Player Discussion Matthew Knies | Built for the Playoffs

[htpwn]

Note the actual quote from CJ too: "...Rival executives believe there's a move coming here."

His source isn't from within the Leafs. He's hearing it from other teams, who have their own agendas.

That doesn't mean Knies isn't being shopped, but Chayka has played his cards close to his vest thus far and it is worth being skeptical given how these rumours are a major departure in tone from his other two big moves since getting the job (the Hiller hiring and the Woll trade).

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

Looking at the Montreal trade that didn't get pushed through and it's clear Knies has a lot of value.

Other GM's appreciate what he brings. Assuming the rumours about Hughes meltdown on Treliving are true the Montreal deal might even still be on the table. That's a reasonable base to start and I can understand why it was leaked to the media.

The Leafs want to drive the price higher.

Shouldn't be much of a problem either. Some of the trades this week give a glimpse into how valuable he is. When top five picks are being dished out like pills at a party it's time to put your hand out and get your fill.

Knies is a great player.

To be honest I'd rather they trade an aging Nylander. I'd much rather have the bruising power forward over the glam you-tuber any day. One of these players is likely to only get better while the other is gonna start to decline.

Moving on to the McKenna era from the Matthews era necessarily means making difficult choices.

 

[Hellcat]

I think I posted this elsewhere with a very unpopular point that Stenberg can play both wings.

Fans are gonna fan, I guess. It's less unusual for a Euro winger to play both wings than a NA skater. Especially Russians love to play their off wing.

Any suggestion that another player might have an edge over McKenna gets swatted away immediately. McKenna has been getting hyped by Canadian media since he was 15 years old. For years, people have been told he's a special, franchise-changing talent, and many have already formed their opinions long before this draft.

That constant hype has conditioned some fans to believe it's impossible for anyone else in this draft class to be just as impactful. Maybe McKenna does become a Hall of Famer. Maybe he lives up to every bit of the hype. Nobody really knows.

What would be nice is if the blinders crowd could at least entertain the possibility that there are other players in this draft who could become impact NHLers too—maybe even future Hall of Famers themselves.

At the end of the day, I cheer for the Leafs, not McKenna, Stenberg, Reid, or any other prospect. If the Leafs draft Malhotra and he ends up being the difference-maker that helps bring a Cup to Toronto, I couldn't care less whether he was considered the BPA on draft day. I'll be thrilled with the pick.

 

[Hellcat]

Note the actual quote from CJ too: "...Rival executives believe there's a move coming here."

His source isn't from within the Leafs. He's hearing it from other teams, who have their own agendas.

That doesn't mean Knies isn't being shopped, but Chayka has played his cards close to his vest thus far and it is worth being skeptical given how these rumours are a major departure in tone from his other two big moves since getting the job (the Hiller hiring and the Woll trade).

One thing fans are missing is that even if Knies isn't actually available, the rumor itself still serves a purpose.

The moment his name starts circulating, every GM with interest is calling Chayka to check his availability. That's the real value of the rumor. Knies becomes the honeypot that gets rival GMs on the phone.

Treliving tells them the rumors aren't true and that Knies isn't available, but by then the conversation is already happening. They start talking about organizational needs, cap situations, and players who may or may not be available. Maybe Chayka learns that a player nobody thought was on the market actually is. Maybe the other GM mentions they're looking for a right-shot defenseman, and Chayka throws Carlo's name out there.

A conversation that never would have happened 24 hours earlier suddenly becomes the framework for a trade.

People assume every rumor exists because a trade is imminent. Sometimes the rumor is the trade tool. It creates dialogue, gathers intelligence, and opens doors that otherwise wouldn't have been opened.

That's why I take most "insider" reports with a grain of salt. They're often either completely made-up nonsense or information being strategically leaked by a GM or agent to serve a purpose.

 

[ToneDog]

One thing fans are missing is that even if Knies isn't actually available, the rumor itself still serves a purpose.

The moment his name starts circulating, every GM with interest is calling Chayka to check his availability. That's the real value of the rumor. Knies becomes the honeypot that gets rival GMs on the phone.

Treliving tells them the rumors aren't true and that Knies isn't available, but by then the conversation is already happening. They start talking about organizational needs, cap situations, and players who may or may not be available. Maybe Chayka learns that a player nobody thought was on the market actually is. Maybe the other GM mentions they're looking for a right-shot defenseman, and Chayka throws Carlo's name out there.

A conversation that never would have happened 24 hours earlier suddenly becomes the framework for a trade.

People assume every rumor exists because a trade is imminent. Sometimes the rumor is the trade tool. It creates dialogue, gathers intelligence, and opens doors that otherwise wouldn't have been opened.

That's why I take most "insider" reports with a grain of salt. They're often either completely made-up nonsense or information being strategically leaked by a GM or agent to serve a purpose.

So you are suggesting they they are floating Knies' name out there so other GM call Chayka? What good do the rumours do for Knies?

That strategy is similar to real estate agents putting up a for sale sign on a mansion that is not for sale. When interested parties call, they say, well that house is not for sale but could I interest you in these other houses?

I lean to the rumours actually being true.

 

[The Masters]

Wish Chicago was more aggressive for him

 

[ToneDog]

Fans are gonna fan, I guess. It's less unusual for a Euro winger to play both wings than a NA skater. Especially Russians love to play their off wing.

Any suggestion that another player might have an edge over McKenna gets swatted away immediately. McKenna has been getting hyped by Canadian media since he was 15 years old. For years, people have been told he's a special, franchise-changing talent, and many have already formed their opinions long before this draft.

That constant hype has conditioned some fans to believe it's impossible for anyone else in this draft class to be just as impactful. Maybe McKenna does become a Hall of Famer. Maybe he lives up to every bit of the hype. Nobody really knows.

What would be nice is if the blinders crowd could at least entertain the possibility that there are other players in this draft who could become impact NHLers too—maybe even future Hall of Famers themselves.

At the end of the day, I cheer for the Leafs, not McKenna, Stenberg, Reid, or any other prospect. If the Leafs draft Malhotra and he ends up being the difference-maker that helps bring a Cup to Toronto, I couldn't care less whether he was considered the BPA on draft day. I'll be thrilled with the pick.

You are not wrong but post looks like it was written by Bukala.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

So you are suggesting they they are floating Knies' name out there so other GM call Chayka? What good do the rumours do for Knies?

If I was Knies I would think "gee... I'm a hot commodity around the NHL".

Imagine being drafted in the second round and after only three years in the NHL teams are offering two first round picks and two prospects for you. Knowing the team that drafted you won't trade you unless in the event of a gross overpay. And that you are so highly valued as a star in this league there is a potential bidding war for your services right now that might actually drive the price up high enough to meet that exorbitant price.

If that was me my head would be so swollen I'd have to rub it with Preparation H just to get my helmet on.

 

[Schennanigans]

If I was Knies I would think "gee... I'm a hot commodity around the NHL".

Imagine being drafted in the second round and after only three years in the NHL teams are offering two first round picks and two prospects for you. Knowing the team that drafted you won't trade you unless in the event of a gross overpay. And that you are so highly valued as a star in this league there is a potential bidding war for your services right now that might actually drive the price up high enough to meet that exorbitant price.

If that was me my head would be so swollen I'd have to rub it with Preparation H just to get my helmet on.

He’s giga chad on top of that so girls be fighting over him like this too.

 

[ToneDog]

If I was Knies I would think "gee... I'm a hot commodity around the NHL".

Imagine being drafted in the second round and after only three years in the NHL teams are offering two first round picks and two prospects for you. Knowing the team that drafted you won't trade you unless in the event of a gross overpay. And that you are so highly valued as a star in this league there is a potential bidding war for your services right now that might actually drive the price up high enough to meet that exorbitant price.

If that was me my head would be so swollen I'd have to rub it with Preparation H just to get my helmet on.

Or he might think he is not wanted here. The last thing this team needs is another star with a head so swollen he needs prep H to get his helmet on. Thankfully Knies does not seem to be that guy.

 

[Ianturnedbull]

JD Bunkis fan590 just now:

"A Matthew Knies trade is looking very real right now."

_____

I just want to inform leaf fans that a trade doesn't have to be a death nail. Shanny/Dubas did almost nothing (unless you think the Kadri trade was bold) in terms of bold moves for the franchise.

If there is a bidding war for Knies and the return could help now and in the future then you take it.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

Or he might think he is not wanted here. The last thing this team needs is another star with a head so swollen he needs prep H to get his helmet on. Thankfully Knies does not seem to be that guy.

Bigger stars than him have been traded before.

It's a big business, nothing personal, I'm sure Knies understands that. Literally every star player ever has had their name floated before. No reason Knies would be an exception.

The only reason Knies wouldn't be involved in any trade proposals if he stinks with no value so nobody wanted him.

 

[meefer]

Has Chayka done anything yet to suggest that if he were to trade Knies, he'd get fleeced? To date, in Toronto, I don't think he has. And, he's in the same situation with Knies that he's in with McKenna. He cannot afford not to take McKenna, and he can't be seen as losing a trade that includes Knies. Personally, it would basically cripple his standing as a competent GM, for the team it would be a disaster, optically around the league, and internally 'why am I here, this 'team' hasn't a clue' would explode like a bomb in the dressing rooom...bye bye Matthews.

If a trade occurs, we're going to do ok.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

Only way I see it going down is Leafs get 3 top picks/prospects exchanging Knies for a 2C. potential 1D and/or high end draft picks .. and maybe Rielly is somehow thrown into it to unload a contract .. but i doubt it

 

[Hellcat]

So you are suggesting they they are floating Knies' name out there so other GM call Chayka? What good do the rumours do for Knies?

That strategy is similar to real estate agents putting up a for sale sign on a mansion that is not for sale. When interested parties call, they say, well that house is not for sale but could I interest you in these other houses?

I lean to the rumours actually being true.

If I was Knies I'd be pretty pissed TBH, he's been getting traded since the year before he went pro, he almost went to Chicago for Fleury & Hagel ... if you only think my value is in a trade, that hits the ego a bit TBH.

It's a simple conversation, Chakya calls Knies and tells him, there is zero truth to the rumors, "Insiders" are just trying to get clicks, you're a big part of our future. Zero chance you get traded.

At the same time I dont publicly deny the rumors because they can be a means to an end.

 

[Hellcat]

JD Bunkis fan590 just now:

"A Matthew Knies trade is looking very real right now."

_____

I just want to inform leaf fans that a trade doesn't have to be a death nail. Shanny/Dubas did almost nothing (unless you think the Kadri trade was bold) in terms of bold moves for the franchise.

If there is a bidding war for Knies and the return could help now and in the future then you take it.

I call bologna on that JD Bunkis comment. Unless there is a gross overpay, not a chance he is moved. Which GM has the assets to over pay with NHL ready players and not degrade his team significantly, the Leafs are in a win now mode.

Rumor #1 - There was one rumor floating around yesterday that caught my attention, Buffalo apparently has interest in Knies, Buffalo has Chicago's #4 and the Oilers #20 - so that would go against the grain of trading for NHL ready - but it sure would allow us to draft McKenna and one of the top ranked Dmen...

Rumor #2 - San Jose has the #2 and #9, there was a rumor that it was Knies/Rielly to San Jose for the #2 and #9, plus, plus... that would be really interesting IMO. We would then Pick McKenna, Stenberg and our future 3C.

 

[meefer]

I call bologna on that JD Bunkis comment. Unless there is a gross overpay, not a chance he is moved. Which GM has the assets to over pay with NHL ready players and not degrade his team significantly, the Leafs are in a win now mode.

Rumor #1 - There was one rumor floating around yesterday that caught my attention, Buffalo apparently has interest in Knies, Buffalo has Chicago's #4 and the Oilers #20 - so that would go against the grain of trading for NHL ready - but it sure would allow us to draft McKenna and one of the top ranked Dmen...

Rumor #2 - San Jose has the #2 and #9, there was a rumor that it was Knies/Rielly to San Jose for the #2 and #9, plus, plus... that would be really interesting IMO. We would then Pick McKenna, Stenberg and our future 3C.

As Stenberg apparently can play RW, it would be a blast to see him, Matthews and McKenna as our first line...it would have to bring back some of the joy I think AM has lost these past 2 years. You thinking BJorck with the 9th? Curious as to what you see as being the ++

 

[Ianturnedbull]

I call bologna on that JD Bunkis comment. Unless there is a gross overpay, not a chance he is moved. Which GM has the assets to over pay with NHL ready players and not degrade his team significantly, the Leafs are in a win now mode.

Rumor #1 - There was one rumor floating around yesterday that caught my attention, Buffalo apparently has interest in Knies, Buffalo has Chicago's #4 and the Oilers #20 - so that would go against the grain of trading for NHL ready - but it sure would allow us to draft McKenna and one of the top ranked Dmen...

Rumor #2 - San Jose has the #2 and #9, there was a rumor that it was Knies/Rielly to San Jose for the #2 and #9, plus, plus... that would be really interesting IMO. We would then Pick McKenna, Stenberg and our future 3C.

How do you know TOR doesn't circle back on MTL's offer?

 

[ITM]

Fans are gonna fan, I guess. It's less unusual for a Euro winger to play both wings than a NA skater. Especially Russians love to play their off wing.

Any suggestion that another player might have an edge over McKenna gets swatted away immediately. McKenna has been getting hyped by Canadian media since he was 15 years old. For years, people have been told he's a special, franchise-changing talent, and many have already formed their opinions long before this draft.

That constant hype has conditioned some fans to believe it's impossible for anyone else in this draft class to be just as impactful. Maybe McKenna does become a Hall of Famer. Maybe he lives up to every bit of the hype. Nobody really knows.

What would be nice is if the blinders crowd could at least entertain the possibility that there are other players in this draft who could become impact NHLers too—maybe even future Hall of Famers themselves.

At the end of the day, I cheer for the Leafs, not McKenna, Stenberg, Reid, or any other prospect. If the Leafs draft Malhotra and he ends up being the difference-maker that helps bring a Cup to Toronto, I couldn't care less whether he was considered the BPA on draft day. I'll be thrilled with the pick.

One can hope.

 

[AvroArrow]

As much as I would love to have Reid anchor our blue line for the next decade +, I am absolutely terrified about the idea of trading him to division rival Buffalo.

We all know what Knies is, imagining him on a line with Tage Thompson, that is f***ing terrifying. Really hate that we're in this position. McKenna is gonna be the franchise winger, Cowan is a nice young talent and he loves being a Leaf but doesn't hold the same trade value as Knies.

Knies maybe the best young power forward in the league on an insane contract and not even in his prime yet.

Log jam at LW, someone is going to have to go for help on D.


Werenski would be quite the get, but then again he's only signed for 1 more year with a 10 team NMC. If he doesn't re-sign, you could still trade him for something.


If the idea is to compete now, which is what it looks like it is, a trade including Werenski makes the most sense. Fits the cores age, 28 years old, can be an effective player for the next 5-7 years at least.

 

[Gary Nylund]

As much as I would love to have Reid anchor our blue line for the next decade +, I am absolutely terrified about the idea of trading him to division rival Buffalo.

We all know what Knies is, imagining him on a line with Tage Thompson, that is f***ing terrifying. Really hate that we're in this position. McKenna is gonna be the franchise winger, Cowan is a nice young talent and he loves being a Leaf but doesn't hold the same trade value as Knies.

Knies maybe the best young power forward in the league on an insane contract and not even in his prime yet.

Log jam at LW, someone is going to have to go for help on D.

Werenski would be quite the get, but then again he's only signed for 1 more year with a 10 team NMC. If he doesn't re-sign, you could still trade him for something.

If the idea is to compete now, which is what it looks like it is, a trade including Werenski makes the most sense. Fits the cores age, 28 years old, can be an effective player for the next 5-7 years at least.

I'd be more concerned with competing 5 years from now then competing now. For that reason, I don't like Werenski for Knies as that makes us older, and I want to get younger.

 

[Budz]

Just the media farming likes. Chayka has already said he isn't going bating something insane. Can these media clowns stop talking about trading him. IT ISNT HAPPENING.

You should brace yourself and grab some warm milk.

 

[kevsh]

I call bologna on that JD Bunkis comment. Unless there is a gross overpay, not a chance he is moved. Which GM has the assets to over pay with NHL ready players and not degrade his team significantly, the Leafs are in a win now mode.

Rumor #1 - There was one rumor floating around yesterday that caught my attention, Buffalo apparently has interest in Knies, Buffalo has Chicago's #4 and the Oilers #20 - so that would go against the grain of trading for NHL ready - but it sure would allow us to draft McKenna and one of the top ranked Dmen...

Rumor #2 - San Jose has the #2 and #9, there was a rumor that it was Knies/Rielly to San Jose for the #2 and #9, plus, plus... that would be really interesting IMO. We would then Pick McKenna, Stenberg and our future 3C.

I don't like it but I can buy the theory of Knies for a top 4 D-man (or some package that gets that) as it fits the idea of the Leafs making a serious push while Matthews/Nylander are still top players.

If they feel they have a surplus on the left side & a pressing, critical need elsewhere (they do, a top 4 d-man), fine, the move possibly makes the Leafs better this season.

But for picks? Even NHL-ready 18-year-olds can take 3+ seasons to really hit their stride, more so for D-men. McKenna might be the exception in this draft but he's already in the mix, it's the others they might target I'm talking about.

To trade an established, 1st line power forward so they can grab, for example, Reid or Malhotra is a big gamble and almost certainly makes the team a little weaker for the next season or two at minimum.

 

[AvroArrow]

I'd be more concerned with competing 5 years from now then competing now. For that reason, I don't like Werenski for Knies as that makes us older, and I want to get younger.

Personally I agree with you. Issue is, ownership/management want to win now.

If it was up to me, I'd ship out Matthews/Nylander for whatever you can get, wouldn't have signed Raddysh, rebuild around McKenna/Knies/Cowan and ideally grab a D-man in the top 10 of this draft.

But these guys have their mindset on competing now, for that reason, Werenski makes sense.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Personally I agree with you. Issue is, ownership/management want to win now.

If it was up to me, I'd ship out Matthews/Nylander for whatever you can get, wouldn't have signed Raddysh, rebuild around McKenna/Knies/Cowan and ideally grab a D-man in the top 10 of this draft.

But these guys have their mindset on competing now, for that reason, Werenski makes sense.

Yeah could be, could be. Maybe they'll shock us all and go completely allin - keep Kines who's about to hit his prime and instead, trade McKenna for someone like Werenski and a few other "win now" pieces.