LW Patrik Laine - Tappara, Liiga (2016, 2nd, WPG) XII

[MardyBum]

Kessel was a nearly 40 goal PPG player practically by himself for years and people are scoffing at Laine being compared to him.

The hype is going to kill him.

Yes, the hype on some random message board is going to kill him.

 

[vaiski]

Definitely, if he was one-dimensional there's no way Marjamäki would've picked him to be in the World Cup

Not that I disgree with Laine bringing more than just his shot to the table, but there was a quote from Marjamäki, I think after the Kärpät-Tappara series, that Laine has to be considered for the WC team even if just on a PP specialist role. So basically Marjamäki thought that his shot was that good.

 

[ps241]

Not that I disgree with Laine bringing more than just his shot to the table, but there was a quote from Marjamäki, I think after the Kärpät-Tappara series, that Laine has to be considered for the WC team even if just on a PP specialist role. So basically Marjamäki thought that his shot was that good.

That makes sense really. It doesn't mean he won't be used in an expanded role but it's hard to turn away from that PP asset.

 

[teravaineSAROS]

Not that I disgree with Laine bringing more than just his shot to the table, but there was a quote from Marjamäki, I think after the Kärpät-Tappara series, that Laine has to be considered for the WC team even if just on a PP specialist role. So basically Marjamäki thought that his shot was that good.

I stand corrected

 

[ijuka]

Kessel was “The American Crosby” the year before his draft and some were even arguing whether they’d take him over Crosby himself! HAHA

NCAA scoring as u-19 was pretty good but nowhere near Eichel for example. International performance overall alright but outdone by Laine in every way apart from u-18s as u-18 which Laine didn't attend(Attended WHCs).

And him being considered the "American Crosby"... I don't think anyone but his mom thought that.

Kessel was a nearly 40 goal PPG player practically by himself for years and people are scoffing at Laine being compared to him.

The hype is going to kill him.

He was a PPG player for 3 seasons, 5 years after he was drafted, at the age of 24-26. I do expect Laine to do better, yes. Kessel had 29 PPG during his rookie season and 37 in the one after that, while being a season ahead of Laine due to being a late birthday.

Oh, and I'm talking about Kessel pre-draft in comparison to Laine. When we for instance look at international competition, Kessel gets outscored by Laine in every equivalent tournament. The only one where he doesn't is u-18s as u-18, which Laine didn't attend(Was busy being playoff MVP).

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Kessel was very highly thought of. Yeah, people knew he'd score goals.

Kessel was a nearly 40 goal PPG player practically by himself for years and people are scoffing at Laine being compared to him.

The hype is going to kill him.

Kessel never scored more than 37 goals in a season. If I had a penny for everytime people referred to him as a 40 goal scorer, I would be a millionaire.

Saying that, I do not see any resemblance to Laine at all. Kessel is not a potential Rocket Richard winner as Laine is expected to be one day. If this not evident before, it certainly is now after 10 NHL seasons.

 

[TMLife*]

And him being considered the "American Crosby"... I don't think anyone but his mom thought that.

Well, it wouldn’t be the first time you were wrong. Did you just start following the NHL in the last 3 years or something?

Quote from here:

"Crosby and Kessel are both different players. One’s a winger, one’s a center. One plays with pace and a cerebral knowledge of the game. The other uses his speed and goal scoring ability to be effective. But they both share a common bond. Kessel, for a period in his youth, was the American version of Crosby – a hockey wunderkind with exceptional skill at a young age."

If you want more sources, I’ll be glad to dig some up.

 

[ijuka]

Well, it wouldn’t be the first time you were wrong. Did you just start following the NHL in the last 3 years or something?

Quote from here:

"Crosby and Kessel are both different players. One’s a winger, one’s a center. One plays with pace and a cerebral knowledge of the game. The other uses his speed and goal scoring ability to be effective. But they both share a common bond. Kessel, for a period in his youth, was the American version of Crosby – a hockey wunderkind with exceptional skill at a young age."

If you want more sources, I’ll be glad to dig some up.

It was a reference to Kessel's mom allegedly repeatedly badmouthing Sidney Crosby.

You quoted something to hype them becoming teammates. How about a scouting report from 2003 or something?

 

[Gavy]

Kessel never scored more than 37 goals in a season. If I had a penny for everytime people referred to him as a 40 goal scorer, I would be a millionaire.

Saying that, I do not see any resemblance to Laine at all. Kessel is not a potential Rocket Richard winner as Laine is expected to be one day. If this not evident before, it certainly is now after 10 NHL seasons.

He said NEARLY.

 

[Liminality]

And him being considered the "American Crosby"... I don't think anyone but his mom thought that.

It's true.

http://www.iihf.com/fileadmin/user_upload/PDF/The_IIHF/IIHF_Vol9No5.pdf

"Neighbour and rival, USA, is expected to vie for the gold
medal and is bringing along Phil Kessel, whom
many consider to be America's answer to Sidney
Crosby"

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/hockey/juniors/2005-12-21-kessel-focus_x.htm

"One of his former U.S. coaches, David Quinn, has said Kessel could be the USA's Sidney Crosby."

 

[93LEAFS]

NCAA scoring as u-19 was pretty good but nowhere near Eichel for example. International performance overall alright but outdone by Laine in every way apart from u-18s as u-18 which Laine didn't attend(Attended WHCs).

And him being considered the "American Crosby"... I don't think anyone but his mom thought that.



He was a PPG player for 3 seasons, 5 years after he was drafted, at the age of 24-26. I do expect Laine to do better, yes. Kessel had 29 PPG during his rookie season and 37 in the one after that, while being a season ahead of Laine due to being a late birthday.

Oh, and I'm talking about Kessel pre-draft in comparison to Laine. When we for instance look at international competition, Kessel gets outscored by Laine in every equivalent tournament. The only one where he doesn't is u-18s as u-18, which Laine didn't attend(Was busy being playoff MVP).

As someone who constantly points out the age gaps, the Kessel hype for challenging Crosby came on the back of his two USNDP years (before he stepped foot on University of Minnesota's campus) he was re-writing the record book there. He obviously slipped in his draft year due to playing for a dysfunctional team and coach. He never lived up to that initial hype, but it was there. If Kessel was entered into the draft in his 17-year-old year he would have gone 2nd behind Crosby, and it would have been the exact same as the McDavid/Eichel debate.

 

[QnebO]

It's kind of odd thinking that there's an 18 year old kid playing in the Finnish World Cup squad. Not that the country has ever managed to produce a lineup that'd be anywhere as good as lets say Canada, but still they've reached to some medals anyway. Such a fun way to start the hockey season!

It really is remarkable even in Finnish NT. He produced enough points and +- in Scoda Cup so they had all the hype and stats and scouting to make the pick.

And people love it, and Hockey is peoples game.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Well, it wouldn’t be the first time you were wrong. Did you just start following the NHL in the last 3 years or something?

Quote from here:

"Crosby and Kessel are both different players. One’s a winger, one’s a center. One plays with pace and a cerebral knowledge of the game. The other uses his speed and goal scoring ability to be effective. But they both share a common bond. Kessel, for a period in his youth, was the American version of Crosby – a hockey wunderkind with exceptional skill at a young age."

If you want more sources, I’ll be glad to dig some up.

That was for only a short time. And it was probably on a comparison of skill, which Kessel would still be considered one of the best skill wise in the NHL. Kessel's stock began to fall his draft year with his showing at the WJC, and his supposed character concerns. Regardless, I don't know what this has to do with Laine in a Laine thread.

If one can make the claim Laine is somewhat hyped, and what highly regarded draft pick of his ilk is not. Let's get that right atleast. It's for his goal scoring, if one truly believes he cannot be a future Rocket Richard winner. I'd like to hear reasons why not. I don't see this as an outlandish statement, Laine has the potential to be the best goal scorer of his generation.

 

[TMLife*]

That was for only a short time. And it was probably on a comparison of skill, which Kessel would still be considered one of the best skill wise in the NHL. Kessel's stock began to fall his draft year with his showing at the WJC, and his supposed character concerns. Regardless, I don't know what this has to do with Laine in a Laine thread.

Well, how long has Laine’s hype been going on? The answer is a lot shorter than Kessel’s...

And yes it was a comparison of skill, what else would we be comparing? Interview skills?

I like how you bring up character concerns when some here (not myself) bring questions about Laine’s character...

And this is in a Laine thread because a Finnish poster started it:

Realistically, I'm expecting below 20 goals. Seguin, Kessel and Stamkos had similar goalscoring expectations and they didn't exactly come storming out of the gates. Add to that the settling period Laine has through going from European hockey culture to North American. If Jets have any playoff aspirations, they won't let Laine play big 5vs5 minutes he needs to score 30+ goals.

Which led to one of ijuka’s typical responses citing a minuscule sample size and extreme bias:

Oh, they expected Kessel to score in a similar way when he had 1+1=2 in 7 gp at WHCs as u-19 when Laine had 7+5=12 in 10 gp at WHCs as u-18?

I expect Laine to score better than Kessel, though.

And here we are

 

[The Winter Soldier]

That makes sense really. It doesn't mean he won't be used in an expanded role but it's hard to turn away from that PP asset.

I am excited to see how the Jets deploy Laine this year. I see him with Perrault to start out this year.

To me it would be exciting to see a 3rd line of Ehlers on the Right wing, Perrault at Center, and Laine on the Left Wing.

I know most have Ehlers pencilled in higher. But this line potentially would be a line that could be one of the better ones as 3rd lines go.

 

[teravaineSAROS]

I am excited to see how the Jets deploy Laine this year. I see him with Perrault to start out this year.

To me it would be exciting to see a 3rd line of Ehlers on the Right wing, Perrault at Center, and Laine on the Left Wing.

I know most have Ehlers pencilled in higher. But this line potentially would be a line that could be one of the better ones as 3rd lines go.

3rd line? Jets forward group isn't that deep though, how would your first 2 lines look?

Ehlers will likely play right wing sooner or later, it's what he prefers anyway

 

[MardyBum]

As someone who constantly points out the age gaps, the Kessel hype for challenging Crosby came on the back of his two USNDP years (before he stepped foot on University of Minnesota's campus) he was re-writing the record book there. He obviously slipped in his draft year due to playing for a dysfunctional team and coach. He never lived up to that initial hype, but it was there. If Kessel was entered into the draft in his 17-year-old year he would have gone 2nd behind Crosby, and it would have been the exact same as the McDavid/Eichel debate.

So no debate?

 

[MardyBum]

3rd line? Jets forward group isn't that deep though, how would your first 2 lines look?

Ehlers will likely play right wing sooner or later, it's what he prefers anyway

Ehlers Scheifele Wheeler is #1 if Maurice wants to keep together the best Jets line of last year. Ehlers played some of his best hockey on the left.

Outside of Ehlers/Scheif/Wheeler/Little being top 6, no one can factually state they know where anyone else goes. Laine could be 2nd/3rd line, Stafford could be 2nd/3rd/traded, Connor could be 2nd/3rd/AHL, Perreault could be 2nd line W or third line C. Then there's Burmistrov, Copp, Lowry, Dano, Armia, Petan, Matthias, Thorburn., Lemieux

We have no idea until Maurice gives us one. All we have is this from April :

Paul Maurice had a warning for Winnipeg Jets fans who think the team’s playoff hopes were hurt by its youth movement this season

There could be more pain around the corner, the coach said Monday after exit meetings with players who will leave the city and the team’s disappointing 35-39-8 record behind them.

“I would like to see the best players make our team,†Maurice said. “And if they’re all young guys, they’re all young guys.

 

[teravaineSAROS]

Ehlers Scheifele Wheeler is #1 if Maurice wants to keep together the best Jets line of last year. Ehlers played some of his best hockey on the left.

Outside of Ehlers/Scheif/Wheeler/Little being top 6, no one can factually state they know where anyone else goes. Laine could be 2nd/3rd line, Stafford could be 2nd/3rd/traded, Connor could be 2nd/3rd/AHL, Perreault could be 2nd line W or third line C. Then there's Burmistrov, Copp, Lowry, Dano, Armia, Petan, Matthias, Thorburn., Lemieux

We have no idea until Maurice gives us one. All we have is this from April :

Yep I know I've been researching like crazy due to off-season

Was curious about what lines he in particular would consider as the top 2 lines in a case where Ehlers is on the 3rd

 

[MardyBum]

Yep I know I've been researching like crazy due to off-season

Was curious about what lines he in particular would consider as the top 2 lines in a case where Ehlers is on the 3rd

Ahh, just saw your post, missed reading the one you quoted. Thought you were questioning Laine on the third line, and mentioned Ehlers as a RW to make room for Laine. Didn't realize you were talking about Ehlers.

Whoops

 

[kyle o connor]

Yep I know I've been researching like crazy due to off-season

Was curious about what lines he in particular would consider as the top 2 lines in a case where Ehlers is on the 3rd

Stafford - Scheifele - Wheeler
Matthias/Armia/Connor - Little - Dano
Laine - Perreault - Ehlers
Matthias/Armia - Lowry - Scoreburn

I'm hoping Connor will just go to the A if he's not ready to play 14-17 mins a night instead of Petaning it on the 4th line.

 

[JetsHomer]

I don't want any of Stafford, Armia, Dano or Matthias playing top 6 minutes

 

[Daximus]

Stafford - Scheifele - Wheeler
Matthias/Armia/Connor - Little - Dano
Laine - Perreault - Ehlers
Matthias/Armia - Lowry - Scoreburn

I'm hoping Connor will just go to the A if he's not ready to play 14-17 mins a night instead of Petaning it on the 4th line.

Nor sure like those lines at all.

I'd prefer...

Laine - Scheifele - Ehlers
Connor - Little - Wheeler
Matthias - Perreault - Stafford
Dano - Lowry - Armia

Size, speed and skill on all lines in some form or another, especially the 1st line.

 

[ps241]

I don't want any of Stafford, Armia, Dano or Matthias playing top 6 minutes

12 months from now when Stafford is gone and we know how good Connor is going to be this gets allot easier to do. Stafford is quirky he needs to play on the right wing with good players that tilt the ice which seems to be a tough thing to work around. He is a decent scoring winger but he flounders on the left wing or seemingly with lesser talent.

 

[Flair Hay]

12 months from now when Staffird is gone and we know how good Connor is going to be this gets allot easier to do. Staffod is quirky he needs to play on the right wing with good players that tilt the ice which seems to be a tough thing to work around. He is a decent scoring winger but he flounders on the left wing or seemingly with lesser talent.

Stafford on Little's wing with Ehlers playing 3rd line with Perreault could definitely be for the greater good. Even if Ehlers is better than Stafford already.