would be giving him the $11.5M + the % cap increase. Which I think is reasonable as all salaries will be tied to the cap.

 

[ACC1224]

It applied to AM, Willie, JT and even Reilly.

The difference is that, those four mentioned didn't have a group of diehard fans or security to defend them, thus the discussions didn't last long.

They all have fans, the big difference is the comments made about those players aren’t as idiotic. People don’t defend the player as much as they oppose the idiocy.

 

[Smif]

Well there was the talk JT took less to play for his team. I’d be betting Mitch is just as big a fan. 11 and he can name the length of the deal.

11 is his current deal. I'm thinking 11.93.

 

[Confucius]

Doubt that even gets the conversation started. At minimum with would be equal to Willy.

Just to flip the narrative. You think he walks away from home for 500 grand a year? Not a chance, when he has already made 75 million and would make 75 million more on his next deal. He will be the hero and take less. I’ve said it before, as of today even Mitch doesn’t know just how low he would go. We’ve all been there before when after the fact we’ve said “ I can’t believe I sold that for so much below what I wanted.

 

[thewave]

I think the number starts with a 12. Not because I disagree with you, but because he is getting resigned one year later, and the argument would be giving him the $11.5M + the % cap increase. Which I think is reasonable as all salaries will be tied to the cap.

I would counter with his production did not meet the 10.9m to begin with and William got more because he performed far better than his low first contract and similarly how his contract was inflated to offset sched b bonuses, this time was Williams turn.

 

[Confucius]

I would counter with his production did not meet the 10.9m to begin with and William got more because he performed far better than his low first contract and similarly how his contract was inflated to offset sched b bonuses, this time was Williams turn.

Yep, no time like the present to start the narrative, outperform your contract and we will catch up. Similar to several longtime players getting more than they really deserve as a retirement deal

 

[ULF_55]

Hayes: ‘Marner for whatever reason, looks better when he’s not playing with Matthews’ - Video - TSN

Bryan Hayes, Jeff O’Neill and Jamie McLennan discuss the Maple Leafs 3 straight wins without Auston Matthews and why Mitch Marner seems to play better without his longtime linemate.

www.tsn.ca

... This aligns with my thougths.

 

[Confucius]

Hayes: ‘Marner for whatever reason, looks better when he’s not playing with Matthews’ - Video - TSN

Bryan Hayes, Jeff O’Neill and Jamie McLennan discuss the Maple Leafs 3 straight wins without Auston Matthews and why Mitch Marner seems to play better without his longtime linemate.

www.tsn.ca

... This aligns with my thougths.

My feeling as well, not only is Marner better without Mathews, Mathews is better without Marner. Many times after a game I’ve thought Mathews played like Laine, just float around try and shake the coverage and wait for a pass from Mitch. Meanwhile Mitch skates around waiting for Mathews to be open. I totally agree with split them up and play a more rounded game.

 

[Gabriel426]

They all have fans, the big difference is the comments made about those players aren’t as idiotic. People don’t defend the player as much as they oppose the idiocy.

Honestly, some of the comments on any of the Core 5 are idiotic, but only MM fans or his non fans make it so much worse.

For example, there is the MM is a better defensive player than Barkov bc he once finished top 3 in Selke voting while Barkov actually won the Selke TWICE.

On the other hand, there are comments like MM needs AM or JT to bump up his stats.

Then there is the whole Assists is as important as Goals, which is complete non sense.

I really don't understand why MM fans need to praise MM like he is the top Hockey player ever. I mentioned this either on this thread or another thread, that MM is great but people need to understand that he is not a top 20 players(Fowards, Dmen and Goalies) in the league but he is certainly top 25 and thats really great.

MM along with the rest of the Leafs had won NOTHING as a Leafs. Like absolutely NOTHING. And if they play on any other team and experienced the past 8 years like they did with the Leafs, all of us will be laughing at them and calling them chokers. Wishing their MGT continues to bet on them bc it is fun watching them melt down then come out with we need a bounce, was good lessons, we are like God....

 

[Gabriel426]

My feeling as well, not only is Marner better without Mathews, Mathews is better without Marner. Many times after a game I’ve thought Mathews played like Laine, just float around try and shake the coverage and wait for a pass from Mitch. Meanwhile Mitch skates around waiting for Mathews to be open. I totally agree with split them up and play a more rounded game.

Its been like that since AM won his Hart. I made a comment back then saying AM floats and wait for MM to pass him the puck, while MM doesn't think about anything but give AM the puck.

It is very predictable. Ofcourse, most commented that I am stupid and pointed out that AM was having a historical season.....

Been saying it awhile, split AM, MM and Willie into three lines and which ever lines is playing well that night, they get more ice time. Their personal stats might suffer but having three lines that can play will be a nightmare for opposing playoffs team.

 

[Roo]

I would counter with his production did not meet the 10.9m to begin with and William got more because he performed far better than his low first contract and similarly how his contract was inflated to offset sched b bonuses, this time was Williams turn.

The deals that were signed in the past are now meaningless. All that matters is what is happening now. But the reason why Nylander signed for less is because he was a 60pt player when his ELC expired, vs Marner who was a 90pt player. Leafs got a benefit merely based on timing.

 

[Confucius]

The deals that were signed in the past are now meaningless. All that matters is what is happening now. But the reason why Nylander signed for less is because he was a 60pt player when his ELC expired, vs Marner who was a 90pt player. Leafs got a benefit merely based on timing.

I believe another factor is William really didn’t have roots here. I doubt he was a Leaf fan as a kid. He certainly didn’t grow up here, his family doesn’t live here. It’s time we took advantage of the situation, much like the sunny tax free places in the States.

 

[arso40]

I believe another factor is William really didn’t have roots here. I doubt he was a Leaf fan as a kid. He certainly didn’t grow up here, his family doesn’t live here. It’s time we took advantage of the situation, much like the sunny tax free places in the States.

He’s been here since 18 and his dad and brother lived here so there’s that

 

[ULF_55]

The deals that were signed in the past are now meaningless. All that matters is what is happening now. But the reason why Nylander signed for less is because he was a 60pt player when his ELC expired, vs Marner who was a 90pt player. Leafs got a benefit merely based on timing.

While you would like to believe that, I don't think that is 100%.

As UFA they can go anywhere, so other than 8th. year team doesn't have much leverage.

If they feel they've been short-changed (NHL reality), they could take a hard line knowing they can cash in as a free agent everywhere else in the NHL.

Probably doesn't hurt if the GM has been previously burnt by a walkaway UFA (RIP).

 

[Nineteen67]

Its been like that since AM won his Hart. I made a comment back then saying AM floats and wait for MM to pass him the puck, while MM doesn't think about anything but give AM the puck.

It is very predictable. Ofcourse, most commented that I am stupid and pointed out that AM was having a historical season.....

Been saying it awhile, split AM, MM and Willie into three lines and which ever lines is playing well that night, they get more ice time. Their personal stats might suffer but having three lines that can play will be a nightmare for opposing playoffs team.

Matthews and Nylander would love to win but to date they haven’t shown the willingness or ability to do what it takes to win. I’m not convinced winning is their number 1 priority. Marner would also love to win but to date he hasn’t shown he’s physically capable of winning, especially with the other two taking up so much cap space.

 

[arso40]

Matthews and Nylander would love to win but to date they haven’t shown the willingness or ability to do what it takes to win. I’m not convinced winning is their number 1 priority. Marner would also love to win but to date he hasn’t shown he’s physically capable of winning, especially with the other two taking up so much cap space.

What?

 

[ULF_55]

Matthews and Nylander would love to win but to date they haven’t shown the willingness or ability to do what it takes to win. I’m not convinced winning is their number 1 priority. Marner would also love to win but to date he hasn’t shown he’s physically capable of winning, especially with the other two taking up so much cap space.

EDIT: Sorry. I thought you were serious there. I get it now. Great joke post.

You realize until this year Nylander was taking 50% less Cap space than marner?

So there has been no playoffs where Nylander's Cap space was an impact.

 

[thewave]

I believe another factor is William really didn’t have roots here. I doubt he was a Leaf fan as a kid. He certainly didn’t grow up here, his family doesn’t live here. It’s time we took advantage of the situation, much like the sunny tax free places in the States.

If we are being honest with ourselves and look around the league. We really can't find comparables for MM and WN at 11m+. They are darn good players and would fetch big money but not this kind of money if drafted in the US.

They also make more for advertising here as well on top and the Leafs never leverage that. It's strange.

Like stupid business sense in Toronto

 

[Nineteen67]

EDIT: Sorry. I thought you were serious there. I get it now. Great joke post.

You realize until this year Nylander was taking 50% less Cap space than marner?

So there has been no playoffs where Nylander's Cap space was an impact.

No joke. And he’s not taking that now. We’ve seen him in the playoffs and he hasn’t earned 11.5 and at 6.9 he wouldn’t ven try to win a battle in a game 7.

 

[Nineteen67]

What?

Simple. Matthews and Nylander haven’t shown they are winners. Nor have they shown that winning is their top priority.

 

[arso40]

No joke. And he’s not taking that now. We’ve seen him in the playoffs and he hasn’t earned 11.5 and at 6.9 he wouldn’t ven try to win a battle in a game 7.

You realize he’s been on 6.9 up until this year right ?

Simple. Matthews and Nylander haven’t shown they are winners. Nor have they shown that winning is their top priority.

Why do you think their both like that and Marner isn’t ?

 

[rojac]

11 is his current deal. I'm thinking 11.93.

I'm pretty sure most agents would argue that Marner's current deal is 13.38% of the cap for the first year of the deal (10.903M out of 81.5M) and that anything less than 12.377M (13.38% of next year's probable cap of 92.5M) is effectively a pay cut.

 

[Nineteen67]

You realize he’s been on 6.9 up until this year right ?


Why do you think they’re both like that and Marner isn’t ?

I do. I observed his play.

Maybe he doesn’t, but Marner won a Mem Cup and I’m thinking on a good team with good players he might do better.

Maybe the other two would do more playing with better players but I don’t think that’s a priority.