Value of: Mikko Rantanen

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

Yeah, I agree that the Avs would be foolish to trade him…unless they can’t re-sign him, in which case they would have to decide at some point next summer/TDL whether to keep him for one last playoff run or to try to move him for something that would help extend their window. But that’s not a decision you make until this season is over and you’ve exhausted all attempts to negotiate a deal that works for both parties.

If you agree that they'd be foolish to trade him, then why do you have such a problem with the threshold to even consider moving him now being set at a low end 1C with affordable term, plus picks and prospects? Obviously, it's a steep ask and I'd be surprised if anyone was willing to pay the price, but it's literally the only thing that would even make the conversation worthwhile for the Avs. Otherwise, I'm sure they're happy to exhaust all attempts to negotiate a deal that works for both parties, which I don't expect to be a major issue. Who wouldn't want to stay in Colorado and play the next 7-8 years with Mack and Makar?

 

[admiralcadillac]

I think a deal involving Necas could be interesting. He’s younger than Rants and is an RFA this summer. He’s been inconsistent in Carolina but I think he’d absolutely thrive in Colorado’s system, him and Mack flying together would be a sight to see.

Like Necas and Aho?

 

[Gally999]

As you stated the only reason a team would trade for Mikko is if they are in win-now mode. The Avs are also in win-now mode so the only way I see this working would be to include a third team. Team A gets Mikko, Team B gets lots of futures and the Avs get a very good 2C from Team B + other piece(s).

Unlikely the Avs trade him though.

Exactly, that would be the only way it could work, but it's a real opportunity. If a team is in a total rebuild but have a great C, they can make a hard but clever decision to let him go to a contender and add a lot of assets/picks. Because, as you said, a contender won't let go a 2C but a team in rebuild don't need a guy in his prime like Rattanen.

 

[Brett44]

teams like Buffalo, New Jersey,Caroline or Ottawa that need to stop taking young guys and think about winning might be interested.

Ottawa --> Pinto+Batherson and 1st
New Jersey--> Meier and Mercer
Buffalo --> Cozens + Peterka
Caroline--> Necas + Morrow

 

[yeaher]

Rantanen is not getting traded, but if we entertain the thought of it happening, its on the same level as getting Makar or MacKinnon

No, it's not especially in Makar's case. There is a gap between McDavid and everybody else, but then it's Makar and another smaller gap between everyone else.

teams like Buffalo, New Jersey,Caroline or Ottawa that need to stop taking young guys and think about winning might be interested.

Ottawa --> Pinto+Batherson and 1st
New Jersey--> Meier and Mercer
Buffalo --> Cozens + Peterka
Caroline--> Necas + Morrow

Like that NJ one for 1-2 million retained

 

[Agent Zuuuub]

Brady Tkachuck for Rantanen

 

[gritdash60]

Brady Tkachuck for Rantanen

And how many picks? I would love Brady on my team, but Mikko is just one level better.

 

[WarriorOfGandhi]

I don’t know why biased, unattractive Avalanche fans refuse to face facts. Rantanen didn’t grow up an Avs fan, he wouldn’t sign for a full 8 years off his ELC, he wasn’t one of the first players to lift the Cup, and now he’s openly feuding with teammates.

He’s gone and Colorado will be lucky to get a better return than Tatar got.

 

[Lonewolfe2015]

No, it’s nowhere close to that as Rants is far less valuable than the other two. Makar plays a more valuable position, costs less, and is signed for three more years after this one. MacKinnon also plays a more valuable position and is signed long term; while his cap hit is too high to be considered a great value he at least lives up to it in the postseason unlike his similarly-priced peers. Either of those players would fetch a far greater price than Rantanen with only one more year left on his contract.

I've watched both players their entire careers. Anyone that thinks there's a big gap between MacK and Rants is out to lunch. Both have their flaws, both have their strengths. But they're both world-class players that can lead any offense on their own. Rants has shown he can slot into center. He's shown he's defensively adept. He's shown he had both a scoring touch and a playmaker's vision. His playoff scoring, while not as good as MacK, is better than most. Very few compare to MacK there.

This Avs fan would trade MacK 10/10 times before Rants. And I would value him more, despite how dynamic MacK can be. He also is IMO more inconsistent than Rants. That won't be universal, but I hope other fans can come to understand Rantanen is incredible on his own. In my opinion, it was never a coincidence that MacKinnon broke out after Rantanen's rookie year.

 

[chet1926]

I've watched both players their entire careers. Anyone that thinks there's a big gap between MacK and Rants is out to lunch. Both have their flaws, both have their strengths. But they're both world-class players that can lead any offense on their own. Rants has shown he can slot into center. He's shown he's defensively adept. He's shown he had both a scoring touch and a playmaker's vision. His playoff scoring, while not as good as MacK, is better than most. Very few compare to MacK there.

This Avs fan would trade MacK 10/10 times before Rants. And I would value him more, despite how dynamic MacK can be. He also is IMO more inconsistent than Rants. That won't be universal, but I hope other fans can come to understand Rantanen is incredible on his own. In my opinion, it was never a coincidence that MacKinnon broke out after Rantanen's rookie year.

Sorry this is just wrong. 29 can actually drive offense.

The second 96 gets taken away from 29 and is asked to drive a line, he becomes very average. 29 can really play with anyone and still be useful.

If you have to trade anyone, you trade Rantanen 1000 times out of 1000. 29 is far too important to even consider training him.

I have no idea what players you are watching if truly believe 96 is less streaky than 29. Did you not watch the last month of Avs hockey? Rants has been terrible. 29 hasn't had steak that bad since maybe his 3rd year in the league.

 

[NOTENOUGHRYJOTHINGS]

Sorry this is just wrong. 29 can actually drive offense.

The second 96 gets taken away from 29 and is asked to drive a line, he becomes very average. 29 can really play with anyone and still be useful.

If you have to trade anyone, you trade Rantanen 1000 times out of 1000. 29 is far too important to even consider training him.

I have no idea what players you are watching if truly believe 96 is less streaky than 29. Did you not watch the last month of Avs hockey? Rants has been terrible. 29 hasn't had steak that bad since maybe his 3rd year in the league.

29 has a boat anchor contract.

 

[Lonewolfe2015]

Sorry this is just wrong. 29 can actually drive offense.

The second 96 gets taken away from 29 and is asked to drive a line, he becomes very average. 29 can really play with anyone and still be useful.

If you have to trade anyone, you trade Rantanen 1000 times out of 1000. 29 is far too important to even consider training him.

I have no idea what players you are watching if truly believe 96 is less streaky than 29. Did you not watch the last month of Avs hockey? Rants has been terrible. 29 hasn't had steak that bad since maybe his 3rd year in the league.

Whats wrong, my opinion on keeping Rants or the person who said there's a significant gap between the two? Rants carries the team when MacK is on a cold streak or injured (aka to start the season). Feel free to disagree, it's not like we're talking a major difference in caliber of player, but it's plain as day from my point of view.

Amazing players that just can't keep the gears firing on all cylinders at all times. MacK has the higher gear, but I'd trust Rantanen over 82 games more than him. Would take him over 20. Again, my point of view.

 

[SeanMoneyHands]

If Pettersson doesn't resign in Vancouvrr.
Rantanen for Pettersson one for one. But Elias likely reups in Vancouver this year.

 

[chet1926]

Whats wrong, my opinion on keeping Rants or the person who said there's a significant gap between the two? Rants carries the team when MacK is on a cold streak or injured (aka to start the season). Feel free to disagree, it's not like we're talking a major difference in caliber of player, but it's plain as day from my point of view.

Amazing players that just can't keep the gears firing on all cylinders at all times. MacK has the higher gear, but I'd trust Rantanen over 82 games more than him. Would take him over 20. Again, my point of view.

Well I guess you're entitled to your opinion. But I'll just say I'm glad you are not in charge of making player decisions for the Avs.

The gap between 96 and 29 is large, and I think most would agree with that assessment. Not only does 29 play a tougher position he also produces more.

I totally believe 96 is more of a 80ish pts player if he doesn't get to play with 29. Good player but he simply doesn't drive offense like 29.

 

[Bone Breaker]

teams like Buffalo, New Jersey,Caroline or Ottawa that need to stop taking young guys and think about winning might be interested.

Ottawa --> Pinto+Batherson and 1st
New Jersey--> Meier and Mercer
Buffalo --> Cozens + Peterka
Caroline--> Necas + Morrow

no idea how Buffalo fans would feel about this, but coming from this Avs fan, consider it done. Id take Rants to the airport and pay Adams a bottle of wine there.

 

[Freaky Styley]

no idea how Buffalo fans would feel about this, but coming from this Avs fan, consider it done. Id take Rants to the airport and pay Adams a bottle of wine there.

HFBoards at its finest..

Those two are fine players in their own right, but Rants is top 10 in the league. When he is on he's one of the most dominant players in the league.

He likely isn't getting traded, and either way that NJ package is more attractive. Meier has proven to play at elite levels and can replace Rants + Mercer, who I think ends up as comparable to Cozens long term.

Either way, he isn't getting moved. But that NJ offer isn't a bad one.

 

[AndreRoy]

I've watched both players their entire careers. Anyone that thinks there's a big gap between MacK and Rants is out to lunch. Both have their flaws, both have their strengths. But they're both world-class players that can lead any offense on their own. Rants has shown he can slot into center. He's shown he's defensively adept. He's shown he had both a scoring touch and a playmaker's vision. His playoff scoring, while not as good as MacK, is better than most. Very few compare to MacK there.

This Avs fan would trade MacK 10/10 times before Rants. And I would value him more, despite how dynamic MacK can be. He also is IMO more inconsistent than Rants. That won't be universal, but I hope other fans can come to understand Rantanen is incredible on his own. In my opinion, it was never a coincidence that MacKinnon broke out after Rantanen's rookie year.

Again, I never said Rants isn’t a great player. Term and positional demand favor MacK when it comes to determining value - especially the former. Teams are going to be willing to pay a lot more to acquire a 1C for the next seven years than they will a top line winger for only one more season. If it were Rantanen who was signed long term and MacKinnon who only had a year left on his deal Rants would be the more valuable of the two.

Simply put, term (along with other factors including cap hit, age, trend, and positional importance) matters when determining value; I’m not sure why that’s such a difficult concept for Avs fans to understand.

 

[Freaky Styley]

Simply put, term (along with other factors including cap hit, age, trend, and positional importance) matters when determining value; I’m not sure why that’s such a difficult concept for Avs fans to understand.

I disagree. In a situation like Rantanen, similar to the Meier deal the only thing term will impact could be the number of suitors, as they wouldn't deal him to another contender as a rental. If Rantanen ever got traded, the team he went to would only make the deal if they were certain he extends. In general your point is valid but it's not applicable here IMO.


But this thread should just be closed. He'll most likely retire an Av

 

[Bone Breaker]

HFBoards at its finest..

Those two are fine players in their own right, but Rants is top 10 in the league. When he is on he's one of the most dominant players in the league.

He likely isn't getting traded, and either way that NJ package is more attractive. Meier has proven to play at elite levels and can replace Rants + Mercer, who I think ends up as comparable to Cozens long term.

Either way, he isn't getting moved. But that NJ offer isn't a bad one.

NJ package is a nice one too, but Im biased towards JJ so...
the discussion is not about who is the better player or how good Rants is. everyone and their mother know that. so no idea what you are even trying to argue here, let alone the condescending tone that is, to say the least, uncalled for.
people are discussing a hypothetical scenario in which Rants gets moved, then what could be an acceptable offer for the Avs, considering both needs and value. and I expressed my excitement towards that particular offer. why someone gets triggered by trivial posts like that is something I cant comprehend.

 

[Cogburn]

I just traded a first round pick and a pretty good player for him in my hockey pool.

So I'd say at least that.

 

[jonu]

Sorry this is just wrong. 29 can actually drive offense.

The second 96 gets taken away from 29 and is asked to drive a line, he becomes very average. 29 can really play with anyone and still be useful.

Rantanen has carried Avs when 29 has been injured.

 

[chet1926]

Rantanen has carried Avs when 29 has been injured.

Lol, 1 time this happened. Every other time that 29 has missed games the team and 96 struggle.

29 are 8 are the offensive bus drivers on this team, without them we are usually screwed. 96 is a very good player, but isn't in the same tier as 29 and 8.