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McDavid heating up, what are odds on 150 points this season?

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Regal said:
I think how it compares to the best of Howe will be interesting. Howe had a more dominant finish relative to peers, but there’s more competition from a 32 team league.
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Yeah honestly if he gets around 65 goals and 150 points I'd consider that better in todays NHL. I already consider him the better player anyway but that might be a minority opinion.
 
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2-3 weeks ago I was thinking 140 was his ceiling. But now he's got 121 with 19 games left. That's 29 points in 19 games. He'll do that in his sleep if he keeps playing the way he has been playing. Nothing is guaranteed though. The games get tighter at this point in the season. He really turned on the jets, right now we're talking about a season that rivals Gretzky's best in a Kings uniform.
 
Evilsports said:
Wayne had 163 in 1990-1991.

I'd like to see McDavid get 156. That'd at least put him in the most elite of company. In the history of the league 156+ points has only ever been done by Mario or Wayne, a combined 13 times!
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Not to diminish Lemieux's greatness but Gretzky had 9 of those 13, including 8 of the top 10 all time. As great as Lemieux was, Gretzky was something else.

thewave said:
McDavid is a Wayne / Mario class of player. Jagr did 149 in the mid 90's which is when scoring got harder as well. He is in the top bracket for sure though.
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The 95/96 season in which Jagr hit 149 wasn't low scoring. Excluding this season (because it's not finished yet), it's the highest scoring season of the last 27 years.
 
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KoozNetsOff 92 said:
Not to diminish Lemieux's greatness but Gretzky had 9 of those 13, including 8 of the top 10 all time. As great as Lemieux was, Gretzky was something else.



The 95/96 season in which Jagr hit 149 wasn't low scoring. Excluding this season (because it's not finished yet), it's the highest scoring season of the last 27 years.
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Fair enough. McDavid is indeed better than Jagr though. I think that's the important point.

I think if we factored in Mario's health issues there would be a pretty strong argument. Mario could power through teams, in my eyes those two were neck and neck for different reasons.
 
norrisnick said:
64 and 154, plz. Let Yzerman have that one thing.
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No knock on Yzerman but I never "liked" the fact he has that "record". Other than that season he was never a hart finalist again, he's only ever made 1 AST, etc. Great player, but to see his name as the next "best" after Gretzky and Lemieux just seems wrong. I mean does anyone ever mention that season as the best non Gretzky/Lemieux forward season? I'd rank seasons from Howe, Jagr, OV, Bobby Hull and Espo ahead off the top of my head. McDavid is in that group and is quickly shooting to the top so it's only fitting he takes this "record". I hope he hits 160pts, would be ridiculous in this era and the best non Gretzky/Lemieux forward season.
 
KoozNetsOff 92 said:
No knock on Yzerman but I never "liked" the fact he has that "record". Other than that season he was never a hart finalist again, he's only ever made 1 AST, etc. Great player, but to see his name as the next "best" after Gretzky and Lemieux just seems wrong. I mean does anyone ever mention that season as the best non Gretzky/Lemieux forward season? I'd rank seasons from Howe, Jagr, OV, Bobby Hull and Espo ahead off the top of my head. McDavid is in that group and is quickly shooting to the top so it's only fitting he takes this "record". I hope he hits 160pts, would be ridiculous in this era and the best non Gretzky/Lemieux forward season.
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How was he supposed to with Gretz and Lemieux completely overlapping with his prime?

This is Yzerman's 6 year peak.

1677957593809.png


If Yzerman is the marquee scorer of the era he gets a lot more consideration for voted awards.
 
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norrisnick said:
How was he supposed to with Gretz and Lemieux completely overlapping with his prime?

This is Yzerman's 6 year peak.

View attachment 663112

If Yzerman is the marquee scorer of the era he gets a lot more consideration for voted awards.
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Yzerman would have been a hart finalist 1 other season if Gretzky and Lemieux didn't exist. They weren't the reason he was finishing outside the top 5. Even after Gretzky exited his peak and really prime after the Suter hit, Yzerman was only 25/26. He never came top 5 in hart after that, even removing Lemieux (who was missing games and seasons anyway). Never made another AST either even when Gretzky was basically done and Lemieux was missing.
 
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KoozNetsOff 92 said:
Yzerman would have been a hart finalist 1 other season if Gretzky and Lemieux didn't exist. They weren't the reason he was finishing outside the top 5. Even after Gretzky exited his peak and really prime after the Suter hit, Yzerman was only 25/26. He never came top 5 in hart after that, even removing Lemieux (who was missing games and seasons anyway). Never made another AST either even when Gretzky was basically done and Lemieux was missing.
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Again, if Yzerman is the marquee scoring forward of the League he would have gotten more votes than he did. We don't know where the votes for Gretzky or Lemieux would have gone had they not existed, but I imagine the most dynamic scorer in the league picks up a few of them.
 
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McDavid put up 90 points in 47 games for the final two months in the last two years.(1.91 p/pg)
At that pace I say he gets to 157 points at bare minimun. Even though he has 16 points in his last 5 games(3.2 p/pg) 🤯
 
KoozNetsOff 92 said:
No knock on Yzerman but I never "liked" the fact he has that "record". Other than that season he was never a hart finalist again, he's only ever made 1 AST, etc. Great player, but to see his name as the next "best" after Gretzky and Lemieux just seems wrong. I mean does anyone ever mention that season as the best non Gretzky/Lemieux forward season? I'd rank seasons from Howe, Jagr, OV, Bobby Hull and Espo ahead off the top of my head. McDavid is in that group and is quickly shooting to the top so it's only fitting he takes this "record". I hope he hits 160pts, would be ridiculous in this era and the best non Gretzky/Lemieux forward season.
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Age might be a factor here. Yzerman in his prime was unreal offensively. That season was not a fluke. I watched all of those guys on your list except Hull, and Yzerman is right there with them if not better, no question,.
 
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I'm going to make a wild, baseless assumption and guess that Connor McDavid will place in the top five in Hart trophy voting this year. That would be his 7th year in a row.

Most consecutive years in the top five in Hart trophy, NHL history
  • Wayne Gretzky - 12x (1984 to 1991)
  • Gordie Howe - 10x (1957 to 1966)
  • Bobby Orr - 8x (1968 to 1975)
  • Connor McDavid - 7x (2017 to 2023 - presumably)
  • Bobby Hull - 6x (1964 to 1969)
  • Guy Lafleur - 6x (1975 to 1980)
  • Bobby Clarke - 5x (1973 to 1977)
  • Sidney Crosby - 5x (2013 to 2017)
Notable players who never accomplished this - Alex Ovechkin, Denis Potvin, Dominik Hasek, Doug Harvey, Eddie Shore, Howie Morenz, Jacques Plante, Jaromir Jagr, Jean Beliveau, Mario Lemieux (due to injuries), Mark Messier, Maurice Richard, Nicklas Lidstrom, Patrick Roy, Phil Esposito, Ray Bourque, Red Kelly, Stan Mikita
 
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The Panther said:
161 points in his last 82 NHL games, counting playoffs. Yeah, that's not bad.

Incidentally, here's how McDavid's current pace this year compares to some early- and late-prime Gretzky and Lemieux seasons (not their peak seasons, mind you):

Gretzky 1988-89
138 PTS in 63 games
Lemieux 1987-88
132 PTS in 63 games
Lemieux 1991-92
130 PTS in 63 games
Gretzky1990-91
129 PTS in 63 games
Gretzky1989-90
122 PTS in 63 games
Gretzky1980-81
121 PTS in 63 games
McDavid 2022-23
121 PTS in 63 games
Lemieux 1985-86
120 PTS in 63 games
Lemieux 1986-87
107 PTS in 63 games
Lemieux 1996-97
104 PTS in 63 games

Remember when this was considered impossible... like, 5 years ago?
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Right and it's harder to score now than when they played. He is right there with those two and the only thing he needs to do is 10 more years of the same sort of thing and we will all say, CMcD is the modern era GOAT.
 
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thewave said:
Right and it's harder to score now than when they played. He is right there with those two and the only thing he needs to do is 10 more years of the same sort of thing and we will all say, CMcD is the modern era GOAT.
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Slow down there kid. I like your enthusiasm, but from your posts you do a lot of "past shaming."

Here to put your brakes on a bit.

In 1989, a notoriously prolific year for scoring in the NHL, NINE players scored over 100 points. FIVE 50 goal scorers. That was Yzerman's big year and Bernie Nicholls 70 goal year.

This season, NINE players are currently on pace for more than 100 points, and FIVE are on pace for 50 goals.

Exact same.

Edit: 6 50 goal scorers in 1989. Nieuwendyk had 51. Missed him.
 
fly4apuckguy said:
Age might be a factor here. Yzerman in his prime was unreal offensively. That season was not a fluke. I watched all of those guys on your list except Hull, and Yzerman is right there with them if not better, no question,.
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You picked his best 6 year streak. I don't think that solidifies him as the next best scorer of the era, but he's probably up there after Bossy.
fly4apuckguy said:
Slow down there kid. I like your enthusiasm, but from your posts you do a lot of "past shaming."

Here to put your brakes on a bit.

In 1989, a notoriously prolific year for scoring in the NHL, NINE players scored over 100 points. FIVE 50 goal scorers. That was Yzerman's big year and Bernie Nicholls 70 goal year.

This season, NINE players are currently on pace for more than 100 points, and FIVE are on pace for 50 goals.

Exact same.

Edit: 6 50 goal scorers in 1989. Nieuwendyk had 51. Missed him.
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4 players had 150 points in 1989. He's not wrong.
 
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