Minnesota Wild General Discussion XIX

[NHL1674]

The one thing that bothers me is the rumors how BG may be holding a grudge based on past negotiations. It keeps resurfacing in many articles.

We can't afford Fiala. We made that bed and have to lie in it. We knew the buyouts would mean sacrificing a talented player. But if Guerin isn't looking hard enough for any type of solution to keep him JUST based on a grudge, then that's a huge problem. I don't know if Fiala even wants to stay, but he appears to be liked in the room. So even if negotiations have been rough, it's not like he's going all Suter or Parise causing conflict among teammates. Meaning that BG needs to look past his own pettiness and put the team first. If you trade him, it better be for the right reasons after all other options have been considered.

 

[Wild11MN]

The one thing that bothers me is the rumors how BG may be holding a grudge based on past negotiations. It keeps resurfacing in many articles.

We can't afford Fiala. We made that bed and have to lie in it. We knew the buyouts would mean sacrificing a talented player. But if Guerin isn't looking hard enough for any type of solution to keep him JUST based on a grudge, then that's a huge problem. I don't know if Fiala even wants to stay, but he appears to be liked in the room. So even if negotiations have been rough, it's not like he's going all Suter or Parise causing conflict among teammates. Meaning that BG needs to look past his own pettiness and put the team first. If you trade him, it better be for the right reasons after all other options have been considered.

Do you have any examples? I don't think I've seen anything like that quoted.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

I think I like watching Fiala a tad more.

 

[TaLoN]

Do you have any examples? I don't think I've seen anything like that quoted.

I've seen fans talk about it, I don't remember reading about it in any articles though myself...

 

[NHL1674]

Do you have any examples? I don't think I've seen anything like that quoted.

I'm searching....kinda not the sharpest tool when remembering who wrote what.

 

[Obvious Fabertism]

Fiala (or tiniest chance someone else) will be traded for cap reasons, its just the way things worked out, you can only have so many high paid guys and the buyouts reduced the amount that we can have more than other teams. Everything else is just noise, you can't add another 7MM plus cap guy to this roster structure and expect to be able to field any kind of reasonable team over the next 3 years, you would have absolutely zero wiggle room throughout the season for even minor injuries or underperformance. He will be traded, likely to Ottawa or Anaheim in a futures heavy deal for what will likely be a pretty solid value return, but that return will likely not impact this roster for several years.

The other option is Dumba, who might be gone the following year anyway, but all indications are that the organization wants to keep Dumba around, I mean realistically the Wild have already given up Scandella, Tuch, Haula, and soon to be Fiala just to keep him. Sunk cost fallacy at play here, but it doesn't take a mind reader to see where the front office's heads are at, Fiala has spent his fair share of time in the dog house, as little as a earlier this season he was driving the coach mad. Fantastic player when he is on and I would love to keep him too, but you can't keep everyone and his value is highest now. Sell for a great price, get cap room and futures and don't get bogged down with his 30+ year old seasons when he starts losing a step.

This is still a good team with or without Fiala, though it sure is extra fun this year and I will enjoy every game that we do get with this group together.

 

[thestonedkoala]

Do you have any examples? I don't think I've seen anything like that quoted.

The biggest issue is that these are brought up on Russo's podcast or through some obscure means and it's hard to find them when you want to reference them. And Russo's podcast isn't necessarily the truth, but fans take it as the truth.

 

[Jesus comma Brodin]

Going into next year with two top-4 defensemen is a, uh... bold enough move that we can hardly rule it out.

I mean, to be fair, we've gone several seasons with 1 top 12 center, so hard to rule that out

 

[Bazeek]

I mean, to be fair, we've gone several seasons with 1 top 12 center, so hard to rule that out

My money's on trading both Fiala and Dumba to make room for more 2009 Penguins.

 

[Sota Popinski]

I don't think anything about what you think of trading him or Zuccarello or anyone. I just don't see the turnover argument everyone keeps making, as I outlined above, it's a wash between Turnover Heathen Kevin Fiala and Ultimate Two-Way Monster Mats Zuccarello.

You clearly do, because you replied to my post and brought up Zuccarello when he wasn't even part of the conversation. The majority of Wild fans seem to prefer trading Zucc before Fiala. But he has a modified no-trade, is less valuable to another team due to age, and has cost certainty. If Fiala wants $8M x 8y would you still take him and the return for Zucc, or Zucc for two years and the return for Fiala? The return on Fiala makes it a difficult choice.

 

[Minnewildsota]

Apparently, we're a frontrunner to sign Ben Meyers. If you believe this article:

Wild reportedly a frontrunner to sign Ben Meyers

The Gophers captain might be staying local.

www.hockeywilderness.com

 

[Wild11MN]

Apparently, we're a frontrunner to sign Ben Meyers. If you believe this article:

Wild reportedly a frontrunner to sign Ben Meyers

The Gophers captain might be staying local.

www.hockeywilderness.com

One of two finalists with Detroit is what the article says - apparently came from Friedman on a podcast.

 

[TaLoN]

Apparently, we're a frontrunner to sign Ben Meyers. If you believe this article:

Wild reportedly a frontrunner to sign Ben Meyers

The Gophers captain might be staying local.

www.hockeywilderness.com

Would be a good get!

 

[fredrikstad]

The Wild Aren't All-In Without Marco Rossi - Zone Coverage
Hasn't Rossi seven more games before the elc kick in? Why not recall him and see what he have now?

 

[Gurglesons]

I'm surprised to see you guys wanting to keep Dumba over Fiala.

Doesn't it make the most sense to save cash on RD and bump up Addison?

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

The Wild Aren't All-In Without Marco Rossi - Zone Coverage
Hasn't Rossi seven more games before the elc kick in? Why not recall him and see what he have now?

Because then his 2nd contract comes due before the bad parts of buyouts are over.

I'm surprised to see you guys wanting to keep Dumba over Fiala.

Doesn't it make the most sense to save cash on RD and bump up Addison?

Does not compute.

 

[Wabit]

The Wild Aren't All-In Without Marco Rossi - Zone Coverage
Hasn't Rossi seven more games before the elc kick in? Why not recall him and see what he have now?

A lot of that article reads like it was written by Rossi's mother.

Yes he has 7 more games before it burns a year of his ELC.

There is no reason to put him in the NHL lineup right now:
-The team is healthy and winning games.
-There is a greater chance he downgrades the lineup rather than upgrading it.
-The only possible fit for him in the healthy FWD group is Freddy G.'s 3C spot. Freddy G moves to 4C and Jost sits. All the other FWDs are better and/or better fits for their roles.
-future cap concerns.
-Injuries hit before the season ends and he can possibly be used then. Remember the last 7 games of the season come in an 11 day span. The whole month of April is packed with games.

 

[Wabit]

I'm surprised to see you guys wanting to keep Dumba over Fiala.

Doesn't it make the most sense to save cash on RD and bump up Addison?

If it's a choice between Dumba and Fiala. I keep Dumba without having to think too hard about it. To me it's a much bigger downgrade from Dumba to Addison than it is from Fiala to Rossi. A top pair RD is more important of a spot than a 3rd line wing. Fiala (likely) brings a better trade return.

I want both of them on the team. I think it's awful that it is probably going to come down to a choice between the 2 of them. The cap is what it is, and with how the roster is constructed (NMC's, dead cap, etc.) the room just isn't there.

 

[fredrikstad]

A lot of that article reads like it was written by Rossi's mother.

Yes he has 7 more games before it burns a year of his ELC.

There is no reason to put him in the NHL lineup right now:
-The team is healthy and winning games.
-There is a greater chance he downgrades the lineup rather than upgrading it.
-The only possible fit for him in the healthy FWD group is Freddy G.'s 3C spot. Freddy G moves to 4C and Jost sits. All the other FWDs are better and/or better fits for their roles.
-future cap concerns.
-Injuries hit before the season ends and he can possibly be used then. Remember the last 7 games of the season come in an 11 day span. The whole month of April is packed with games.

Thank you for this reply. Makes a ton of sense to me, the way you are explaining it.
"written by Rossis mother", when reading through the article one more time, I definitely agreed on that take.

 

[Nino Noderreiter]

Thank you for this reply. Makes a ton of sense to me, the way you are explaining it.
"written by Rossis mother", when reading through the article one more time, I definitely agreed on that take.

I would venture 70+% of fans here want to keep Fiala over Dumba.

 

[Spurgeon]

If it's a choice between Dumba and Fiala. I keep Dumba without having to think too hard about it. To me it's a much bigger downgrade from Dumba to Addison than it is from Fiala to Rossi. A top pair RD is more important of a spot than a 3rd line wing. Fiala (likely) brings a better trade return.

I want both of them on the team. I think it's awful that it is probably going to come down to a choice between the 2 of them. The cap is what it is, and with how the roster is constructed (NMC's, dead cap, etc.) the room just isn't there.

3rd line wings don’t produce at a PPG pace or have the 3rd most ice time among wingers.

 

[Jesus comma Brodin]

If it's a choice between Dumba and Fiala. I keep Dumba without having to think too hard about it. To me it's a much bigger downgrade from Dumba to Addison than it is from Fiala to Rossi. A top pair RD is more important of a spot than a 3rd line wing. Fiala (likely) brings a better trade return.

I want both of them on the team. I think it's awful that it is probably going to come down to a choice between the 2 of them. The cap is what it is, and with how the roster is constructed (NMC's, dead cap, etc.) the room just isn't there.

This is a MAJOR assumption/gamble, and I am failing to find any evidence that this may be the case. Rossi wasn't good in his 2 games here and absolutely nobody ever mentions the downgrade Boldy is going to take when we move a 70+ point player and replace him with a then 21YO rookie. Fiala is the reason Boldy is off to a decent start, but the drop-off from losing Kevin is going to be glaring, IMO.

Also, I am still waiting for someone to tell me what Dumba brings in terms of on-ice product that warrants his cap hit, meanwhile Kevin is playing with a 7th line C and a rookie winger and still on a 76 point pace.

 

[57special]

The Wild Aren't All-In Without Marco Rossi - Zone Coverage
Hasn't Rossi seven more games before the elc kick in? Why not recall him and see what he have now?

Because he probably isn't better than what they have, and if he is, then Guerin will be under pressure to keep him up, and burn a year, making trouble for the team down the line.
Rossi looks good in the AHL, but is by no means tearing it up. Oh, and he sucks on FO's.

I'm surprised to see you guys wanting to keep Dumba over Fiala.

Doesn't it make the most sense to save cash on RD and bump up Addison?

"You guys"...don't know where you are getting that from. The majority of fans would rather keep Fiala and Dumba, but if it comes right down to it, would rather keep Fiala, depending on what his contract demands are. If he wants over 7.5- 8M/yr then no thanks.
Addison is favored by most on here to be a #6/PP guy- you'll have to ask your guy, Guerin, about his thinking there.

 

[BagHead]

A lot of that article reads like it was written by Rossi's mother.

Yes he has 7 more games before it burns a year of his ELC.

There is no reason to put him in the NHL lineup right now:
-The team is healthy and winning games.
-There is a greater chance he downgrades the lineup rather than upgrading it.
-The only possible fit for him in the healthy FWD group is Freddy G.'s 3C spot. Freddy G moves to 4C and Jost sits. All the other FWDs are better and/or better fits for their roles.
-future cap concerns.
-Injuries hit before the season ends and he can possibly be used then. Remember the last 7 games of the season come in an 11 day span. The whole month of April is packed with games.

I've come to the conclusion, over the course of the season, that Tony Abbott is Rossi's #1 fan, and I say that as someone who has been a Rossi fan since before he was drafted by us.

Abbott has been wanting the Wild to be truly all-in this year, and I just don't agree with that approach, at least not for this year's team. Rossi is a really good player who is probably more skilled than a couple of our current centers, but having his ELC slide a year is a bigger deal than Abbott seems to realize. It sure would suck to have to trade off a portion of your roster in the final year of the cap crunch just because you decided that two months of Rossi was more important 3 years earlier.

Finally, Rossi's offense also has slowed down lately. I'm not sure if that's because he was playing behind Rask, or if it's because of the long season finally wearing him down, but if it's the latter he wouldn't be a good call-up for the NHL post-season anyway.

I'm all for him being a Black Ace, and coming in if there are injuries in the playoffs, but I wouldn't rush to get him games. Let it happen organically, if it has to happen at all.

 

[57special]

Fiala is 12th in scoring among LW's over the past three years. One behind Landeskog, and ahead of Forsberg, Ehlers, and Laine. He is quite clearly a #1 LW. He just happens to be overshadowed by another LW, who is probably the best player, and certainly the best forward, that MN has ever had.
Bottom line is that we will regret letting Fiala go. Players like him don't come along often. Guerin is making the mistake of thinking that he is replaceable.

I've come to the conclusion, over the course of the season, that Tony Abbott is Rossi's #1 fan, and I say that as someone who has been a Rossi fan since before he was drafted by us.

Abbott has been wanting the Wild to be truly all-in this year, and I just don't agree with that approach, at least not for this year's team. Rossi is a really good player who is probably more skilled than a couple of our current centers, but having his ELC slide a year is a bigger deal than Abbott seems to realize. It sure would suck to have to trade off a portion of your roster in the final year of the cap crunch just because you decided that two months of Rossi was more important 3 years earlier.

Finally, Rossi's offense also has slowed down lately. I'm not sure if that's because he was playing behind Rask, or if it's because of the long season finally wearing him down, but if it's the latter he wouldn't be a good call-up for the NHL post-season anyway.

I'm all for him being a Black Ace, and coming in if there are injuries in the playoffs, but I wouldn't rush to get him games. Let it happen organically, if it has to happen at all.

Rask has nothing to do with it, and was only a factor for a few games. I mean, if Rossi can't outshine Rask, that says it all, but it's not really the case.
Rossi looks like an above average AHL player....a first line AHL player, but by no means the best in the AHL. He has scored a lot of points, but is 36 th in total scoring. Players like Jack Quinn are outproducing him at a far greater rate. He also is below average in strength, even for the AHL. His skating is good, but straight line speed is slightly above average for the AHL. FO's are mediocre.
Rossi might do better with the puck on his stick than Gaudreau, but I wouldn't bet on it. Gaudreau is much faster, and can skate out of trouble, whole Rossi would get caught from behind. Rossi is significantly weaker than Gaudreau, a worse defensive player, and worse on the dot. Rossi has a better shot, but can he get to scoring areas in the NHL to use that shot, or will he get outmuscled and outquicked there, a la Teemu Pulkkinen?