Prospect Info: Marlies/Prospects Thread - Who ordered a taxi?

[LaPlante94]

But that's just the thing isn't it. Liljegren has not performed well in the NHL. It's nice that he has played very well in the AHL and that he is capable of being a 1 or 2 D man in the AHL but it is a massive step up to the NHL. And from what I have seen the main concern in Liljegren's NHL games is that he is not processing the game at the NHL pace. That's everything. It does not matter what physical skills he has if he can't process the game fast enough and doesn't have the hockey IQ. I would be ecxtatic if he proves me wrong but I only see him as a bottom pair D maybe a #4 in the NHL.

He's played a total of 13 NHL games and I'd say he's looked pretty damn good in all of them except maybe 2 or 3.

 

[stickty111]

But that's just the thing isn't it. Liljegren has not performed well in the NHL. It's nice that he has played very well in the AHL and that he is capable of being a 1 or 2 D man in the AHL but it is a massive step up to the NHL. And from what I have seen the main concern in Liljegren's NHL games is that he is not processing the game at the NHL pace. That's everything. It does not matter what physical skills he has if he can't process the game fast enough and doesn't have the hockey IQ. I would be ecxtatic if he proves me wrong but I only see him as a bottom pair D maybe a #4 in the NHL.

Thats a 13 game sample size so it's tough to make evaluations. He also looked a lot better in the 2 games this season.

 

[stickty111]

He's played a total of 13 NHL games and I'd say he's looked pretty damn good in all of them except maybe 2 or 3.

Yeah he wasn't as bad as he is made out to be. He was much better this season in 2 games too. He just needs some confidence and he'll be fine.

 

[Maplebeasts]

But that's just the thing isn't it. Liljegren has not performed well in the NHL. It's nice that he has played very well in the AHL and that he is capable of being a 1 or 2 D man in the AHL but it is a massive step up to the NHL. And from what I have seen the main concern in Liljegren's NHL games is that he is not processing the game at the NHL pace. That's everything. It does not matter what physical skills he has if he can't process the game fast enough and doesn't have the hockey IQ. I would be ecxtatic if he proves me wrong but I only see him as a bottom pair D maybe a #4 in the NHL.

He really hasn't been given a chance. He played 2 games this past season and looked very good in a bottom pairing role.

 

[KitchenSink]

He's played a total of 13 NHL games and I'd say he's looked pretty damn good in all of them except maybe 2 or 3.

Yeah he wasn't as bad as he is made out to be. He was much better this season in 2 games too. He just needs some confidence and he'll be fine.

He really hasn't been given a chance. He played 2 games this past season and looked very good in a bottom pairing role.

I also would have liked to see him in more nhl games by now even just to see what exactly it is we have in him. But the nhl sample we have is the nhl sample we have. I think we'll just have to agree to disagree with people who are saying his games in the nhl have been good. I remembering him making some pretty big give aways in transition, panicking under pressure, and losing forwards behind him with very sheltered minutes and not adding any offence.

I have watched him at the ahl level as well and know that he can perform better. I agree he just needs to gain some confidence but it just seems to take him some time to get comfortable and gain confidence at new levels. Time that I'm not sure the leafs can afford but I think we will see this year.

Like someone who is a supporter of liljegren has already said, the reason many rank Sandin above Liljegren is because of hockey IQ. It is this lower Hockey IQ that I feel limits his projection to the bottom half of an nhl D Corp. I know this is a bit of an unpopular opinion in this thread but I just feel some people are over compensating for the Liljegren hate in the mainstream media.

 

[justloveleafs]

I am prejudiced in regards to liljegren, I like guy a lot.

 

[SprDaVE]

Brett Budgell also invited to the Leafs dev camp.

Also, sounds like the Dev camp will be around the same time as the Traverse City tournament Sept 16-20.

Maple Leafs extend invitation to Newfoundlander Brett Budgell | Saltwire

 

[stickty111]

I also would have liked to see him in more nhl games by now even just to see what exactly it is we have in him. But the nhl sample we have is the nhl sample we have. I think we'll just have to agree to disagree with people who are saying his games in the nhl have been good. I remembering him making some pretty big give aways in transition, panicking under pressure, and losing forwards behind him with very sheltered minutes and not adding any offence.

I have watched him at the ahl level as well and know that he can perform better. I agree he just needs to gain some confidence but it just seems to take him some time to get comfortable and gain confidence at new levels. Time that I'm not sure the leafs can afford but I think we will see this year.

Like someone who is a supporter of liljegren has already said, the reason many rank Sandin above Liljegren is because of hockey IQ. It is this lower Hockey IQ that I feel limits his projection to the bottom half of an nhl D Corp. I know this is a bit of an unpopular opinion in this thread but I just feel some people are over compensating for the Liljegren hate in the mainstream media.

There is no reason to overcompensate. Lilly's projection and progression tells us how good he has been. I disagree on the lower IQ. His IQ is right up there with Sandin's. It's odd the mistakes Sandin made in the playoffs are what people criticize Liljegren for in lack of IQ. Sandin makes the same mistakes yet only Liljegren is criticized for lack of IQ.

 

[Apex Predator]

I think Liljegren just needs a good stretch of games to adjust to the NHL and he’ll be fine. His first call up he didn’t look great but his last season stint he looked fine except when he was on the PK. Give him a stretch of games this year and he’ll win you’ll over.

 

[SprDaVE]

World Junior showcase: Jake Sanderson looks NHL ready, Aatu Raty gets buzz; plus USA's projected roster

Roni Hirvonen, C, Toronto (Finland)
Hirvonen had a strong event as one of Finland’s leading players. He’s not the biggest or quickest player, but his skill, and in particular his vision and work ethic, were highlighted in the showcase. He makes a lot of quick, creative plays with the puck and plays in the hard areas despite his size. You’d like to see his game have more speed, but he looks like a strong prospect for Toronto given he’s shown well versus men.

Matthew Knies, LW, Toronto (United States)
Knies didn’t have some of the flashier plays in the camp like Bordeleau or Scott Morrow, but he was consistently effective for the USA. He’s a very skilled player who plays hard, and wins a lot of battles along the walls and net, while also creating with his skill. He’s not the most natural playmaker or most fluid skater, but he adds to a line with his size and compete, and he has enough offense to make a difference.

He also has Knies on the WJC team after this show case (and not Tyler Boucher).

 

[aingefan]

There is no reason to overcompensate. Lilly's projection and progression tells us how good he has been. I disagree on the lower IQ. His IQ is right up there with Sandin's. It's odd the mistakes Sandin made in the playoffs are what people criticize Liljegren for in lack of IQ. Sandin makes the same mistakes yet only Liljegren is criticized for lack of IQ.

They’re all ‘sh!t happens’ kind of mistakes that happen to all defencemen; Sandin’s was very very badly timed; Lili detractors being hyper attentive.
They’re both smart kids that need to play through the league a couple of times, Lili first.

 

[Stand Witness]

I hope Liljregen gets a long look early in the season so he has a chance to adapt to the NHL.

 

[Orfieus]

But that's just the thing isn't it. Liljegren has not performed well in the NHL. It's nice that he has played very well in the AHL and that he is capable of being a 1 or 2 D man in the AHL but it is a massive step up to the NHL. And from what I have seen the main concern in Liljegren's NHL games is that he is not processing the game at the NHL pace. That's everything. It does not matter what physical skills he has if he can't process the game fast enough and doesn't have the hockey IQ. I would be ecxtatic if he proves me wrong but I only see him as a bottom pair D maybe a #4 in the NHL.

Objectively not true and frankly it is hard to tell how well a player is with so few NHL games but if you want to make rash judgments this guy breaks down Liljegrens NHL performance and backs it up with video evidence

 

[ErnieLeafs]

It’s time to find out if Liljegren is going to have a future on our blueline. I know it’s dicey because of the pressure on the team and management to take the next step this year, but it’s time we know, for better or worse.

 

[Menzinger]

 

[fahad203]

I hope Liljregen gets a long look early in the season so he has a chance to adapt to the NHL.

He should be given every opportunity unless he can prove you otherwise
at some point he's gotta play. If you don't think he can play at least get that verfied

No reason why he can't fill in for Holl every 3 games

 

[stickty111]

Kid is thick

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

If Liljegren doesn't at least start the season with the Leafs, it's a missed opportunity. He's clearly ready for a shot at the NHL

 

[zeke]

Kid is thick

 

[stickty111]

If Liljegren doesn't at least start the season with the Leafs, it's a missed opportunity. He's clearly ready for a shot at the NHL

If he has a good camp, he should be on the team even if it's as a 7th d man. I think we might be past the point of "it's better for him to play big minutes in the AHL" stage. Also neither of Dermott and Sandin should be guaranteed on the 3rd pairing.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

If he has a good camp, he should be on the team even if it's as a 7th d man. I think we might be past the point of "it's better for him to play big minutes in the AHL" stage. Also neither of Dermott and Sandin should be guaranteed on the 3rd pairing.

From what things look like now, I'd go with Muzzin-Liljegren on the second pairing and Sandin/Dermott-Holl on the 3rd pairing. Liljegren has been better than Holl ever was at the AHL level, and deserves a chance to prove he can be better at the NHL level too

 

[aingefan]

If he has a good camp, he should be on the team even if it's as a 7th d man. I think we might be past the point of "it's better for him to play big minutes in the AHL" stage. Also neither of Dermott and Sandin should be guaranteed on the 3rd pairing.

I think it makes sense for Lili and Dermott to get a legit crack and let Sandin get some more reps in the A.

Unless Reilly gets dealt or something.

Lili is ready.

 

[stickty111]

From what things look like now, I'd go with Muzzin-Liljegren on the second pairing and Sandin/Dermott-Holl on the 3rd pairing. Liljegren has been better than Holl ever was at the AHL level, and deserves a chance to prove he can be better at the NHL level too

Yup it's not a bad option. I would try it in pre season for sure. Plus it's not like you have to use him on the PK if you don't want too. You can still put Holl there, but have Lilly-Muzzin as a pair at ES.

 

[stickty111]

I think it makes sense for Lili and Dermott to get a legit crack and let Sandin get some more reps in the A.

Unless Reilly gets dealt or something.

Lili is ready.

Honestly all 3 should be there. You can run a rotation and then give more games based on who is performing.

 

[Stonehands1990]

Honestly all 3 should be there. You can run a rotation and then give more games based on who is performing.

I’m all for the rotation. I’d even consider Holl part of the rotation. 7 D on the roster, Muzzin, Rielly & Brodie in each night with 3 of Holl, Dermott, Liljegren & Sandin