Value of: Marco Rossi

[thestonedkoala]

I think Guerin wants a bigger guy who gets into barfights in his off time.

And chews glass and kicks puppies.

 

[KaprizovSaveUs]

Hayton is 1 year older than Rossi and likely more runway in terms of development when you look at body type. Rossi was as close to a finished product physically as a player gets coming out of jr.

I personally dont think there is a big gap. Rossi got passed by Hartman and Gaudreau come playoff time. I am not sure that happens to Hayton.

Anyways we will see but as a neutral fan and outsider I think this is a framing of a deal that makes sense if Guerin is hell bent on moving Rossi.

I don't personally think there's much of a gap between Hayton and Rossi even though the 23yo 60 point center is a lot sexier of an asset than the 24 year old 40 point center, but optically I still think he needs to return quite a bit more for me to be comfortable trading him. I really don't agree with the bolded either, btw. He missed a full year and a half of training and it's unbelievable the strides he's made as a player since juniors. You really are out of your depth on this one.

 

[KaprizovSaveUs]

I'm still not crossing off traded for picks. It's clean, it buys time, and it could be a boat!

It could even be a Rossi!

I think futures is the most likely outcome... give Guerin a 15Mish to play with this offseason and more assets that could be used at the deadline / provide surplus value on a rookie deal. My favorite option is still Hage + from MTL.

 

[KaprizovSaveUs]

I was actually in the middle of typing up why I'd take Hayton over Rossi, but then took a glance at Rossi's underlying numbers and realized he just as good as Hayton is defensively.

I'm honestly really surprised someone like him is available at his age + production, is it because he's just small?

I don't think this is completely it. Kaprizov is small, Zuccarello is small. If he could bring Brayden point in, I'm sure he would in a heartbeat. Being small isn't the issue, it's that he's small, not an amazing skater, not a physical player, and ,while he competes hard, he doesn't win a lot of 50/50 battles. He's a very smart offensive player though and usually defensively responsible. I just think he doesn't play "hard" enough for Guerin.

 

[Gregor Samsa]

Foerster or Brink as a base for a trade to the Flyers?

 

[57special]

I don't think this is completely it. Kaprizov is small, Zuccarello is small. If he could bring Brayden point in, I'm sure he would in a heartbeat. Being small isn't the issue, it's that he's small, not an amazing skater, not a physical player, and ,while he competes hard, he doesn't win a lot of 50/50 battles. He's a very smart offensive player though and usually defensively responsible. I just think he doesn't play "hard" enough for Guerin.

I also think that Rossi's devout Christianity is not Guerin's speed, even though Rossi keeps it to himself. One other thing we don't know is how much the contract negotiations are affecting Guerin's view of Rossi.

Again, I'm pretty mystified about their supposed need to move the only legit, young offensive C in the entire Wild system. They've got JEE, Hartman, Gaudreau as defensive, grindy types, albeit of varying talent levels, and picked Stramel as a 1st rounder to also be a depth, grindy, "size" guy.
Bankier and Haight are C prospects who are looking just ok in the AHL. Yurov is a nice C prospect, but didn't set the KHL on fire by any means. Heidt has been vg in the WHL, but it's a long way from there to being a legit top 6, offensive C.

 

[AKL]

Foerster or Brink as a base for a trade to the Flyers?

I really hope not

 

[Kshahdoo]

Foerster or Brink as a base for a trade to the Flyers?

I think it's better to trade TK than young guys. Or trade nobody and tank. I'm just afraid that with Michkov improving and new coach tank can turn into helicopter. So trading TK could save the team from that transformation and increase chances to get McKenna.

 

[57special]

Foerster or Brink as a base for a trade to the Flyers?

Certainly not Brink, who is smaller than Rossi and doesn't play C. Foerster is bigger, but has far less production than Rossi, and is a winger.

 

[Kshahdoo]

Certainly not Brink, who is smaller than Rossi and doesn't play C. Foerster is bigger, but has far less production than Rossi, and is a winger.

Foerster really improved in the second half of the season. I mean he scored 18 points in 25 games after 4Nation. And he's 6'2.

 

[57special]

Foerster really improved in the second half of the season.

And will have to improve a hell fo a lot more the reach Rossi's level. Again, not a C, which is a more difficult position to fill.

 

[AKL]

Foerster really improved in the second half of the season. I mean he scored 18 points in 25 games after 4Nation. And he's 6'2.

Has he learned how to skate yet?

 

[Kshahdoo]

And will have to improve a hell fo a lot more the reach Rossi's level. Again, not a C, which is a more difficult position to fill.

Rossi scored 13 points in 26 games after 4 Nation, Foerster did much better.

 

[Kshahdoo]

Has he learned how to skate yet?

I don't remember any problems with his skating. He doesn't skate as good as Tippett, but you don't like Tip anyway.

Foerster has good IQ and size.

 

[AKL]

Rossi scored 13 points in 26 games after 4 Nation, Foerster did much better.

Eh. 18 in 25 isn't that much better than 13 in 26 considering Rossi was injured for most of that and the entire team couldn't score without two of their better players.

Foerster's hot streak was pacing for less than Rossi actually scored on the season.

 

[Kshahdoo]

Has he learned how to skate yet?

 

[AKL]

Okay, looks like he's probably an average skater at the NHL level now, that's good.

 

[Kshahdoo]

Okay, looks like he's probably an average skater at the NHL level now, that's good.

He's really good in front of the net, uses his size well. Guerin will love it for sure.

 

[AKL]

He's really good in front of the net, uses his size well. Guerin will love it for sure.

You're probably right.

 

[bert]

I don't personally think there's much of a gap between Hayton and Rossi even though the 23yo 60 point center is a lot sexier of an asset than the 24 year old 40 point center, but optically I still think he needs to return quite a bit more for me to be comfortable trading him. I really don't agree with the bolded either, btw. He missed a full year and a half of training and it's unbelievable the strides he's made as a player since juniors. You really are out of your depth on this one.

Ive been following the player alot longer than you have I can all but guarantee it I even ran video of his team in jr. So no im not out of my depth. He is a small player with terrific compete level, great hockey sense. But he is held back by his physical abilities maybe more than any player in the league. Its a testament to how hard of a work he is and his hockey sense. But he is not fast and he is very small. You are clearly tied to the player due to your fandom which is fine but again there is a reason he is on the block. You can acknowledge why and we can have a productive conversation or you can go this route. Up to you, but so far this has been a realistic and productive chat with other posters in this thread. I am well aware of his unfortunate health struggles and his come back has been nothing short of remarkable. However he is very limited on his upside due to the fact he isnt a burner and is very undersized. Which is why he was moved down the lineup and why there is even this thread.

Hayton had 20 goals and 46 points playing on the 2nd PP on a team that didnt have much elite skill and Hayton rarely played with it. Rossi was first PP and spent alot of time with a top 5/10 player in the league. Rossi had 62 points. I am skeptical if he ever hits that number again given the fact he probably doesnt get these types of opportunities again on another team. Small forwards specifically tend to hit their peak earlier than almost any other position. I believe Rossi is close to his and this is what his max projection in terms of production was at the time of his draft as again he is limited by his physical attributes. That doesnt mean he is a bad player, I think he is a solid player but Guerin and most NHL gm's want size and or speed down the middle. Which again is why this thread exists.

All that being said I think that yes Utah would certainly add in a deal with Hayton. I think there will be suitors but I think the wild might be dissapointed in the type of immediate return they would get for him. Utah is a good target because the coaching staff is familiar with Rossi.

 

[AKL]

elite skill and Hayton rarely played with it.

This isn't true

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Ive been following the player alot longer than you have I can all but guarantee it I even ran video of his team in jr. So no im not out of my depth. He is a small player with terrific compete level, great hockey sense. But he is held back by his physical abilities maybe more than any player in the league. Its a testament to how hard of a work he is and his hockey sense. But he is not fast and he is very small. You are clearly tied to the player due to your fandom which is fine but again there is a reason he is on the block. You can acknowledge why and we can have a productive conversation or you can go this route. Up to you, but so far this has been a realistic and productive chat with other posters in this thread. I am well aware of his unfortunate health struggles and his come back has been nothing short of remarkable. However he is very limited on his upside due to the fact he isnt a burner and is very undersized. Which is why he was moved down the lineup and why there is even this thread.

Hayton had 20 goals and 46 points playing on the 2nd PP on a team that didnt have much elite skill and Hayton rarely played with it. Rossi was first PP and spent alot of time with a top 5/10 player in the league. Rossi had 62 points. I am skeptical if he ever hits that number again given the fact he probably doesnt get these types of opportunities again on another team. Small forwards specifically tend to hit their peak earlier than almost any other position. I believe Rossi is close to his and this is what his max projection in terms of production was at the time of his draft as again he is limited by his physical attributes. That doesnt mean he is a bad player, I think he is a solid player but Guerin and most NHL gm's want size and or speed down the middle. Which again is why this thread exists.

All that being said I think that yes Utah would certainly add in a deal with Hayton. I think there will be suitors but I think the wild might be dissapointed in the type of immediate return they would get for him. Utah is a good target because the coaching staff is familiar with Rossi.

If you're the team trading for Rossi aren't you really looking at him as a wing? I know when he is thrown around on our board that is how I view the fit. His size and skating make me dubious of a long-term center role. Get him out of the areas where his reach and speed are a detriment and free him up to play down low taking punishment with his incredible lower body strength and where his lack of physical gifts for defensive coverage is less impactful.

 

[KaprizovSaveUs]

Ive been following the player alot longer than you have I can all but guarantee it I even ran video of his team in jr. So no im not out of my depth. He is a small player with terrific compete level, great hockey sense. But he is held back by his physical abilities maybe more than any player in the league. Its a testament to how hard of a work he is and his hockey sense. But he is not fast and he is very small. You are clearly tied to the player due to your fandom which is fine but again there is a reason he is on the block. You can acknowledge why and we can have a productive conversation or you can go this route. Up to you, but so far this has been a realistic and productive chat with other posters in this thread. I am well aware of his unfortunate health struggles and his come back has been nothing short of remarkable. However he is very limited on his upside due to the fact he isnt a burner and is very undersized. Which is why he was moved down the lineup and why there is even this thread.

Hayton had 20 goals and 46 points playing on the 2nd PP on a team that didnt have much elite skill and Hayton rarely played with it. Rossi was first PP and spent alot of time with a top 5/10 player in the league. Rossi had 62 points. I am skeptical if he ever hits that number again given the fact he probably doesnt get these types of opportunities again on another team. Small forwards specifically tend to hit their peak earlier than almost any other position. I believe Rossi is close to his and this is what his max projection in terms of production was at the time of his draft as again he is limited by his physical attributes. That doesnt mean he is a bad player, I think he is a solid player but Guerin and most NHL gm's want size and or speed down the middle. Which again is why this thread exists.

All that being said I think that yes Utah would certainly add in a deal with Hayton. I think there will be suitors but I think the wild might be dissapointed in the type of immediate return they would get for him. Utah is a good target because the coaching staff is familiar with Rossi.

Still debating if I want to read the rest of your nonsense after this. I'm not tied to the player. My preference is to move him, and I even said I don't think he's a much better player than Hayton. You may have followed him a lot up until he was drafted, but saying he was a mostly finished product is all I needed to read to know you haven't followed him much after. Hence why I said you're out of your depth.

 

[AKL]

Still debating if I want to read the rest of your nonsense after this.

It's kind of just a lot of misrepresentations, lies, and questionable opinions. I wouldn't.

 

[Sota Popinski]

Hayton is 1 year older than Rossi and likely more runway in terms of development when you look at body type. Rossi was as close to a finished product physically as a player gets coming out of jr.

I personally dont think there is a big gap. Rossi got passed by Hartman and Gaudreau come playoff time. I am not sure that happens to Hayton.

Anyways we will see but as a neutral fan and outsider I think this is a framing of a deal that makes sense if Guerin is hell bent on moving Rossi.

Rossi is younger and better but Hayton is close in value because he's taller? And has more runway even though he's older? Neither of those arguments make any sense