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LW Grigori Denisenko (2018, 15th, FLA; claimed by VGK)

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Atas2000 said:
He is already 21 and he sucks. And he never dominated anywhere. And stop pretending like not producing in his D+4 year is expected of a once highly regarded 1st rounder.
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I have to agree.. I don't think Denisenko will amount to anything really special and I am a Florida Panther fan. I am hoping he starts spinning heads and amazing us if he ever gets a shot..

..but I doubt it.
 
Atas2000 said:
You are bending it a lot. You are depicting Mamin based on his current performance totally discarding his prospect status at draft day. And you are downplaying the expectations for Denisenko big time. With you it sounds like he was some 3rd rounder. He was a mid 1st round pick who can't make the NHL at 21.

Since when are mid 1st rounders "long term projects"?
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Mamin was drafted in the 6th Round at 21-years-old after playing two full KHL seasons. I can't fathom how somebody could compare Mamin and Denisenko's respective draft day prospect status.

At the draft, they literally said he was a long term prospect. Again, he was undersized, had a raw game, didn't speak a lick of English, and he had only played on international ice in a junior league.

He isn't in the NHL yet because of how loaded Florida is at forward. You'll notice that last year, at age 20, he played 7 games, had 4 assists (all even strength), put 6 shots on goal, laid 15 hits, blocked 2 shots, and had a 3:0 takeaway:giveaway ratio. In nearly every organization in the league, he'd be getting regular NHL minutes. The Panthers already have a logjam, so why not just let him marinate as an AHL first liner instead of making him struggle to get 8 mins TOI with the big club?
 
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Atas2000 said:
He is already 21 and he sucks. And he never dominated anywhere. And stop pretending like not producing in his D+4 year is expected of a once highly regarded 1st rounder.
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He led all scoring in the 2018-19 junior tournaments.
Kuznetsov didn't become a full-time NHLer until he was 22.
 
Denisenko had 29 points in 43 games in the Russian junior league(MHL) as a draft eligible. If any Canadian, American, Swedish, or Finnish prospect his size and position does that in their respective junior leagues they probably don't even get drafted, maybe with a late pick like Elliot Desnoyers but he was extremely buried on an extremely stacked team.
 
kerrabria said:
Denisenko is progressing pretty much how I would have expected.

Draft+1 Year: Dominating juniors and struggling in the pros
Draft+2 Year: Dominating juniors and doing better in the KHL
Draft+3 Year: Succeeding in the AHL
Draft+4 Year: Lighting up the AHL

Obviously he's not lighting it up, but he's only 21, and he wasted most of last year on the taxi squad, which couldn't have been good for his development.
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He wasn't on taxi squad 'most' of last year. I think you're being too generous with d+3 and d+4 years too. He's slightly over half a ppg ik ahl thus far, and has also struggled with consistency. He's been ok, but far from dominant in the ahl.
 
Dread Clawz said:
Is this another prelude to Russians should stay in the khl until 30? :rolleyes:
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Is this another prelude to Russians should rot in the AHL like Denisenko aka the former 2nd best prospect currently not in the NHL jut a couple of years ago:rolleyes:? Your attempts are pretty funny because the facts are against you as always, but you would die on that rotten hill as always. And as always you would bend facts and get protective over a career that is just falling off the cliff just because the player made a mistake of coming to NA too early.

How about here is just an another addition to a HUGE list of players who amounted to nothing after doing what Denisenko was/is doing. It's a fact. Just like Mamin is a fact. A what? Sixth rounder? He is now a somewhat serviceable NHLer after developing in the KHL. Probably a short peak player who will likely have maybe just a couple of okay seasons in the NHL. But he was from his junior days not a top rated prospect and still made it to that level.
 
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kerrabria said:
Mamin was drafted in the 6th Round at 21-years-old after playing two full KHL seasons. I can't fathom how somebody could compare Mamin and Denisenko's respective draft day prospect status.
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The big difference between the two is Mamin wasn't a top prospect and Denisenko was one. The fact that Mamin was drafted as an overager just adds to that same concept. Other than that Mamin was playing on russian junior NTs. It's not like he came out of nowhere.

It's all about people refusing to admit that the KHL path once again was better for a prospect and put a guy with a very slim outside chance in the NHL. That is all.

Other than that comparing two russian wingers who were drafted by the same team, yeah, that is is completly outlandish:sarcasm: We are all aware of their age and status. As well as why the original post that incited the discussion was written that way. Obviously it is a bit emotional, but it just meant that Mamin has more success with the Panthers now than a former 1st rounder and it was not at all expected of Mamin.

kerrabria said:
At the draft, they literally said he was a long term prospect. Again, he was undersized, had a raw game, didn't speak a lick of English, and he had only played on international ice in a junior league.
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Long term prospect in the 1st? Doesn't mean they don't expect him to perform until he is 24 or something. He was also not undersized or most draftees are at draft day. I wonder if the English argument is going to save the day for you here:sarcasm: Most Russians coming to the NHL don't speak English. Including the ones who are successful right away.

International ice? Do you know it's 2022? Also the intrenational ice argument is compltely bogus no matter how you put it. It hasn't put any restrictions on other russian prospects' game.

And most players play in juniors on draft day, so what's your point here? Sounds like you are desperate for anything.

kerrabria said:
He isn't in the NHL yet because of how loaded Florida is at forward.
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Mamin is in the NHL. Is Mamin that good or is Florida not that loaded after all?

kerrabria said:
You'll notice that last year, at age 20, he played 7 games, had 4 assists (all even strength), put 6 shots on goal, laid 15 hits, blocked 2 shots, and had a 3:0 takeaway:giveaway ratio.
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Again, you are desperately scrapping from the bottom every stat you can find to support your claim, but at the end of the day he did not have any significant success in the NHL last season.
kerrabria said:
In nearly every organization in the league, he'd be getting regular NHL minutes.
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That is a very bold claim. And I simply don't see that.
kerrabria said:
The Panthers already have a logjam, so why not just let him marinate as an AHL first liner instead of making him struggle to get 8 mins TOI with the big club?
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I would agree if they had the logjam and Denisenko was at least a PPG player in the AHL. But he is behind his peer Dorofeyev who I don't consider doing that great. A year younger overage 21st pick Chinakhov is doing more and in the NHL. 20 year old Podkolzin is ahead of him.

How about we get real? He is not exactly fulfilling the overblown expectations. And his development in the AHL does not exactly look like he is going to break out in the NHL any minute.
 
Atas2000 said:
The big difference between the two is Mamin wasn't a top prospect and Denisenko was one. The fact that Mamin was drafted as an overager just adds to that same concept. Other than that Mamin was playing on russian junior NTs. It's not like he came out of nowhere.

It's all about people refusing to admit that the KHL path once again was better for a prospect and put a guy with a very slim outside chance in the NHL. That is all.

Other than that comparing two russian wingers who were drafted by the same team, yeah, that is is completly outlandish:sarcasm: We are all aware of their age and status. As well as why the original post that incited the discussion was written that way. Obviously it is a bit emotional, but it just meant that Mamin has more success with the Panthers now than a former 1st rounder and it was not at all expected of Mamin.



Long term prospect in the 1st? Doesn't mean they don't expect him to perform until he is 24 or something. He was also not undersized or most draftees are at draft day. I wonder if the English argument is going to save the day for you here:sarcasm: Most Russians coming to the NHL don't speak English. Including the ones who are successful right away.

International ice? Do you know it's 2022? Also the intrenational ice argument is compltely bogus no matter how you put it. It hasn't put any restrictions on other russian prospects' game.

And most players play in juniors on draft day, so what's your point here? Sounds like you are desperate for anything.

Mamin is in the NHL. Is Mamin that good or is Florida not that loaded after all?


Again, you are desperately scrapping from the bottom every stat you can find to support your claim, but at the end of the day he did not have any significant success in the NHL last season.

That is a very bold claim. And I simply don't see that.

I would agree if they had the logjam and Denisenko was at least a PPG player in the AHL. But he is behind his peer Dorofeyev who I don't consider doing that great. A year younger overage 21st pick Chinakhov is doing more and in the NHL. 20 year old Podkolzin is ahead of him.

How about we get real? He is not exactly fulfilling the overblown expectations. And his development in the AHL does not exactly look like he is going to break out in the NHL any minute.
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I'm not gonna waste my time responding to these asinine, contrarian critiques. I'll just simply bump the thread in a few months when Denisenko is having a solid rookie year in the NHL.
 
kerrabria said:
I'm not gonna waste my time responding to these asinine, contrarian critiques. I'll just simply bump the thread in a few months when Denisenko is having a solid rookie year in the NHL.
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So you admit you can't argue against it and fall back into arrogant hidden insults? Well done!:laugh: Way to go to solidify my opinion about HF.

And yes, please come back when future star Denisenko is on the rise in the NHL. Iwon't be waiting.
 
wetcoast said:
Obviously that is a NA problem as well right?

I think sometimes people forget how hard it is to crack a top 6 in the NHL and even more so on a very good team like Florida.
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The Panthers skate a 5th line of
Vatrano-Thornton-Tippett at practice right now.

That would be a very solid 4th line for most teams around the NHL and a 3rd line on some of the bottom feeders.
 
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Well he is scoring 0.6 PPG in the AHL so it doesn't even matter how deep the Panthers are, he isn't an NHL player for any team out there that has warm bodies around.
 
He needs a trade, there is no way he is cracking that planter line-up anytime soon. He could he a good fit in a team like Arizona.
 
This guy had so much hype. 6 points in 16 games as a 22 year old in AHL. I drafted him in my keeper pool and I got him for 7 years. Was pumped when I got him but wow what I let down. Anyone watching him? Is there any hope for him to become the player people thought he was when he was drafted?
 
Outside of his international play, Denisenko has done nothing to justify the hype.
He wasn't even anything special in the MHL.
 
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