I think we're starting to see more and more exceptions to that rule. Players who came up without the red line are playing better into their 30s, especially if they're good skaters to begin with.
Player Discussion: Mikhail Sergachev - Part 2
- Thread starter Zwui21
- Start date
But the average age of NHL defensemen is continuing to drop. Perhaps you're right and those defenders raised on this side of the dead puck era will begin to skew the age higher instead, just hasn't happened yet. When defenders being to lose their first stride in their late 20's, they start to get pushed out, unlike in the pylons of the 90's.
CupsOverCash
Registered User
- Jun 16, 2009
- 16,515
- 7,252
Volodya Krutov
Lost Cosmonaut
- Jan 18, 2012
- 8,135
- 1,036
Sky04
Registered User
- Jan 8, 2009
- 29,530
- 18,861
McDonagh due to age but you can't move him because he has a full NTC so that's a moot point and neither of those 3 are at the top of list if you need to shed salary on this team.
Yeah, but at the same time, you've got a handful of guys like Brent Burns starting to change that. I think it depends a lot on how well the guy skates and how much damage he takes over his career. McDonagh skates well and doesn't take a ton of abuse, and his game is based a lot on IQ. I think he'll be fine for a few more years. I mean, even if he doesn't stay at #2 level, we're fine as long as Sergachev keeps taking steps forward.
Sky04
Registered User
- Jan 8, 2009
- 29,530
- 18,861
Young defenseman are phasing out the fringe older guys who are barely holding onto a job anyways, not effective players like McDonagh unless you think falls off a cliff all of a sudden, even if he gradually declines he will be a solid player for awhile with his skating ability.
Just look at a guy like Coburn and how much we valued his play last season, he's 34 this year and I have no doubts he will secure another contract this off-season. The young guys are primarily offensive contributors the league still has a significant market in veteran stability just because of huge learning curve of playing defense in the NHL.
Last year there were 50 defenseman over the age of 30 who played 40+ games, this year are already 48 who have played 30+ games on the season so the league is actually pacing for more games out of older defenseman. 5 years ago this number was slightly higher at about 57~ so it's not like we're rapidly phasing out older d-men but the ones they cutting out are ones closer to 40 or have gotten too slow to stay in the league, a defenseman between 32-35 with good skating will be just fine.
This NTC thing is a bit overblown. If Minnesota came calling for McDonagh I'm pretty sure he would waive to go there. Same with a few other guys and certain teams. These guys aren't married to Tampa due to this NTC.
Sky04
Registered User
- Jan 8, 2009
- 29,530
- 18,861
Yes he's going to waive his NTC on a cup contending team to go home and play in mediocrity... think about that for a sec. I mean you're the one who was arguing that we wouldn't be able to get rid of Johnson because there's no way he would waive his NTC off a contender in a tax free state. Seems like wishful thinking if anything.
TeslaCoilFan
Slightly Elite Fan
He's got 6 more years after this and only the last year he has a modified NTC, I'm pretty sure we aren't stuck with him till 2025 if we don't want to be. He probably won't waive this year or next but once he gets fully passed by Sergachev on the 2nd pair he most likely considers going home. I said Johnson wouldn't waive like a year or so ago when he was still a big part of the team. He's been passed by several players again and his role is diminishing. He most likely will want to show he still can be a top 6 player and be willing to waive maybe as early as this summer.
These guys want to play as much as possible and be a big part of the team, if they see their role diminishing and other players passing them by they'll most likely want out. Probably not right after signing a long term contract but a couple of years in I can. I wouldn't trade McDonagh anyway for a few years unless Sergachev asks for the moon while Cernak and Foote show they can be top 4 and want to be paid too. We can manage with 3 good sized contracts on D the next few years. We need to move some dead weight in the forwards first.
BowDownToVasilevskiy
Registered User
A mic'd up Sergy! He's got SUCH a Canadian accent to his English.
They should get Rutta mic'd up next
- Jan 23, 2017
- 19,958
- 27,859
I don't think Rutta uses his voice to communicate with mere mortals though.
I easily pick McDonagh. The problem is the expansion draft comes a year too late for that to be an option - the cap crunch that may likely cost us one of Sergachev or Cirelli is this summer.
I don’t see McDonagh or Johnson waiving this summer as they still have significant roles with the team and Johnson in particular loves it here. Maybe if we tell McDonagh that he’ll be exposed to (and almost certainly taken by) Seattle he’ll agree to waive in order to have a little more say in his destination, but ideally we would prefer to keep him next season anyway if possible.
The one guy I think this could potentially work on is Gourde, as he’s been demoted to the fourth line and might prefer to go somewhere he can play in the top six. That would be the ideal scenario for us as it would free up the cap space for Serg and Cirelli while still leaving us the option of using McDonagh or Johnson as expansion bait the following summer if we need to free additional cap space.
Volodya Krutov
Lost Cosmonaut
- Jan 18, 2012
- 8,135
- 1,036
No matter the cap situation, Killorn should be moved "at all cost" next off-season, he's not going any better than this. Sell high, profit.
But he is the most consistent player of the bunch. Even if he doesn't hit these highs again you know what you will get with him. Gourde can't seem to be getting close to what he was a few seasons ago, Johnson is slowly being phased out of a big role and Palat is finally playing better but you never know when he will get hurt and then go back to struggling. I agree though that if you were to sell Killorn this is the best possible time as his value will never be higher. But I think he is more important to the team that any of the other 3 and you know you can play him anywhere in the lineup and he will produce. I would definitely think about keeping him as much as possible.
Volodya Krutov
Lost Cosmonaut
- Jan 18, 2012
- 8,135
- 1,036
I agree he's more valuable to the team than others cited but I'm not sure Gourde or Johnson can draw the same interest as Killorn will. The NHL just loves him. I could see a small bidding war if he's available. Some guys gotta go to keep this core intact anyways; Moving Killorn seems almost inevitable IMO, and very fruitful on the long term. Nonetheless, I'll let JBB work his magic if he finds another way to free cap-space for sure.
Moving Killorn doesn't really have the same impact on the cap now or in the future as some others. He makes the least amount of money and besides Palat has the least amount of years left. The best to move would be Gourde for price and length then Johnson. Obviously the return on those two won't be as good and we might have to take a little salary back. I'd just prefer to keep Killorn because we don't have a do it all prospect who's ready yet.
I'm asking them to see if they'll waive their NTC and to what teams they would waive for. We aren't the only team that has a chance to win, if they want a contender then we can look at those. We aren't the only team in a no state tax location, if they want that we can look at those. They have to see the writing on the wall especially in Gourdes case who's now playing on the 4th line and Johnson is barely playing 13 minutes a night now. These guys could get much better opportunities to play elsewhere.
Frolik waived his NTC to leave a contender in Calgary for Buffalo so he can play more. Malkin was considering waiving his NMC to leave a contender in Pittsburgh. Phil Kessel was willing to leave Pittsburgh for Arizona. Again I would ask them if there is a few teams they would play for and see what kinda deals we could work out. I'm not just immediately dumping Killorn on July 1st for cap space.
The contract should have never been given out to Gourde.
Zwui21
Registered User
- Aug 31, 2019
- 2,404
- 3,011
cphabs
The 2 stooges….
- Dec 21, 2012
- 7,764
- 5,226
The 21 year old 6’2 220 pound Russian defenseman who is on track for .5 PPG with a healthy +/-? Trade him back to the Habs for Drouin... Please?
