Value of: Make Your Proposal for Sean Monahan

[FLpanthers16]

He really struggled defending against his peers at the WJHC. If we're targeting a young prospect defenseman for the Rangers it should be Miller.

Struggled? He was one of the guys that stood out the most in a good way on that team.

 

[Double Dion]

Struggled? He was one of the guys that stood out the most in a good way on that team.

No he definitely didn't. Watch the game against Russia. He's directly responsible for 2 goals against and another 2 grade A scoring chances. Struggled against Finland too.

 

[TBF1972]

Link?

i don't have a current example. but fan bases all over the place overrate their players and prospects, especially in trade proposals to a degree, you could believe they have 5 #1C (prospects) in their system.

 

[HyPnOtiK]

Yes it very much does. Monahan isn’t existent defensively and had a very bad year.

It very much doesn't. On no planet is Danault as good as Monahan, this Monahan trashing on this post has gone overboard.

 

[Flamesfan62]

It very much doesn't. On no planet is Danault as good as Monahan, this Monahan trashing on this post has gone overboard

It’s much closer than you’d think, if you look at the advanced stats.

 

[Double Dion]

i don't have a current example. but fan bases all over the place overrate their players and prospects, especially in trade proposals to a degree, you could believe they have 5 #1C (prospects) in their system.

This is true. We tend to think of a players ceiling, but very few of them reach it. I kind of look at it as who is a lock to be a top 4 defenseman or top 6 forward. The Flames have one of those in their system in Valimaki. Guys like Zary and Pelletier might have that ceiling but they might not reach it. Even some of the guys you think are locks don't work out. I was so sure Baertschi would be a top 6 player and he's not in the league right now.

 

[Double Dion]

It’s much closer than you’d think, if you look at the advanced stats.

Danault is like Backlund. He might help you win more than Monahan, but he won't have the same trade value. I think the issue is we already have Backlund, Lindholm and to a lesser extent Ryan and Bennett who play the 200 foot possession game. We don't have a need for another player like that. The Oilers should be going after that type of player not the Flames.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

It’s much closer than you’d think, if you look at the advanced stats.

This is where the problem lies. Advanced stats don't paint a whole picture, as someone who looks at them quite a lot I know that you can only rely on them so much. Danault is a bona fide 2nd line shut down center who ideally would play a 3C role on a championship team, Backlund and Pageau are very similar players. Neither Backlund or Pageau are considered better than Monahan, otherwise Backlund would be the 1C and Pageau wouldn't be a 3C in New York behind Brock Nelson. Earlier you said Monahan is nonexistent defensively as well, which is just false. He is actually quite smart defensively just often lacks the foot speed. Also he has multiple other centers on the team who are mostly known for how strong their defensive game is. Demotion by promotion basically.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

It very much doesn't. On no planet is Danault as good as Monahan, this Monahan trashing on this post has gone overboard.

Danault is much better than Monahan.

 

[McJedi]

I've criticized Monahan plenty for the things he needs to improve on but this thread is full of people offering spare parts for a 26 year old career 60 point center like they grow on trees. One bad year does not mean he will get dealt for these garbage packages. None of these offers will get you Monahan. Some of them wouldn't even get you Bennett.

Instead of fussing at opposing fans for not wowing you with offers for Monahan, how about you Flames make the rest of us proposals you’d accept and that make sense value wise. Pick a team and come up with a package.

 

[Hockeyholic]

Monahan & Kylington for Barzal.

 

[Mazatt]

Instead of fussing at opposing fans for not wowing you with offers for Monahan, how about you Flames make the rest of us proposals you’d accept and that make sense value wise. Pick a team and come up with a package.

Possibly the dumbest idea I've ever heard.

"Make your proposal for Monahan"

"Why aren't you coming in with what you want for Monahan???"

The entire point of value threads is for fans of other teams to discuss what they would be willing to give up, and others are intended to respond on that value. You shouldn't expect fans to pick a random team to sell off Monahan to lmao. Like, the purpose is that other teams are making proposals. And people making shitty proposals doesn't change that.

 

[McJedi]

Possibly the dumbest idea I've ever heard.

"Make your proposal for Monahan"

"Why aren't you coming in with what you want for Monahan???"

The entire point of value threads is for fans of other teams to discuss what they would be willing to give up, and others are intended to respond on that value. You shouldn't expect fans to pick a random team to sell off Monahan to lmao. Like, the purpose is that other teams are making proposals. And people making shitty proposals doesn't change that.

you get proposals and you have hissy fits because it turns out other fans don’t over value him. And then you guys whine about how you don’t like the offers you solicited. Sounds like how 4 year olds behave.
“Make me an offer for someone I want to trade.” Reads offers. “Oh I hate it. I just hate it so.”

since the OP wants to get rid of Monahan, propose a trade you’d do. Target someone and make Monahan part of the deal. That’s more productive than bemoaning the responses.

 

[Mazatt]

you get proposals and you have hissy fits because it turns out other fans don’t over value him. And then you guys whine about how you don’t like the offers you solicited. Sounds like how 4 year olds behave.
“Make me an offer for someone I want to trade.” Reads offers. “Oh I hate it. I just hate it so.”

since the OP wants to get rid of Monahan, propose a trade you’d do. Target someone and make Monahan part of the deal. That’s more productive than bemoaning the responses.

I feel like you still don't understand the purpose of this thread. In no way is the onus on Flames fans to determine a random team to pick a fair package from and decide it all on their own, it is for incoming offers of teams who want Monahan. I also feel like you don't understand why Monahan would be traded. It's to shakeup the core of the team and get a new look headed into next season, not because he's trash or whatever people on here want you to believe.

Personally I don't want to trade Monahan and I don't have the knowledge of 30 other teams to guess at what they would be willing/what I would want from them. You keep crying about how he 'bemoans' the responses yet spend your time... bemoaning his responses? Figure it out

 

[McJedi]

I feel like you still don't understand the purpose of this thread. In no way is the onus on Flames fans to determine a random team to pick a fair package from and decide it all on their own, it is for incoming offers of teams who want Monahan. I also feel like you don't understand why Monahan would be traded. It's to shakeup the core of the team and get a new look headed into next season, not because he's trash or whatever people on here want you to believe.

Personally I don't want to trade Monahan and I don't have the knowledge of 30 other teams to guess at what they would be willing/what I would want from them. You keep crying about how he 'bemoans' the responses yet spend your time... bemoaning his responses? Figure it out

So OP wants to shake up his team and trade Monahan. So he puts out feelers for interest. This isn’t trading from a position of strength. It’s a shake up move driven by Calgary’s desire to change their top 6. . No one called on this player. They were asked. So some responded.

And you all have hissy fits you don’t like what is offered. That’s on you guys. Clearly he’s worth less to other teams. Deal with with. Keep your player or bite the bullet and shake up your roster with a deal that doesn’t check off all the boxes. There isn’t an offer out there that will.

what’s beyond apparent to everyone but Flames fans is that no one is going to respond to a Flames call for offers on a player they want to move by blowing you away.

It’s pointless to respond when Calgary will be petulant and say in their worst Veruca Salt voice, “I wanted offers, but not those offers. I want better offers and I want them now”.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

So OP wants to shake up his team and trade Monahan. So he puts out feelers for interest. This isn’t trading from a position of strength. It’s a shake up move driven by Calgary’s desire to change their top 6. . No one called on this player. They were asked. So some responded.

And you all have hissy fits you don’t like what is offered. That’s on you guys. Clearly he’s worth less to other teams. Deal with with. Keep your player or bite the bullet and shake up your roster with a deal that doesn’t check off all the boxes. There isn’t an offer out there that will.

what’s beyond apparent to everyone but Flames fans is that no one is going to respond to a Flames call for offers on a player they want to move by blowing you away.

It’s pointless to respond when Calgary will be petulant and say in their worst Veruca Salt voice, “I wanted offers, but not those offers. I want better offers and I want them now”.

This doesn't really make sense, 1 Flames fan doesn't speak for the entire fan base let alone the team owners and management. It is pretty clear with the Markstrom signing they intend to stick with Monahan and are not frantically trying to move him like you are implying. There are a select few fans who complain because they can't grasp the concept of team economics, or that no other team is going to purposely downgrade from their 1C position for a couple depth pieces. Literally the 2nd post of this thread by me was this:

What? Why? Trading Monahan and not packaging on other assets to upgrade to a better 1C is stupid. The team doesn't have any replacements for him and they just spent a lot in FA to signify they aren't planning on rebuilding either. There is no legitimate return out there for him since no one is going to offer a better 1C and he can't be replaced internally. Every single offer here is going to be horrible.

 

[Mazatt]

And you all have hissy fits you don’t like what is offered

Oop, I forgot that these Flames fans speak for me, damn, or that they speak for all Flames fans. I should remember that for next time.

I'd give this a genuine 'response' but it's pretty clear you are finding any way possible to justify going off the way you are. News flash: The Flames fans here saying that you can't get Monahan for a collection of bad to mediocre pieces aren't 'throwing hissy fits', they are just saying that those deals do nothing to help the Flames because it fits none of their needs and isn't enough. Like, what the f*** else do you expect from a thread asking the value of a trade, people to accept less value or not discuss value? But you clearly aren't even reading what I say at this point, you have this tangent planned out and anything I say is getting glossed over.

 

[McJedi]

Oop, I forgot that these Flames fans speak for me, damn, or that they speak for all Flames fans. I should remember that for next time.

I'd give this a genuine 'response' but it's pretty clear you are finding any way possible to justify going off the way you are. News flash: The Flames fans here saying that you can't get Monahan for a collection of bad to mediocre pieces aren't 'throwing hissy fits', they are just saying that those deals do nothing to help the Flames because it fits none of their needs and isn't enough. Like, what the f*** else do you expect from a thread asking the value of a trade, people to accept less value or not discuss value? But you clearly aren't even reading what I say at this point, you have this tangent planned out and anything I say is getting glossed over.

Here’s the truth. You can’t trade Monahan and be happy about it. He’s not that valuable. He’s more valuable to Calgary than anyone else. You can’t package him with someone like Hanafin (who also isn’t very valuable) and get a big upgrade. That doesn’t get you an Barkov. It doesn’t get your foot in the door or into the same time zone.

Asking for offers on Monahan and then expecting to get good ones was and is a fools errand. Ditto Hanafin. These two are not desired. You want to be blown away, put Tkachuk out there. Want to be underwhelmed, put Monahan for sale. Having hissy fits others respond to a flawed premise without over valuing Monahan is not on us. It’s on you guys for misjudging this player’s value to the rest of the league. Sean Monahan is a 2C to most of teams. He’s not someone that is involved in a blockbuster. He’s someone involved in a deal like Kadri for Tyson Berry. That’s more his trade tier.

 

[Patagonia]

Oop, I forgot that these Flames fans speak for me, damn, or that they speak for all Flames fans. I should remember that for next time.

I'd give this a genuine 'response' but it's pretty clear you are finding any way possible to justify going off the way you are. News flash: The Flames fans here saying that you can't get Monahan for a collection of bad to mediocre pieces aren't 'throwing hissy fits', they are just saying that those deals do nothing to help the Flames because it fits none of their needs and isn't enough. Like, what the f*** else do you expect from a thread asking the value of a trade, people to accept less value or not discuss value? But you clearly aren't even reading what I say at this point, you have this tangent planned out and anything I say is getting glossed over.

Monahan would be extremely difficult to move the $6.375M per in a flat cap and another down season. CGY should expect a cap neutral swap before prospects are involved.

AVs offer 5 for 1:

Compher
Donskoi
Timmins
Bowers
Kaut

Flames add more grit into their Forwards. Prospects including a high end RHD (injury prone) and 2 former 1st round picks.

 

[topshelf15]

He likely gets traded in the next two seasons,as I cant see the Flames giving him another long term deal...

 

[AirGut]

To NYR: 1st, Ryan, Rittich

To CGY: Zibanejad

Let's be honest here Monahan's value is not nearly as high as Zibanejad's. Chytil and DeAngelo/Nils is pretty much considered an overpay for a guy like Monahan. But I would do it no question because I think he's a good fit at 2C for us long term.

 

[McJedi]

Let's be honest here Monahan's value is not nearly as high as Zibanejad's. Chytil and DeAngelo/Nils is pretty much considered an overpay for a guy like Monahan. But I would do it no question because I think he's a good fit at 2C for us long term.

That’s what the Flames fans that expect huge value for this guy completely miss.

He’s a 2C, not a 1C, to most teams.

He’s a 2C to 100% of the teams that would want to trade for him. So they get 2C value and burst into a tears about it.

just keep the guy. He’s a low end 1C for the Flames. Which makes him most valuable to.... the Flames.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Let's be honest here Monahan's value is not nearly as high as Zibanejad's. Chytil and DeAngelo/Nils is pretty much considered an overpay for a guy like Monahan. But I would do it no question because I think he's a good fit at 2C for us long term.

That counter offer was ridiculed by a handful of flames fans shortly after. We know it was bad and the poster admitted it was way off the mark too.

As for the original offer, I dont hate it but probably wouldnt do it

 

[McJedi]

Monahan would be extremely difficult to move the $6.375M per in a flat cap and another down season. CGY should expect a cap neutral swap before prospects are involved.

AVs offer 5 for 1:

Compher
Donskoi
Timmins
Bowers
Kaut

Flames add more grit into their Forwards. Prospects including a high end RHD (injury prone) and 2 former 1st round picks.

Avs don’t need him. You don’t play a Kadri or Monahan at 3C. That’s a waste of resources that leaves big holes elsewhere in your roster. Here. The Avs pipeline. If our 3rd line was consistently losing the Avs games (they don’t).

 

[Double Dion]

Let's be honest here Monahan's value is not nearly as high as Zibanejad's. Chytil and DeAngelo/Nils is pretty much considered an overpay for a guy like Monahan. But I would do it no question because I think he's a good fit at 2C for us long term.

It was sarcasm, not a serious proposal. I'd want Buchnevich, Miller and a pick back for Monahan if we had to move him. No interest in DeAngelo.