Luke Hughes out 6-8 weeks

[PeE eL DuBoiS]

Hughes news if true

 

[Ace]

Good news for the replacement level defensive player who will far exceed what Hughes gives Jersey on the ice in his own end.

 

[Xirik]

Good news for the replacement level defensive player who will far exceed what Hughes gives Jersey on the ice in his own end.

Wrong.

 

[Goptor]

Good news for the replacement level defensive player who will far exceed what Hughes gives Jersey on the ice in his own end.

Thanks for the input, Mrs. Zboril.

 

[nucks88]

The Hughes brothers are brittle

Some of them are......

 

[Pavels Dog]

Good news for the replacement level defensive player who will far exceed what Hughes gives Jersey on the ice in his own end.

Don't slander the 295th best EV Goal differential like that..

 

[MasterofGrond]

Don't slander the 295th best EV Goal differential like that..

can't imagine another critical position of known devils weakness that has an outsized impact on that

 

[Pavels Dog]

can't imagine another critical position of known devils weakness that has an outsized impact on that

..that only affected Luke Hughes

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Don't slander the 295th best EV Goal differential like that..

He was -4 at 5v5, and +9 without Brendan Smith as his partner (48GF 39GA).

Pretty stupid to use ES goal differential, as it includes EN situations.

 

[Wierzbowski426]

He was -4 at 5v5, and +9 without Brendan Smith as his partner (48GF 39GA).

Pretty stupid to use ES goal differential, as it includes EN situations.

Are you familiar with Pavel's body of work?

 

[Pavels Dog]

He was -4 at 5v5, and +9 without Brendan Smith as his partner (48GF 39GA).

Pretty stupid to use ES goal differential, as it includes EN situations.

I wasn't aware EV GD was biased against Luke Hughes, my apologies.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

I wasn't aware EV GD was biased against Luke Hughes, my apologies.

It's biased against players who are used in EN situations that play for teams that end up pulling their goalie a lot. Not sure if you knew this, but it's a lot easier for the opposition to score when your goalie is not in net.

 

[dgibb10]

He was -4 at 5v5, and +9 without Brendan Smith as his partner (48GF 39GA).

Pretty stupid to use ES goal differential, as it includes EN situations.

EV goal differential is good as long as you use a site that doesn't include empty net situations as even strength.

Evolving Hockey doesn't include empty net situations in their even strength numbers

 

[Pavels Dog]

It's biased against players who are used in EN situations that play for teams that end up pulling their goalie a lot. Not sure if you knew this, but it's a lot easier for the opposition to score when your goalie is not in net.

Sorry, I wasn't aware this only applied to Luke Hughes.

Let me edit my post.

"Don't slander the 134th best 5v5 Goal differential like that.."

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Sorry, I wasn't aware this only applied to Luke Hughes.

Well seeing as how the devils played more mins with the goalie pulled than any other team in the league, EN goal differential does disproportionately target Luke.

Let me edit my post.

"Don't slander the 134th best 5v5 Goal differential like that.."

When people criticize Seider, I fully expect you to respond with "don't slander the 153rd best 5v5 goal differential like that"

Luke Hughes 51GF 55GA in 1369 TOI
Moritz Seider 63GF 69GA in 1348 TOI

 

[Pavels Dog]

When people criticize Seider, I fully expect you to respond with "don't slander the 153rd best 5v5 goal differential like that"

Luke Hughes 51GF 55GA in 1369 TOI
Moritz Seider 63GF 69GA in 1348 TOI

Why am I not surprised your only defense is to deflect into a Seider discussion.

Let me just say you completely invalidate any attempt at being perceived as someone who understands analytics or context for numbers when you attempt to put Seider and Hughes on the same level.

 

[HeadLiceHatty]

I’ve hated jersey since I was a kid as a long time flyers fan, but some of the comments about a kid getting an injury are pretty gross. Hope he recovers and is healthy the full year, shoulder injuries suck.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Why am I not surprised your only defense is to deflect into a Seider discussion.

No need to deflect, Hughes is a tremendous young defenseman.

Let me just say you completely invalidate any attempt at being perceived as someone who understands analytics or context for numbers when you attempt to put Seider and Hughes on the same level.

I'm not the one using 5v5 goal differential as the core identifier of a player.

It's also quite laughable watching you call for context now that your own argument has been turned against you.

 

[Pavels Dog]

I'm not the one using 5v5 goal differential as the core identifier of a player.

I didn't, and I don't. But so far your counter to Ace's comment about Hughes consists of "empty net goals are biased against him" and "But Seider!", neither of which are amazing arguments and neither of which actually adresses what he said. Especially if we are to believe the mainstream opinion around here that Seider is a replacement level d-man.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

I didn't, and I don't.

But you did.

But so far your counter to Ace's comment about Hughes consists of "empty net goals are biased against him" and "But Seider!", neither of which are amazing arguments and neither of which actually adresses what he said.

I addressed what you said, which was fundamentally stupid.

If Hughes' goal differential proves him to be such a liability, what does that make Seider?

Especially if we are to believe the mainstream opinion around here that Seider is a replacement level d-man.

Seider is an excellent young defenseman, just like Luke.

 

[Pavels Dog]

But you did.

I addressed what you said, which was fundamentally stupid.

If Hughes' goal differential proves him to be such a liability, what does that make Seider?


Seider is an excellent young defenseman, just like Luke.

Not sure why you're fine with what Ace said but a simple stat triggers you so much. Hughes is a great young d-man but arguing that he doesn't have flaws defensively is a losing battle imo. Seider has them too, if you insist on that meaningless comparison. Brock Faber too, if he's relevant.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Not sure why you're fine with what Ace said but a simple stat triggers you so much.

Because you actually tried to support it with a stupid statistic.

Hughes is a great young d-man but arguing that he doesn't have flaws defensively is a losing battle imo. Seider has them too, if you insist on that meaningless comparison. Brock Faber too, if he's relevant.

Who said he doesn't have flaws? He's a 21 year old dman, they never come flawless. But he's still really good, especially for his age.

 

[TheDawnOfANewTage]

Players are pushed too hard to stay engaged 12 months of the year. Preseason injuries used to be a rarity unless someone was in a car accident or something. Now these guys are finishing the season in mid June, working out for 3 months, and jumping right back into training camps by mid September. Prospects have it even worse with summer tourneys and development camps.

It’s over-intensive and no surprise that people’s bodies break down as a result.

Disagree, I think they’re training harder and smarter for a faster, more dangerous league. Fitness and training are taken so much more seriously now, and so much more is known, but we’re seeing guys retire with hip, knee, shoulder, and head issues. Accidents just happen along the way- you could reduce the offseason injuries to 0 by having ‘em all have mandated vacations, but I think the season would be very ugly in all ways, injuries included.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Disagree, I think they’re training harder and smarter for a faster, more dangerous league. Fitness and training are taken so much more seriously now, and so much more is known, but we’re seeing guys retire with hip, knee, shoulder, and head issues. Accidents just happen along the way- you could reduce the offseason injuries to 0 by having ‘em all have mandated vacations, but I think the season would be very ugly in all ways, injuries included.

Speed of the game is a whole other issue and yes, it’s probably too fast in some ways. We’ve seen interference creep back into forechecking and the main reason offered for the lack of rule enforcement is safety. Much like the NFL’s issue with kick returns, players going balls-to-the-wall and colliding with each other isn’t a sustainable way to play.

Part of it is rosters being too big. It’s taken for granted that 30 second shifts are a good thing because everyone likes seeing players go fast, but do we actually enjoy seeing random drones sprinting up and down the ice for 40 minutes? The game would be better with about 5 fewer players on the roster, for recognizability and also for slowing things down and letting people see the stick skills and agility that can happen at slower speeds. But we’re stuck with this game unless something dramatic happens with the CBA (the NHL had a chance to improve this when new teams were added, but AFAIK it wasn’t even considered).

So you get a league where players feel they have to be ready in mid September to blast off at full Pavel Bure speed for meaningless scrimmages in September. Which means intensive summer training, which means joints break down faster and faster. It’s little different than all the goalies who retire with hip injuries because they just have to butterfly on every save, even though this is terrible for the joints and ultimately leads to missed games and seasons.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Speed of the game is a whole other issue and yes, it’s probably too fast in some ways. We’ve seen interference creep back into forechecking and the main reason offered for the lack of rule enforcement is safety. Much like the NFL’s issue with kick returns, players going balls-to-the-wall and colliding with each other isn’t a sustainable way to play.

Part of it is rosters being too big. It’s taken for granted that 30 second shifts are a good thing because everyone likes seeing players go fast, but do we actually enjoy seeing random drones sprinting up and down the ice for 40 minutes? The game would be better with about 5 fewer players on the roster, for recognizability and also for slowing things down and letting people see the stick skills and agility that can happen at slower speeds. But we’re stuck with this game unless something dramatic happens with the CBA (the NHL had a chance to improve this when new teams were added, but AFAIK it wasn’t even considered).

So you get a league where players feel they have to be ready in mid September to blast off at full Pavel Bure speed for meaningless scrimmages in September. Which means intensive summer training, which means joints break down faster and faster. It’s little different than all the goalies who retire with hip injuries because they just have to butterfly on every save, even though this is terrible for the joints and ultimately leads to missed games and seasons.

The game would be worse removing 5 players, ie 4th line of forwards and 3rd pairing D. That would be more taxing on the players.

Watching NFL kickoffs looks stupid now, what’s next flag football.