Player Discussion Mitch Marner, Again

[DarkKnight]

Marner camp apparently not wanting to negotiate until after the season is an interesting development. If Marner has a poor playoff, that gives the Leafs a much bigger out to not re-sign him.

Marner be playing with fire.

Sorry, what’s the source of that?

 

[notDatsyuk]

Just FYI

Marner leads the league or is tied for primary assists currently I believe. *EDIT* correction he’s second behind Nathan MacKinnon

William Nylander has 4 empty net goals this year and Marner has 2!

And yet Mitch spends a lot more time on the ice with the other goalie pulled.

 

[francis246]

The only way Leafs do not resign him is if he flames out in the playoffs and the fans put enough pressure on the team to force them to move on. Even then, there is no guarantee they do not stay the course.

It could signal the return of Waffles. LOL.

lol the fans will be zero factor in whether marner stays or goes. that's an organizational decision. which im not even 100% convinced they'd be in favour of not resigning him if they lose. I think it's probably more likely marner just walks compared to the leafs walking away. it feels like the organization is somewhat afraid of walking away.

 

[Tie Domi Esquire]

Gretzky is a far right lunatic. I wouldn’t listen to a word he say

Hmm... not really. But he's talking about hockey anyways.

 

[ToneDog]

lol the fans will be zero factor in whether marner stays or goes. that's an organizational decision. which im not even 100% convinced they'd be in favour of not resigning him if they lose. I think it's probably more likely marner just walks compared to the leafs walking away. it feels like the organization is somewhat afraid of walking away.

Don't be so sure. Just ask Larry Murphy, Jake Gardiner and Ron Wilson.

 

[Gary Nylund]

to each their own. I understand what you're saying but I don't think it's that deep. do you honestly believe zach hyman is upset cause he made the finals with the oilers instead of the leafs? i'm sure he probably thinks about what it would be like if he did it with the leafs, but would it cause unhappiness? meh not so sure of that.

How "deep" it is or isn't depends on the person so there is no way for any of us to know. It's not nothing though, it's maybe something minor for Marner, or maybe it's something that'll just break his heart, it's all speculation.

I know if it was me, it would hurt. I've dreamed about the Leafs winning a cup for over 50 years and I can only imagine what a thrill it would be to be a key player on the team that finally makes that dream come true for millions of fans. Guys like Gilmour and Clark are heroes forever in this town for doing nothing more than winning two rounds and that's nothing compared to the level of adulation that would be heaped on this group if they somehow get it done.

 

[supermann_98]

If the Leafs are dumb enough to re-sign him to what he wants prior to the playoffs, where he annually no-shows once the going gets tough, my hope is that they're at least smart enough to give him limited (like 10 team) NMC protection.

We can't let that next contract handcuff the team like it is now. God knows how the previous GM not only overpaid him but also included full NMC, not to mention the massive July 1st pay arrangement

 

[francis246]

Don't be so sure. Just ask Larry Murphy, Jake Gardiner and Ron Wilson.

Jake Gardiner was already a pending UFA and had back issues. Yeah the fans didn’t like him towards the end but there was like 5 other legitimate reasons not to resign him lol

 

[ToneDog]

Jake Gardiner was already a pending UFA and had back issues. Yeah the fans didn’t like him towards the end but there was like 5 other legitimate reasons not to resign him lol

Go ask Cliff Fletcher why he brought Wendel back.

 

[BraveCanadian]

Marner camp apparently not wanting to negotiate until after the season is an interesting development. If Marner has a poor playoff, that gives the Leafs a much bigger out to not re-sign him.

Marner be playing with fire.

lol Marner holds all the cards.. with the season he’s having he’s going to get top dollar from the Leafs or from someone else. There is no doubt about that.

The takes here are so disconnected from reality it is amazing. It is not a difficult decision to keep your best all around and most consistent player.

People demanding change can just cool their jets a bit until JT’s ridiculous salary gets chopped down or outright removed.

If Marner walks the Leafs will be immediately a worse team no matter which two or three cheaper players they supposedly replace him with.. and before something starts blabbing about Rantenan, 99% chance Carolina signs him or they wouldn’t have done that deal.

 

[Dekes For Days]

From the group of people who don’t like the core 4, or even are more neutral (I believe you are too), I think unanimously everyone agrees Montreal should’ve been the end of this core 4.

No team purges their 23 year old superstars because they didn't win a playoff series yet. And even putting aside all of the other context of that series, no team is going to decide against their "core 4" strategy because they lost a playoff series where they didn't have their core 4. That group of people would have been the first to complain and blame our GM for his impatience and shortsightedness when those players went on to win cups for other teams, while we fell back into mediocrity.

 

[ToneDog]

lol Marner holds all the cards.. with the season he’s having he’s going to get top dollar from the Leafs or from someone else. There is no doubt about that.

The takes here are so disconnected from reality it is amazing. It is not a difficult decision to keep your best all around and most consistent player.

People demanding change can just cool their jets a bit until JT’s ridiculous salary gets chopped down or outright removed.

If Marner walks the Leafs will be immediately a worse team no matter which two or three cheaper players they supposedly replace him with.. and before something starts blabbing about Rantenan, 99% chance Carolina signs him or they wouldn’t have done that deal.

What changes are you going to make when you need $11+m in raises for McCabe, Woll, Knies and Marner? Hopefully they can find a few nickels and dimes for Lorenz after they pay everybody.

 

[Racer88]

No team purges their 23 year old superstars because they didn't win a playoff series yet. And even putting aside all of the other context of that series, no team is going to decide against their "core 4" strategy because they lost a playoff series where they didn't have their core 4. That group of people would have been the first to complain and blame our GM for his impatience and shortsightedness when those players went on to win cups for other teams, while we fell back into mediocrity.

How long are you prepared to wait for this core to show improvement of results better then first round losses and 1 first round win.
What is your patience level

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

I feel like if you took Marner off the team and replaced him with me they would still make the playoffs.

That's how good the team is. And this isn't exclusive to Marner either. The same could be said about any of the rest of the core.

So walking away from Marner should be an easy choice.

He's easily the most polarizing player on the team. Just listen to the things he still saying in media after all these years. This is despite all that training in public speaking.

If that's what he says on public record what do you think he says off the record?

He just comes across as a spoiled little rich kid. Someone with an inability to accept responsibility for his failures. There's a list of excuses that would encircle my gut for this superstar who can't do anything super.

Getting rid of him would be the first necessary step towards changing the losing culture permeating throughout this organization

 

[thewave]

How long are you prepared to wait for this core to show improvement of results better then first round losses and 1 first round win.
What is your patience level

We have some posters here since the ACC opened that have been preaching hope and patience and that we are so close for over 20 years.

Elephantile patience. Squirrel memory. Goose like resolve

 

[Hallonbroder]

The only thing proven Colorado has done is they know they can win the cup with Rantanen playing for them . Trading him is an experiment to fill depth is just an experiment at this point that may very well regress them now and the future . I get you don't want the inmates running the asylum but it may also negate your chances of actually winning not finding common ground .

They won with him at his current cap hit, not the ones he’s gonna have after this season, i e they could afford depth. It’s hilarious reading defenders of “the core” whining about not having better bottom six players than Holmberg, Dewar, Reeves etc and also not understanding that’s what they’re getting if they want Marner and friends to get top dollar

 

[ToneDog]

No forward plays along the blueline better than Marner. With Marner and two dmen playing high, that leaves two forwards to battle close to the net looking to redirect a Marner muffin. And some wonder why this team is goal scoring challenged this year. Hey Mitch, let the dmen handle the blueline and maybe try going to the dirty areas once in awhile. You know, like most forwards do.

 

[thewave]

No forward plays along the blueline better than Marner. With Marner and two dmen playing high, that leaves two forwards to battle close to the net looking to redirect a Marner muffin. And some wonder why this team is goal scoring challenged this year. Hey Mitch, let the dmen handle the blueline and maybe try going to the dirty areas once in awhile. You know, like most forwards do.

The only creative thing the Leafs have right now is it's fans making excuses for the most expensive forward core in league history.

 

[ToneDog]

I feel like if you took Marner off the team and replaced him with me they would still make the playoffs.

That's how good the team is. And this isn't exclusive to Marner either. The same could be said about any of the rest of the core.

So walking away from Marner should be an easy choice.

He's easily the most polarizing player on the team. Just listen to the things he still saying in media after all these years. This is despite all that training in public speaking.

If that's what he says on public record what do you think he says off the record?

He just comes across as a spoiled little rich kid. Someone with an inability to accept responsibility for his failures. There's a list of excuses that would encircle my gut for this superstar who can't do anything super.

Getting rid of him would be the first necessary step towards changing the losing culture permeating throughout this organization

May as well fold the franchise if you let Mitch walk.

The only creative thing the Leafs have right now is it's fans making excuses for the most expensive forward core in league history.

Rinse and repeat.

 

[Sypher04]

The only creative thing the Leafs have right now is it's fans making excuses for the most expensive forward core in league history.

Well you just the other day erroneously categorized me simply explaining where I think marner will land in cap percentage (between Matthews and Nylander) as excuse making, so you would think that.

When you see everything as excuse making even when it very clearly isn’t then is your opinion in this case really worth anything?

 

[thewave]

Well you erroneously categorized me simply explaining where I think marner will land in cap percentage (between Matthews and Nylander) as excuse making, so you would think that but it’s still untrue.

I would give him 12-12.5m x 8 but no NMC. If I had to eat 1.5m x 8 years to get a great return I would.

 

[Sypher04]

I would give him 12-12.5m x 8 but no NMC. If I had to eat 1.5m x 8 years to get a great return I would.

Not sure what that has to do with what I wrote, but while I think most people here would agree that’d be a good result, there is no scenario in which Marner agrees to an extension here without a NMC. Garaunteed no chance.

 

[thewave]

Not sure what that has to do with what I wrote, but while I think most people here would agree that’d be a good result, there is no scenario in which Marner agrees to an extension here without a NMC. Garaunteed no chance.

13.1% is 12.5m
14.1% is 13.25m or so.

It's not happening for a perimeter winger that had not lead this team to any success.

 

[Sypher04]

13.1% is 12.5m
14.1% is 13.25m or so.

It's not happening for a perimeter winger that had not lead this team to any success.

What cap # are you using?
Also again, what does that have to do with whether he’d get a NMC?

Garaunteed he gets a full NMC for the full duration of any contract extension

 

[thewave]

What cap # are you using?
Also again, what does that have to do with whether he’d get a NMC?

Garaunteed he gets a full NMC for the full duration of the contract.

94m I think was seen as possible.

I would match Nylanders 11.5m and hard line him like Rantanen was. 8th year is important. That is my realistic position on it. Anything more and he drops NMC years or can waive or hit FA and lose year 8

Pretty simple stuff